Re: aching after heated fats

[Guest guest]

Hi .

I picked up on your post because I seem to have a similar thing.

It seems as though every time I change my diet the beggars very quickly adapt to

the change and drag me back down again.

I remember back around two years ago after I had dumped the gluten and dairy I

felt 'wired' for a couple of days - even walked to the local swimming pool, had

a swim and walked back. Two days later I was back in the pit again! Sigh.

Doesn't seem to make any difference what I do, I can't seem to win! The coconut

oil et al does seem to help but although some things are better, in other ways I

feel as though I am going backwards!

Is it Candida - or could it also be something else????

It is early days for me - just over 7 weeks on this specific regime, but I was

already pretty low carb before starting it and have been for over two years and

although all my external symptoms have long been gone or virtually gone, there

are still issues with my digestion and other strange things going on that

started after I went low carb and do not show any sign (yet) of going away.

Ali.

>

> Hiya Bee

> I've been following your programme for about 14 months now (I'm the

nutritionist from London) and educating myself more about the Weston Price

principles, which totally make sense to me.

>

> I have to say that I don't feel as though I am making any progress; things

that seem to help other people help me for a couple of weeks or so (ie had a v

good reaction initially to the rejuvelac but then it just stopped working) then

it's as if the Candida gets the measure of it so to speak; do you know what I

mean? so sometimes I end up sabotaging my diet- it's very hard, because as you

know Candida overgrowth makes you want to eat to keep it alive; sometimes I get

so low as it really has ruled my life for the last 20 years or so, and caused my

Chronic Fatigue and low immunity. the main thing for me lately has been terrible

adrenal symptoms- awful adrenaline rushing around my body and making everything

hurt. I find some things like EFT and self-hypnosis are good for this.

>

> Anyway, I can cope with that. What I was really emailing about was the fact

that my liver doesn't seem to be coping at all well with any kind of heated fat

(and these are sat fats like ghee, goose fat, palm oil and coconut fat). After I

eat even a small amount my legs ache like crazy for hours afterwards. It seems

to be ok for the first half of my cycle then when my period is due everything

seems to 'back up' and my liver just can't cope (my periods are also always at

least 10 days late, with everything worsening the later it gets). I can't do

coffee enemas as they exhaust my adrenals way too much. I am despairing of

finding a way to cleanse my liver.

>

> I can still eat the fats, just add them in once everything is cooked, I

suppose. But I do worry- why should my liver be reacting this sensitively a year

into the diet? I think I'm just worrying that everything is getting worse. It's

so hard to stay positive sometimes.

>

> thanks

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hello ,

Bee is on vacation and will return tomorrow, June 2nd.  Are you saying that your

achy symptoms occur only after heated fat?  Have you tried having the fats

" cold " or unheated?  As you know, fats help to cleanse the body and as such may

bring up healing reactions such as aches & pains.

What do you mean, the sauerkraut has " stopped working " ? Are your digestive

issues worse?

It is quite normal for natural healing to have its ups and downs. As Bee

frequently says, healing is not a straight uphill climb towards health. Just

when you are feeling particularly good or better is a great time for your body

to address any healing issues it needs to, since it has the energy to do so. It

may be that the recommendations you try which seem to help you for only a

limited time fall into this category.

I also was wondering regarding retracing, whether you've experienced such achy

sensations before going on the diet?

Best,

andra, a group moderator

P.S. If it makes you feel any better, my liver only started giving me " symptoms "

after I had been on the diet for almost a year!!

I have to say that I don't feel as though I am making any progress; things that

seem to help other people help me for a couple of weeks or so (ie had a v good

reaction initially to the rejuvelac but then it just stopped working) then it's

as if the Candida gets the measure of it so to speak; do you know what I mean?

<snip>

Anyway, I can cope with that. What I was really emailing about was the fact that

my liver doesn't seem to be coping at all well with any kind of heated fat (and

these are sat fats like ghee, goose fat, palm oil and coconut fat). After I eat

even a small amount my legs ache like crazy for hours afterwards. It seems to be

ok for the first half of my cycle then when my period is due everything seems to

'back up' and my liver just can't cope (my periods are also always at least 10

days late, with everything worsening the later it gets). I can't do coffee

enemas as they exhaust my adrenals way too much. I am despairing of finding a

way to cleanse my liver.

