electrodes

[Guest guest]

,

I've been using Grass electrodes for a while and love them. I have no

problem clipping them to the ears...You don't need to make a " mound " of the

conductive paste with the ears, maybe that's the problem you're having.? I

think the quality of the gold electrodes are best in my opinion; I've had no

troubles so far.

[Guest guest]

,

I've not used the Grass electrodes but saw others use them at one of

Pete's trainings. Paste goes in both cups not mounded just enough to

keep the metal from making contact with the earlobe.

I also got tired of the flaking gold. I ordered some cast

electrodes in silver from MVAP medical and have not had any trouble

with flaking on them. The surface is a little rougher and that may

make some difference. The cast electrodes have the same diameter cup

but a a bit deeper. The BMr electrodes as stamped out metal then

plated.

MVAP did not have cast silver earclips so I ordered the regular

stamped silver plated ones, they look just like the BMr ones (except

for the silver) and I suspect that they are made by the same people

(IMA electronics in FLA) but I have had no problem at all with

flaking. It could be that the silver is less prone to flaking. I

just talked to the folks at MVAP yesterday to reorder and the fellow

I talked to said they would be selling a new electrode after the 1st

of Feb with a lead coated with teflon, a little thicker lead wire but

much strongerand tangle resistant. The cost will be about $1 per

electrode more than their standard. The cast silver electrodes cost

$5.oo so this seems like a very reasonable price.

I have used the gold plated, cast silver and the electrocap

international tin electrodes. They all work well. The electro cap

tin tend to bend a bit if pinched or twisted, but the strong points

are a nice supple tangle free lead, and comfortable earclip that

works much like a clip on ear ring. They are about $7 per electrode.

I am going to go with the MVAP cast silver with the new leads for my

next set. The ones I have now are still working fine but I hate the

tangled wires and the leads are much like the BMR ones and feel a

little flimsy.

Last year I ordered some flat electrodes and found them hard to work

with. In a flextrode setup they work fine but with paste on the head

or in earclips the flat surface made it very hard to keep them in

place in a stable fashion. I thinkd the cup holds onto the paste

much better.

In an attempt to create a more affordable earclip for myself (I am

thoroughly dedicated to keeping my costs and my fees reasonable) I

went to a store that sells beading and jewelry making supplies and

purchased four clip on earing assemblies. I coverd them with a clear

acrylic coating the insulate the electrode from the clip and use a

bit of super glue to affix a small O ring ( just smaller the the

electode in diameter) to the clip then did the same to affix the

electrode to the O ring. I works great, is very comfortable and the

cost of the supplies ( clip O ring and acrylic cover) was minimal.

The total cost is about $2 per electrode to get a fine functional

earclip rather than the 10 plus dollars that it costs to get a

standard ear clip electrode.

>Hello Group,

>

>I need help from anyone using Grass Telefactor Ear Clip electrodes.

>After using the cheap Brainmaster ones and becoming frustrated with

>the gold plate flaking off so easily, I purchased the Grass ones.

>

>Just got them today, and was only able to use them on 1 of my 8

>clients scheduled. They don't open wide enough to put them on the

>ear lobe easily. How are you getting them on the lobe? How are you

>getting the paste in them? Do you use paste in both cups or just

>one - the front or back? Is the paste mounded up or scraped flat?

>

>While I'm at it, can we discuss the pros and cons of silver vs. gold

>and flat vs. cupped?

>

>Thanks much,

> Griffis

>Anaconda, MT

------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------

[Guest guest]

, :

Great idea, ! I would like to mention that if there are leads

that work better or are preferred, that with a small soldering iron

and a bit of shrink tubing a sound electrical connection can be made

(or repaired). Probably a good idea to do in case of emergency repairs

also! The tubing is available from electronics distributors.

I liked the prices of the Grass [earclip] electrodes - too bad I had

already bought the other ones. I am contemplating buying more cups and

building an automatic switchbox and writing a program to multiplex and

store the data. Which leads to another topic that I shall save for

later.

Best Regards,

Bill

[Guest guest]

Hi electrode experts,

who can give me the company address for the grass electrodes?

Help greatly appreciated, thanks,

Uwe

[Guest guest]

that's great, Bill, thanks a lot!

