Re: Re: Conductive Fabrics

[Guest guest]

In message <cb0k7m+4thdeGroups>, bobluhrs@... writes

>This might be useful for all sorts of electrodes that have to touch

>skin, possibly eliminating some hot spots.  Cloth is not conductive,

>normally and once it begins to dry a bit here and there develops hot

>spots where it's wetter.

There's another factor for the hotspots. If DC is applied to skin it

tends to choose the shortest path, which is through either an area of

damaged skin (not fun for those with eczema) or if the DC is applied for

a modest length of time it causes a tiny spot of electrolytically

damaged skin cells. If this " spot " is rubbed it seems to liberate the

damaged tissue and a close inspection with a handheld microscope (a la

Radio Shack) shows a little hole through into the juicy conductive

flesh.

This seems to be the effect referred to as " burns " although it's really

just cellular damage. This will heal up as a spot would usually do, but

it does mean that it's uncomfortable to use an electrode over that area.

--

Clive

http://www.bigclive.com

[Guest guest]

Yeah I found tha you can detect those spots visually by the skin turnig

slightly yellow just before that.

If I see the yellow skin I stop.

V

Re: Re: Conductive Fabrics

In message <cb0k7m+4thdeGroups>, bobluhrs@... writes

>This might be useful for all sorts of electrodes that have to touch

>skin, possibly eliminating some hot spots. Cloth is not conductive,

>normally and once it begins to dry a bit here and there develops hot

>spots where it's wetter.

There's another factor for the hotspots. If DC is applied to skin it

tends to choose the shortest path, which is through either an area of

damaged skin (not fun for those with eczema) or if the DC is applied for

a modest length of time it causes a tiny spot of electrolytically

damaged skin cells. If this " spot " is rubbed it seems to liberate the

damaged tissue and a close inspection with a handheld microscope (a la

Radio Shack) shows a little hole through into the juicy conductive

flesh.

This seems to be the effect referred to as " burns " although it's really

just cellular damage. This will heal up as a spot would usually do, but

it does mean that it's uncomfortable to use an electrode over that area.

--

Clive

http://www.bigclive.com

The group's main page has a menu to the left, with photos of Godzilla

devices and other things useful in research. These are free to members.

Membership is free, but you agree to be on your own, not take our freedom of

speech as medical advice. We are not doctors! Repeat, we are ordinary lay

people, not experts, not healthy officials, or geniuses of any kind. The

information on this group is not intended as medical advice. Most group

members are NOT doctors or health authorities. Please do not request

medical advice, lest anyone get into trouble out of human compassion. There

are huge fines and issues currently involved with unlicensed medical advice.

The group is only here to share experiences according to the theme of the

group, namely testing if electrical stimulus might inactivate microbes, as

it seems to have done in the Einstein Medical College labs. We are

interested in your results, but cannot say anything about repeatability, or

whether this might have medical benefits. Thanks, for your understanding,

good luck researching. --bG

[Guest guest]

I have found that using one tens electrode on the top of each foot is

painless and causes no skin problems.

The effects on skin can be a real show-stopper, so perhaps it's wise

to limit the time and current in a given spot and use several spots

per session rather than just one. That way the areas can normalize

chemically before any damage to underlying skin cells occurs.

If using for an hour on wrists, perhaps half hour on wrists, and

half hour on ankles would be better, as an example.

bG

> Yeah I found tha you can detect those spots visually by the skin

turnig

> slightly yellow just before that.

> If I see the yellow skin I stop.

> V

> Re: Re: Conductive Fabrics

>

>

> In message <cb0k7m+4thd@e...>, bobluhrs@m... writes

> >This might be useful for all sorts of electrodes that have to

touch

> >skin, possibly eliminating some hot spots. Cloth is not

conductive,

> >normally and once it begins to dry a bit here and there develops

hot

> >spots where it's wetter.

>

> There's another factor for the hotspots. If DC is applied to skin

it

> tends to choose the shortest path, which is through either an area

of

> damaged skin (not fun for those with eczema) or if the DC is

applied for

> a modest length of time it causes a tiny spot of electrolytically

> damaged skin cells. If this " spot " is rubbed it seems to liberate

the

> damaged tissue and a close inspection with a handheld microscope

(a la

> Radio Shack) shows a little hole through into the juicy conductive

> flesh.

>

> This seems to be the effect referred to as " burns " although it's

really

> just cellular damage. This will heal up as a spot would usually

do, but

> it does mean that it's uncomfortable to use an electrode over that

area.

>

> --

> Clive

> http://www.bigclive.com

>

>

>

>

> The group's main page has a menu to the left, with photos of

Godzilla

> devices and other things useful in research. These are free to

members.

> Membership is free, but you agree to be on your own, not take our

freedom of

> speech as medical advice. We are not doctors! Repeat, we are

ordinary lay

> people, not experts, not healthy officials, or geniuses of any

kind. The

> information on this group is not intended as medical advice. Most

group

> members are NOT doctors or health authorities. Please do not

request

> medical advice, lest anyone get into trouble out of human

compassion. There

> are huge fines and issues currently involved with unlicensed

medical advice.

> The group is only here to share experiences according to the theme

of the

> group, namely testing if electrical stimulus might inactivate

microbes, as

> it seems to have done in the Einstein Medical College labs. We are

> interested in your results, but cannot say anything about

repeatability, or

> whether this might have medical benefits. Thanks, for your

understanding,

> good luck researching. --bG

>

[Guest guest]

In message <cb71k1+o9cneGroups>, bobluhrs@... writes

>The effects on skin can be a real show-stopper, so perhaps it's wise

>to limit the time and current in a given spot and use several spots

>per session rather than just one.  That way the areas can normalize

>chemically before any damage to underlying skin cells occurs.

>

>If using for an hour on wrists, perhaps half hour on wrists, and

>half hour on ankles would be better, as an example.

Has anyone considered an electric footbath? This would be two long

plastic containers of water with a mildly salty solution and a stainless

steel electrode in each. This would give a large area of conductance

via the area of the feet, and a long current path up one leg and down

the other.

The electrodes could simply be a small stainless steel nut and bolt

through the plastic troughs below the water level.

Electro therapy and a good foot soak at the same time.

I was going to suggest adding a touch of Potassium Permanganate to the

water for it's anti-fungal and sterilising properties, but I'd be

cautious about the risk of carrying it through the skin by the process

of electroporosis, although it shouldn't be in a sufficient strength to

cause harm. (It's an oxidiser by the way).

--

Clive

http://www.bigclive.com