I can still eat the fats, just add them in once everything is cooked, I suppose.

But I do worry- why should my liver be reacting this sensitively a year into the

diet? I think I'm just worrying that everything is getting worse. It's so hard

to stay positive sometimes.

thanks

[Guest guest]

Hello, thanks for the response,

I've actually just eaten lunch and now aching like crazy, and the fats I had (a

little mashed avocado, some unheated palm oil with mackerel and some steamed

veg) weren't even heated.

Thanks for the reassurance- could you expand on what you meant by your liver

'giving you symptoms' after a year on the diet?

It tends to happen in the 2nd half of my cycle before my period, and it's worse

the later my period is (am now 2 weeks late, which sadly has become routine

these last few months) which suggests to me that the liver can't cope with

filtering hormones AND digesting food all at the same time.

But it's a recent phenomenon; I have to say I've no idea what it feels like to

'retrace' as I've never experienced this to my knowledge.

I stopped making the sauerkraut as it really hasn't helped my bowels or

digestion since the first month or so I was on it (was making it consistently

for 6 months). I got a very good reaction at first, but this was brief, and then

things went back to the usual state of play.. ie constipated etc

>

> Hello ,

>

> Bee is on vacation and will return tomorrow, June 2nd.  Are you saying that

your achy symptoms occur only after heated fat?  Have you tried having the fats

" cold " or unheated?  As you know, fats help to cleanse the body and as such may

bring up healing reactions such as aches & pains.

>

> What do you mean, the sauerkraut has " stopped working " ? Are your digestive

issues worse?

>

> It is quite normal for natural healing to have its ups and downs. As Bee

frequently says, healing is not a straight uphill climb towards health. Just

when you are feeling particularly good or better is a great time for your body

to address any healing issues it needs to, since it has the energy to do so. It

may be that the recommendations you try which seem to help you for only a

limited time fall into this category.

>

> I also was wondering regarding retracing, whether you've experienced such achy

sensations before going on the diet?

>

> Best,

> andra, a group moderator

>

> P.S. If it makes you feel any better, my liver only started giving me

" symptoms " after I had been on the diet for almost a year!!

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Hiya Bee

> I've been following your programme for about 14 months now (I'm the

nutritionist from London) and educating myself more about the Weston Price

principles, which totally make sense to me.

>

> I have to say that I don't feel as though I am making any progress; things

that seem to help other people help me for a couple of weeks or so (ie had a v

good reaction initially to the rejuvelac but then it just stopped working) then

it's as if the Candida gets the measure of it so to speak; do you know what I

mean? so sometimes I end up sabotaging my diet- it's very hard, because as you

know Candida overgrowth makes you want to eat to keep it alive; sometimes I get

so low as it really has ruled my life for the last 20 years or so, and caused my

Chronic Fatigue and low immunity. the main thing for me lately has been terrible

adrenal symptoms- awful adrenaline rushing around my body and making everything

hurt. I find some things like EFT and self-hypnosis are good for this.

+++Hi . Remember that any and all symptoms and reactions you get on

this program are because your body is healing itself.

In fact all dis-ease processes are exactly the same as the healing processes,

with the only difference being that you are now progressing towards health

rather than becoming more and more unhealthy because your body is getting what

it needs to heal itself the way Nature intended.

The medical field labels each and every " sign " of poor health as separate

dis-eases or illnesses, instead of calling them what they actually are, i.e.

" signs " the body is working hard at maintaining its health in spite of poor

nutrition, toxins, etc., which means it is trying to heal and detoxify itself.

For reassurance that you are progressing read Retracing, Healing Reactions and

Flare-ups:

http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/heal10.php

There are many things on my program that help your adrenals. Other than diet

and supplements you should do coffee enemas and dry skin brushing or some other

mild form of exercise, i.e. walking or rebounding on a mini trampoline). I

believe that regular deep breathing exercises are very important when you get

symptoms that indicate your body is running on its fight/flight nervous system -

there's a list of symptoms in this article:

http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/breath4.php

>

> Anyway, I can cope with that. What I was really emailing about was the fact

that my liver doesn't seem to be coping at all well with any kind of heated fat

(and these are sat fats like ghee, goose fat, palm oil and coconut fat). After I

eat even a small amount my legs ache like crazy for hours afterwards. It seems

to be ok for the first half of my cycle then when my period is due everything

seems to 'back up' and my liver just can't cope (my periods are also always at

least 10 days late, with everything worsening the later it gets). I can't do

coffee enemas as they exhaust my adrenals way too much. I am despairing of

finding a way to cleanse my liver.