Uwe

[Guest guest]

I am so impressed with the creativity and ingenuity of the members of this

group. I'd buy your switch box.

Re: Electrodes

>

>

> Bill,

>

> I love the idea about the shrink tubing. It never crossed my mind.

> Being a mostly non technical kind of gu. The last time I touched a

> soldering iron was (I am embarrassed to admit) was 7th grade shop

> class and it was not a pleasant experience.

>

> I would love to hear about the program/switchbox idea. FYI Dr

> Rocatti on this list has developed a switchbox called qeeg data

> switch that accepts 19 leads and has software that will evaluated the

> BMR data and create color topographic maps. You might want to

> contact him.

>

>

>

>

> At 5:57 AM +0000 12/6/02, Bill wrote:

> >, :

> >

> >Great idea, ! I would like to mention that if there are leads

> >that work better or are preferred, that with a small soldering iron

> >and a bit of shrink tubing a sound electrical connection can be made

> >(or repaired). Probably a good idea to do in case of emergency repairs

> >also! The tubing is available from electronics distributors.

> >

> >I liked the prices of the Grass [earclip] electrodes - too bad I had

> >already bought the other ones. I am contemplating buying more cups and

> >building an automatic switchbox and writing a program to multiplex and

> >store the data. Which leads to another topic that I shall save for

> >later.

> >

> >

> >

> >Best Regards,

> >Bill

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Bill et alia,

I ceased repairing electrodes when I realized that the stranded wire forces

hot solder to " wick " up into the wire as I soldered the end of the wire to

the electrode cup. As if to add insult to injury, the combination of tin,

lead, gold, and steel . . . all in the presence of a chemically reactive

electrolyte (aka " paste " ). A freshly repaired connection served fairly well

for a week or two, and then I would have to fix it again because the wire

would simply fracture wherever the solder stopped rising into the wire. The

shrink tubing fails to make a good seal that could keep paste and moisture

away from the connection.

We have changed over to 100% Grass electrodes. Since then, I have not

repaired a single electrode, nor have we experienced any type of electrode

noise. We've probably used each of our sets of Grass electrodes no less

than 100 times so far, and they are all fine.

Dave Myer, Sr.

Boston Neurofeedback

At 05:57 AM 12/6/02 +0000, you wrote:

>, :

>

>Great idea, ! I would like to mention that if there are leads

>that work better or are preferred, that with a small soldering iron

>and a bit of shrink tubing a sound electrical connection can be made

>(or repaired). Probably a good idea to do in case of emergency repairs

>also! The tubing is available from electronics distributors.

>

>I liked the prices of the Grass [earclip] electrodes - too bad I had

>already bought the other ones. I am contemplating buying more cups and

>building an automatic switchbox and writing a program to multiplex and

>store the data. Which leads to another topic that I shall save for

>later.

>

>

>

>Best Regards,

>Bill

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Try this web address (you are online):

http://www.grass-telefactor.com/

I am pleased with their product offering and prices, and will order

my next electrodes from them.

Regarding electrode repair, I agree that the best is factory

original, but in an emergency it doesn't hurt to be able to make a

repair (I spent some time in the test lab and we had to be self-

sufficient!). We would use crimp connectors on the extremely

fine " robotic " wire because it does work great as solder wick. ;-)

Cheers (it's Friday!),

Bill

> Hi electrode experts,

> who can give me the company address for the grass electrodes?

> Help greatly appreciated, thanks,

> Uwe

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Bill,

I love the idea about the shrink tubing. It never crossed my mind.

Being a mostly non technical kind of gu. The last time I touched a

soldering iron was (I am embarrassed to admit) was 7th grade shop

class and it was not a pleasant experience.

I would love to hear about the program/switchbox idea. FYI Dr

Rocatti on this list has developed a switchbox called qeeg data

switch that accepts 19 leads and has software that will evaluated the

BMR data and create color topographic maps. You might want to

contact him.

At 5:57 AM +0000 12/6/02, Bill wrote:

>, :

>

>Great idea, ! I would like to mention that if there are leads

>that work better or are preferred, that with a small soldering iron

>and a bit of shrink tubing a sound electrical connection can be made

>(or repaired). Probably a good idea to do in case of emergency repairs

>also! The tubing is available from electronics distributors.

>

>I liked the prices of the Grass [earclip] electrodes - too bad I had

>already bought the other ones. I am contemplating buying more cups and

>building an automatic switchbox and writing a program to multiplex and

>store the data. Which leads to another topic that I shall save for

>later.

>

>

>

>Best Regards,

>Bill

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

, I use a popcicle stick to apply the paste to the earclips.

Electrodes

Hello Group,

I need help from anyone using Grass Telefactor Ear Clip electrodes. After

using the cheap Brainmaster ones and becoming frustrated with the gold plate

flaking off so easily, I purchased the Grass ones.

Just got them today, and was only able to use them on 1 of my 8 clients

scheduled. They don't open wide enough to put them on the ear lobe easily. How

are you getting them on the lobe? How are you getting the paste in them? Do

you use paste in both cups or just one - the front or back? Is the paste

mounded up or scraped flat?

While I'm at it, can we discuss the pros and cons of silver vs. gold and flat

vs. cupped?

Thanks much,

Griffis

Anaconda, MT

[Guest guest]

,

I have just got into the Brainmaster a month ago. As soon as I saw the

product line and the philosophy behind QEEG, I thought to build a switch box

(re. my early conversations w/ ). Turns out I was late to the party,

and there is a product or at least a project out there. Rats! My idea was to

use analog switches controlled via the parallel port to multiplex the

various sites to the two channels. The software would know the switch setup

and store the data with channel information so a program could then put the

data into whatever format the mapping software/services require. This would

still be at 120 samples per second. I also have another idea that I want to

discuss with Tom C. offline first.

What I wondered was is:

1. How long of an epoch should be used to get a snapshot for each site, and

2. Given the dynamic nature of the map, how much time can be allowed to pass

for acquisition of the whole head?

3. In reality, how fast does the map vary, relative to diagnosis. (how long

can you spend taking the data from various points?). I have heard thet

Thatcher determined that it works quite well. Cool!

4. Is this directly correlatable with the normative database? I guess so,

maybe following some transform.

Given the cost, we did not do a Q, rather a multi-point assessment. No

thanks to the insurance company. Therefore I thought " let me collect my own

Q data... " , and the idea for an automatic switchbox came up.

To assist the assessment, I think that I would like to get the 5-test

license TOVA test. I think it is only $25 for a 5 test limit (saw that on

the web somewhere). I cannot at this time afford the unlimited license!

---> , do you have the TOVA available? We could just visit you.

Thanks for the reply,

Bill

Re: Electrodes

Bill,

I love the idea about the shrink tubing. It never crossed my mind.

Being a mostly non technical kind of gu. The last time I touched a

soldering iron was (I am embarrassed to admit) was 7th grade shop

class and it was not a pleasant experience.

I would love to hear about the program/switchbox idea. FYI Dr

Rocatti on this list has developed a switchbox called qeeg data

switch that accepts 19 leads and has software that will evaluated the

BMR data and create color topographic maps. You might want to

contact him.

At 5:57 AM +0000 12/6/02, Bill wrote:

>, :

>

>Great idea, ! I would like to mention that if there are leads

>that work better or are preferred, that with a small soldering iron

>and a bit of shrink tubing a sound electrical connection can be made

>(or repaired). Probably a good idea to do in case of emergency repairs

>also! The tubing is available from electronics distributors.

>

>I liked the prices of the Grass [earclip] electrodes - too bad I had

>already bought the other ones. I am contemplating buying more cups and

>building an automatic switchbox and writing a program to multiplex and

>store the data. Which leads to another topic that I shall save for

>later.

>

>

>

>Best Regards,

>Bill

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

No! !

I will send my lawyers!!!!

No NO!!!

Also you cant talk about this,!

I have a patent that say that you CANT THINK of this!!!

Yes Be careful!

Otherwise....backchannel, attorney, sue-----> problems!!!

Ja!

Just being stupid!

Ciao!!!!!

Re: Electrodes

Bill,

I love the idea about the shrink tubing. It never crossed my mind.

Being a mostly non technical kind of gu. The last time I touched a

soldering iron was (I am embarrassed to admit) was 7th grade shop

class and it was not a pleasant experience.

I would love to hear about the program/switchbox idea. FYI Dr

Rocatti on this list has developed a switchbox called qeeg data

switch that accepts 19 leads and has software that will evaluated the

BMR data and create color topographic maps. You might want to

contact him.