+++Heated good fats wouldn't be any different than unheated since your stomach

would lower or raise the heat of foods naturally as required. The reason your

legs ache is because of detoxifying and healing symptoms which good fats help so

much, and they also cleanse the entire body and increase the health of your

liver so it can do its job better.

+++Coffee enemas would not exhaust your adrenals in any way. They are actually

recommended by alternative cancer clinics to patients who are extremely ill with

cancer.

+++Most women experience more problems because of hormones produced during their

menstrual cycle. Also most women either stop having periods or their cycles

change a lot on this program, but eventually everything normalizes.

>

> I can still eat the fats, just add them in once everything is cooked, I

suppose. But I do worry- why should my liver be reacting this sensitively a year

into the diet? I think I'm just worrying that everything is getting worse. It's

so hard to stay positive sometimes.

+++Does your liver ache or hurt?

All the best, Bee

[Guest guest]

>

> Hi .

>

> I picked up on your post because I seem to have a similar thing.

>

> It seems as though every time I change my diet the beggars very quickly adapt

to the change and drag me back down again.

>

> I remember back around two years ago after I had dumped the gluten and dairy I

felt 'wired' for a couple of days - even walked to the local swimming pool, had

a swim and walked back. Two days later I was back in the pit again! Sigh.

>

> Doesn't seem to make any difference what I do, I can't seem to win! The

coconut oil et al does seem to help but although some things are better, in

other ways I feel as though I am going backwards!

>

> Is it Candida - or could it also be something else????

+++Hi Ali. Candida is the result of poor health, and not the " cause. " That's

why I am re-writing my articles, but it is a big job.

In fact the dis-ease processes are exactly the same as the healing processes,

with the only difference being that you are now progressing towards health

rather than becoming more and more unhealthy.

The medical field labels each and every " sign " of poor health as separate

dis-eases or illnesses, instead of calling them what they actually are, i.e.

" signs " the body is working hard at maintaining its health in spite of poor

nutrition, toxins, etc., which means it is trying to heal and detoxify itself.

Of course if " they " believed the body heals itself they would be teaching people

how to BE healthy, rather than making us sicker.

To feel more secure that you are progressing towards health and not towards

dis-ease read Retracing, Healing Reactions and Flare-ups:

http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/heal10.php

>

> It is early days for me - just over 7 weeks on this specific regime, but I was

already pretty low carb before starting it and have been for over two years and

although all my external symptoms have long been gone or virtually gone, there

are still issues with my digestion and other strange things going on that

started after I went low carb and do not show any sign (yet) of going away.

+++You may have been low-carb for 2 years, but you were not on high good fat

combined with low-carb and moderate protein. High goods fats makes a hugh

difference in helping your body heal and detoxify. Remember that carbs are any

foods not classified as protein and fat, so that includes vegetables.

The best to you, Bee

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I see Bee is back and has addressed your post about aches & pains.

My liver symptoms included pain It happened at almost the exact same time as

I got pain in my spleen and gallbladder, so for a while there I had bad stomach

aches, nausea and upset digestion, but that could also be attributed to the

gallbladder.

All of this was followed by tremendous digestive " flushing " It was a cycle

that repeated itself several times, but now I'm hoping that I've reached my

kidneys in the process of Hering's Law of Cure!

Your period involves a lot of hormonal fluctuation, and for those of us with

adrenal/hormonal issues because of candida, the healing process involves

clearing all of that up as well. Perhaps this is why you have more symptoms in

this part of your cycle.

I had a lot of problems associated with my cycle also - and they have resolved.

All of them. Of course, I didn't have my period for almost 5 months when I

first went on this diet, because every body needs to adjust to the new, healing

conditions.

If you were constipated before you started this diet, your body will retrace it

on the program. It doesn't mean the sauerkraut isn't helping you, because it's

beneficial for digestion in other ways than just " moving things along " in the

intestines.

Best,

andra, a group moderator

>

> Hello, thanks for the response,

> I've actually just eaten lunch and now aching like crazy, and the fats I had

(a little mashed avocado, some unheated palm oil with mackerel and some steamed

veg) weren't even heated.

> Thanks for the reassurance- could you expand on what you meant by your liver

'giving you symptoms' after a year on the diet?

> It tends to happen in the 2nd half of my cycle before my period, and it's

worse the later my period is (am now 2 weeks late, which sadly has become

routine these last few months) which suggests to me that the liver can't cope

with filtering hormones AND digesting food all at the same time.

>

>

> I stopped making the sauerkraut as it really hasn't helped my bowels or

digestion since the first month or so I was on it (was making it consistently

for 6 months). I got a very good reaction at first, but this was brief, and then

things went back to the usual state of play.. ie constipated etc

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Bee. No my liver doesn't hurt, it just feels congested and it takes ages

to digest a meal (perhaps I need to increase the HCl though). I think maybe the

reason I can't tolerate heated fats unlike unheated is because the heat

presumably denatures the poly and mono saturated portion of the animal fats? I

cooked fatty lamb in the casserole the other night and had the same problem, but

am fine if I have lean fish/meat and then add in butter/coconut fat etc

afterwards.

I can't do coffee enemas, no matter what Gerson or others say. I have had

terrible setbacks in the past when I've used these, being unable to sleep for

hours and then experiencing racing adrenalised feelings and palpitations which

then go on for days or sometimes weeks. Surely caffeine absorbed into the portal

vein must enter the general circulation even if only minutely...? It must surely

also be about the person's own ability to detoxify through phase 1 and 2 liver

pathways... Anyway, I certainly can't do them at the moment.

Anyway, I appreciate what you say about dis-ease symptoms also being healing

ones... I shall perservere! The breathing techniques (especially 'belly

breathing' which slows down the sympathetic nervous system) are definitely

helpful.

Best wishes

>

>

> There are many things on my program that help your adrenals. Other than diet

and supplements you should do coffee enemas and dry skin brushing or some other

mild form of exercise, i.e. walking or rebounding on a mini trampoline). I

believe that regular deep breathing exercises are very important when you get

symptoms that indicate your body is running on its fight/flight nervous system -

there's a list of symptoms in this article:

http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/breath4.php

>

> >

[Guest guest]

>

> Thanks Bee. No my liver doesn't hurt, it just feels congested and it takes

ages to digest a meal (perhaps I need to increase the HCl though). I think maybe

the reason I can't tolerate heated fats unlike unheated is because the heat

presumably denatures the poly and mono saturated portion of the animal fats? I

cooked fatty lamb in the casserole the other night and had the same problem, but

am fine if I have lean fish/meat and then add in butter/coconut fat etc

afterwards.

+++If your liver doesn't hurt then why be concerned about it? My liver ached

horribly when I had candida, and coffee enemas greatly relieved it, along with

the program of course.

> I can't do coffee enemas, no matter what Gerson or others say. I have had

terrible setbacks in the past when I've used these, being unable to sleep for

hours and then experiencing racing adrenalised feelings and palpitations which

then go on for days or sometimes weeks. Surely caffeine absorbed into the portal

vein must enter the general circulation even if only minutely...?

+++If you had any kind of setbacks it was caused by detoxification, probably

because you weren't on this kind of program, or maybe because the coffee wasn't

diluted properly, or was the wrong kind of coffee, etc.

+++The coffee doesn't enter general circulation at all, and your body is built

the same as all of us are. You should start with less coffee in the same amount

of water.

It must surely also be about the person's own ability to detoxify through phase

1 and 2 liver pathways... Anyway, I certainly can't do them at the moment.

+++If your liver hurt then you may conclude it can't work through phase 1 and 2,

otherwise it isn't logical.

> Anyway, I appreciate what you say about dis-ease symptoms also being healing

ones... I shall perservere! The breathing techniques (especially 'belly

breathing' which slows down the sympathetic nervous system) are definitely

helpful.

+++That's great!

Bee