At 5:57 AM +0000 12/6/02, Bill wrote:

>, :

>

>Great idea, ! I would like to mention that if there are leads

>that work better or are preferred, that with a small soldering iron

>and a bit of shrink tubing a sound electrical connection can be made

>(or repaired). Probably a good idea to do in case of emergency repairs

>also! The tubing is available from electronics distributors.

>

>I liked the prices of the Grass [earclip] electrodes - too bad I had

>already bought the other ones. I am contemplating buying more cups and

>building an automatic switchbox and writing a program to multiplex and

>store the data. Which leads to another topic that I shall save for

>later.

>

>

>

>Best Regards,

>Bill

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Bill:

I am Dr. Rocatti and have a device that may " challenge yours " ..... first of all

don't be scared!...I am not going to sue you, or sent to you my sharks... only

to protect you. If your device is better than mine, I will buy one from you! We

are looking for science, cheap Qeeg for all. good treatments as less expensive

for all so may morepeople can take benefit from Neurofeedback and Qeeg.

We must strive for the development of transparence, scientific friendship and

professional honor.

You must know that if you talk so openly on a public list of the details of your

device, you might loose your future right to Patent your Device.

So don't talk about details! And be careful to whom you talk.

We don't know if the pool is clean of stealth sharks yet!

Talk if you want with no tech details. Only do that in backchannel and with

friends you REALLY KNOW and are TRUSTWORTHY....otherwise may be some day some

miserable guy will sue you because you have finally builted your creation! That

now is his....creation....stolen to you!!

Warm regards

Re: Electrodes

Bill,

I love the idea about the shrink tubing. It never crossed my mind.

Being a mostly non technical kind of gu. The last time I touched a

soldering iron was (I am embarrassed to admit) was 7th grade shop

class and it was not a pleasant experience.

I would love to hear about the program/switchbox idea. FYI Dr

Rocatti on this list has developed a switchbox called qeeg data

switch that accepts 19 leads and has software that will evaluated the

BMR data and create color topographic maps. You might want to

contact him.

At 5:57 AM +0000 12/6/02, Bill wrote:

>, :

>

>Great idea, ! I would like to mention that if there are leads

>that work better or are preferred, that with a small soldering iron

>and a bit of shrink tubing a sound electrical connection can be made

>(or repaired). Probably a good idea to do in case of emergency repairs

>also! The tubing is available from electronics distributors.

>

>I liked the prices of the Grass [earclip] electrodes - too bad I had

>already bought the other ones. I am contemplating buying more cups and

>building an automatic switchbox and writing a program to multiplex and

>store the data. Which leads to another topic that I shall save for

>later.

>

>

>

>Best Regards,

>Bill

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, , and maybe we will find out if, indeed, it is worth doing a Q at

all. Tis the season to be superstitious!

Re: Electrodes

Bill,

I love the idea about the shrink tubing. It never crossed my mind.

Being a mostly non technical kind of gu. The last time I touched a

soldering iron was (I am embarrassed to admit) was 7th grade shop

class and it was not a pleasant experience.

I would love to hear about the program/switchbox idea. FYI Dr

Rocatti on this list has developed a switchbox called qeeg data

switch that accepts 19 leads and has software that will evaluated the

BMR data and create color topographic maps. You might want to

contact him.

At 5:57 AM +0000 12/6/02, Bill wrote:

>, :

>

>Great idea, ! I would like to mention that if there are leads

>that work better or are preferred, that with a small soldering iron

>and a bit of shrink tubing a sound electrical connection can be made

>(or repaired). Probably a good idea to do in case of emergency repairs

>also! The tubing is available from electronics distributors.

>

>I liked the prices of the Grass [earclip] electrodes - too bad I had

>already bought the other ones. I am contemplating buying more cups and

>building an automatic switchbox and writing a program to multiplex and

>store the data. Which leads to another topic that I shall save for

>later.

>

>

>

>Best Regards,

>Bill

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear ,

As I talked in other list the use of 1 Big Q is Useless.

It has already been proven that client that had undergone big QEEG, that is big

in number of channels and big in cost for the client, and have been treated

accoring to his, some has gone very bad, some were useless.

In the data some USA fellow gives me there is a cost going from 300 U$D to 1000

U$S.

I see no reason do to only a QEEG to establish the sites of treatment!!

The subyestive Asessment of Assessment , wixed with thr Objective One is

something outstanding, new, very creative and acurate. We are trying to reñate

the topos of Qeeg Data Switch to his two Assessments. Ten choose the placements.

We are becoming a little phrenological.

I have no problem with other placements , as I have aslo no problem with your

(Protocol...I know you don't like this word) C3 (CZ ground) C4 , for me is more

simple to use Cz .I am a very lazy guy.

I had experienced the most beautiful states of mind using your SMR up Theta

down. But I hav eto setup SMR 13 to 15, otherwise I got sleepy or little bored

in the way to become indiferent or depressive.

Beta in C4 is not for me is like Cafeine.

With the concep to Qeeg and jining the TLC both subjective and Objective

Assessment, I see the possibility of studying and research , and the most

important to make a LOT OF FALLOW UP, with a monthly Qeeg, that may cost only

50 U$S for the client.Or If you have a insane need to know what is going on in

the brain, like me, you can so it for free, no big deal!

Is beautiful to see a guy with a Topo of delta, with all his frontal lobe full

of high delta power with eyes closed (All Red Color), and then you see how it

reduces as open the eyes more than 50 % and then you give him to count numbers

backwards and the Prefrontal cortex, that before was full of of high Delta Power

(Lot of red color), becomes green and light yellow. And with Alpha and theta you

may discovered the same functional changes but with other patterns and issues or

better to say, under other tasks.

We do a Qeeg of 40 minutes with eyes closes, eyes open and a speial task for

each 10/20 site.

I have the fortune to take a shot to the famous Theta2 that is in Cz to frontal

sites to the left (Describes in the works of Dr Marvin Sams in relation to

Tetris Game) (www.greatbrain.com...)

Well the thing is that you are a living fountain of knowledge and I and am

donkey, but very curious, and I want to see once a month how my clients are

going better and how this is relexted in the Qeeg.

How is a OCD, that have his patterns, how is a ADD and if the supposed 5 EEG

types of ADD are real...I Dont kno yet Iwnat to see if thsi si true.

How is the Cingula Rage type. And if porgress, how is the progress.

I like to fallow all that people that practice MEDITATION and in this

Meditation you can see how is the progress of the guy and if there's a relation

to synchrony, IIntrahemispheric and interhemisferic to that spiritual

experiences. There is a work that separates them from Beginers, Intermediate and

Advanced Meditators, and that calsification is done through Qeeg.

I am not saying I create a device for diagnostic, I create a device for

" clinical curuiosity " ...... to make a fallow up and do Clinical

Crosscorrelation after.

At the end of next year I may be done hundreds of Qeeg. Since now I have done

more that 700. And the first important thing I see is that people if not

treated, have always the same TOPOS. So we have an accurate tool.

Other important thing is that I have not to waste 5000 US$ to have the

machine,and 2500U$S for each DataBase!!

Mine is only 700U$D with hardware and software.

For an ignorant like with poor resourses and with clients with poor resourses

also, I see is a very good option. They couls never afford the QEEG big study,

this is for a very few group od selected population.

At the end of the year I will have a very PERSONAL data base, not those Monster

data bases that contradicts each other and that are also very expensive.

I am a simple Dr, with very low resources, and think that a standard clinician

will not send his client to a 500 $ Q or a 1000 $ Q, to do the treatment

later!!! The client just spent the money they have for teh treatment to do the

big QEEG and Then,,,,,,,,,,????

We need cheaper 2 channel EEG devices and cheaper Qeeg Devices also, so this

could be affordable for standard clients.

The cheapest Qeeg there is the Mindset, that is a complete fake.

Why? Because if you don't measure FZ Cz and Pz, they make topos,YES!, but

this topos are a mathematical flaw! The algorithms of a topo that has not in

consideration this derivations (FZ Cz and Pz) is a flaw!!!

And however, you see Dr. Sterman promoting this in his workshops!!!

I was never so scientifically disappointed like at that moment.

I realize this sterman is not the Sterman of the beginning!!!

So I enjoy your output as always and hope ,as we will drop through the

window all big databases and big QEEG machines, that your knowledge be helpful

for us.

We are guys who want to learn, research and and don't want to profit from the

ignorance of people, or of our clients with big $$$$$ studies, or with the sales

of products that are void of .....how can I say.....technical truth or that are

ABSOLUTELLY OVERPRICED!!!

I will send you the Topos as they came out of the oven, and you may also see

many interesting things that may surprise you.

So we need a guy like you for people like us...

Small steps ...for Small feet's.

Is a sacrilege that you may go into that ALREADY wasted for month stupid issue,

still active in other lists,.... " To Q or not to Q " .

Why not to be curious and see what clinical material we can gather , and be

patient to see what stems from it, with clinical crosscorrelations + theh

spectacular subjective TLC and Objective TLC from Pete?

With deep respect, afection and a lot dose of gratitude.

Re: Electrodes

Bill,

I love the idea about the shrink tubing. It never crossed my mind.

Being a mostly non technical kind of gu. The last time I touched a

soldering iron was (I am embarrassed to admit) was 7th grade shop

class and it was not a pleasant experience.

I would love to hear about the program/switchbox idea. FYI Dr

Rocatti on this list has developed a switchbox called qeeg data

switch that accepts 19 leads and has software that will evaluated the

BMR data and create color topographic maps. You might want to

contact him.

At 5:57 AM +0000 12/6/02, Bill wrote:

>, :

>

>Great idea, ! I would like to mention that if there are leads

>that work better or are preferred, that with a small soldering iron

>and a bit of shrink tubing a sound electrical connection can be made

>(or repaired). Probably a good idea to do in case of emergency repairs

>also! The tubing is available from electronics distributors.

>

>I liked the prices of the Grass [earclip] electrodes - too bad I had

>already bought the other ones. I am contemplating buying more cups and

>building an automatic switchbox and writing a program to multiplex and

>store the data. Which leads to another topic that I shall save for

>later.

>

>

>

>Best Regards,

>Bill

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Pete,

thanks for the electrode information.

I hope you had a good trip to your son in Brasil!

Best,

Uwe

[Guest guest]

,

Most of your questions have been answered very well by others. Just a

couple things I would add:

To apply the earclips, grasp the ear itself about 2/3 of the way up in the

cartilage area and lightly pull to stretch the ear.

Open the earclips with finger and thumb of the other hand and place them

over the ear higher up than the lobe, where you have stretched it out a bit.

Slide the clip down over the lobe and close it when you are over the area

you wish you use.

Squeeze it gently between finger and thumb to seat it.

In most cases, if you use it with folks wearing earrings, it won't be

necessary to remove them. Just don't let the clip touch the earring itself.

If you do choose to remove the earring, do NOT put the earclip over the

hole. You will reduce your contact and your signal quality will often

suffer.

Re: cup vs. flat electrodes. I know there are some who prefer the flat

disks, but I strongly prefer the cups. One of the theoretical points of

electrode placement is that ideally the metal should be about equally

distant from the skin all the way around. How one achieves this with disk

electrodes is beyond me.

I like the Grass gold electrodes because, as others have said, they

literally NEVER wear out! They don't lose their gold. Silver/silver

chloride and tin electrodes are also used (and sworn by) among people whose

opinions I respect. I believe any of these will work fine.

Pete

Electrodes

Hello Group,

I need help from anyone using Grass Telefactor Ear Clip electrodes. After

using the cheap Brainmaster ones and becoming frustrated with the gold plate

flaking off so easily, I purchased the Grass ones.

Just got them today, and was only able to use them on 1 of my 8 clients

scheduled. They don't open wide enough to put them on the ear lobe easily.

How are you getting them on the lobe? How are you getting the paste in

them? Do you use paste in both cups or just one - the front or back? Is

the paste mounded up or scraped flat?

While I'm at it, can we discuss the pros and cons of silver vs. gold and

flat vs. cupped?

Thanks much,

Griffis

Anaconda, MT

---

Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Version: 6.0.417 / Virus Database: 233 - Release Date: 11/8/02

[Guest guest]

Uwe,

This and other related supply information are in the Files section of the

Braintrainer list site (/files).

Pete

Re: Re: Electrodes

Hi electrode experts,

who can give me the company address for the grass electrodes?

Help greatly appreciated, thanks,

Uwe

[Guest guest]

Dear Bill,

I went to the site. I own a Brain Master. What Electrodes would I

request? Which ear piece?

And for Mastoid and/or Fp1, Fpz or Fp2 can I use the adhesive with a male

attachment? If yes, which male attachment? Really appreciate you in put.

Thanks

Diane

At 12:28 PM 12/6/02 +0000, you wrote:

>Try this web address (you are online):

>

>http://www.grass-telefactor.com/

>

>I am pleased with their product offering and prices, and will order

>my next electrodes from them.

>

>Regarding electrode repair, I agree that the best is factory

>original, but in an emergency it doesn't hurt to be able to make a

>repair (I spent some time in the test lab and we had to be self-

>sufficient!). We would use crimp connectors on the extremely

>fine " robotic " wire because it does work great as solder wick. ;-)

>

>Cheers (it's Friday!),

>Bill

>

>

> > Hi electrode experts,

> > who can give me the company address for the grass electrodes?

> > Help greatly appreciated, thanks,

> > Uwe

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Diane,

The head leads are E5G-H and the earleads are E34D-G. The G stands for Gold

plated, which is the type I always get. The head leads will work for any

site including mastoid or forehead.

Unless you have a VERY old BrainMaster, you will need Female end connectors

(the pin is in the plug on the BrainMaster). The male/female has only to do

with the plug end which connects the electrode to the BrainMaster.

Not sure I understand the adhesive question. You can use 10/20 paste with

all of these electrodes.

BTW, I usually get 48 inch wires.

pete

Re: Re: Electrodes

Dear Bill,

I went to the site. I own a Brain Master. What Electrodes would I

request? Which ear piece?

And for Mastoid and/or Fp1, Fpz or Fp2 can I use the adhesive with a

male

attachment? If yes, which male attachment? Really appreciate you in

put.

Thanks

Diane

At 12:28 PM 12/6/02 +0000, you wrote:

>Try this web address (you are online):

>

>http://www.grass-telefactor.com/

>

>I am pleased with their product offering and prices, and will order

>my next electrodes from them.

>

>Regarding electrode repair, I agree that the best is factory

>original, but in an emergency it doesn't hurt to be able to make a

>repair (I spent some time in the test lab and we had to be self-

>sufficient!). We would use crimp connectors on the extremely

>fine " robotic " wire because it does work great as solder wick. ;-)

>

>Cheers (it's Friday!),

>Bill

>

>

> > Hi electrode experts,

> > who can give me the company address for the grass electrodes?

> > Help greatly appreciated, thanks,

> > Uwe

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Thanks. I'll order what you recommended. See you in January.

Diane

At 06:12 PM 12/23/02 -0500, you wrote:

>Diane,

>

>The head leads are E5G-H and the earleads are E34D-G. The G stands for Gold

>plated, which is the type I always get. The head leads will work for any

>site including mastoid or forehead.

>

>Unless you have a VERY old BrainMaster, you will need Female end connectors

>(the pin is in the plug on the BrainMaster). The male/female has only to do

>with the plug end which connects the electrode to the BrainMaster.

>

>Not sure I understand the adhesive question. You can use 10/20 paste with

>all of these electrodes.

>

>BTW, I usually get 48 inch wires.

>

>pete

> Re: Re: Electrodes

>

>

> Dear Bill,

> I went to the site. I own a Brain Master. What Electrodes would I

> request? Which ear piece?

> And for Mastoid and/or Fp1, Fpz or Fp2 can I use the adhesive with a

>male

> attachment? If yes, which male attachment? Really appreciate you in

>put.

> Thanks

> Diane

>

>

> At 12:28 PM 12/6/02 +0000, you wrote:

> >Try this web address (you are online):

> >

> >http://www.grass-telefactor.com/

> >

> >I am pleased with their product offering and prices, and will order

> >my next electrodes from them.

> >

> >Regarding electrode repair, I agree that the best is factory

> >original, but in an emergency it doesn't hurt to be able to make a

> >repair (I spent some time in the test lab and we had to be self-

> >sufficient!). We would use crimp connectors on the extremely

> >fine " robotic " wire because it does work great as solder wick. ;-)

> >

> >Cheers (it's Friday!),

> >Bill

> >

> >

> > > Hi electrode experts,

> > > who can give me the company address for the grass electrodes?

> > > Help greatly appreciated, thanks,

> > > Uwe

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Gordon,

If I am going to use them again within a few hours, I simply use a Q-tip to

remove the paste and clean them up, then an alcohol pad to clean off the

residue and " disinfect " them.

If I can leave them for a number of hours before re-using them, I hold them

close to the cup between finger and thumb (to cover the wires) and use a

toothbrush under warm running water to clean them out. On occasions, when

using water-cleaned electrodes recently after cleaning, I've seen unusual

signals, so I avoid using them until they've dried out.

Pete

Electrodes

Pete,

Is there an easy, quick, good way to clean the Ten20 paste out of the

electrodes?

[Guest guest]

Gordon,

We find that hot water is the best method.

Run it as hot as possible, and hold the

electrodes underneath. You can also soak

them for a couple of minutes in the hot water

in a glass, then follow with a hot rinse.

10-20 paste is completely water soluble,

and hot water makes it thin out, melt,

and run off the surfaces. Then dry them

completely. They can be ready to re-use

in 15 minutes to 1/2 hour.

I do not recommend using alcohol, as it attacks

the gold plating, leading to eventual wear-off. If

you stick with hot water, electrodes will last

for months and years.

We also do not find it necessary to scrub them.

Again, this wears on the surface, and is unnecessary.

Tom

Electrodes

>

> Pete,

>

> Is there an easy, quick, good way to clean the Ten20 paste out of the

> electrodes?

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Pete,

I went to the site and was confused. Do I get the FD E5G or

the FH E5G- or F-E5G. What are the differences?

Diane

At 06:12 PM 12/23/2002 -0500, you wrote:

Diane,

The head leads are E5G-H and the earleads are E34D-G. The G stands

for Gold

plated, which is the type I always get. The head leads will work

for any

site including mastoid or forehead.

Unless you have a VERY old BrainMaster, you will need Female end

connectors

(the pin is in the plug on the BrainMaster). The male/female has

only to do

with the plug end which connects the electrode to the BrainMaster.

Not sure I understand the adhesive question. You can use 10/20

paste with

all of these electrodes.

BTW, I usually get 48 inch wires.

pete

Re: Re: Electrodes

Dear Bill,

I went to the site. I own a Brain Master. What

Electrodes would I

request? Which ear piece?

And for Mastoid and/or Fp1, Fpz or Fp2 can I use the

adhesive with a

male

attachment? If yes, which male attachment?

Really appreciate you in

put.

Thanks

Diane

At 12:28 PM 12/6/02 +0000, you wrote:

>Try this web address (you are online):

>

>http://www.grass-telefactor.com/

>

>I am pleased with their product offering and prices, and will

order

>my next electrodes from them.

>

>Regarding electrode repair, I agree that the best is

factory

>original, but in an emergency it doesn't hurt to be able to

make a

>repair (I spent some time in the test lab and we had to be

self-

>sufficient!). We would use crimp connectors on the

extremely

>fine " robotic " wire because it does work great as

solder wick. ;-)

>

>Cheers (it's Friday!),

>Bill

>

>

> > Hi electrode experts,

> > who can give me the company address for the grass

electrodes?

> > Help greatly appreciated, thanks,

> > Uwe

> >

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Soory I come in to

Diane, are they for the QDS?

Re: Re: Electrodes Dear Bill, I went to the site. I own a Brain Master. What Electrodes would I request? Which ear piece? And for Mastoid and/or Fp1, Fpz or Fp2 can I use the adhesive with amale attachment? If yes, which male attachment? Really appreciate you input. Thanks Diane At 12:28 PM 12/6/02 +0000, you wrote: >Try this web address (you are online): > >http://www.grass-telefactor.com/ > >I am pleased with their product offering and prices, and will order >my next electrodes from them. > >Regarding electrode repair, I agree that the best is factory >original, but in an emergency it doesn't hurt to be able to make a >repair (I spent some time in the test lab and we had to be self- >sufficient!). We would use crimp connectors on the extremely >fine "robotic" wire because it does work great as solder wick. ;-) > >Cheers (it's Friday!), >Bill > > > > Hi electrode experts, > > who can give me the company address for the grass electrodes? > > Help greatly appreciated, thanks, > > Uwe > > > > > >