One more thing...

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 02/21/2000 2:00:40 PM Eastern Standard Time,

slowens@... writes:

<<

who thinks this company should be ashamed of themselves and that

should get another company to do his distributing >>

totally agree

let's face it... is a goldmine for any video producer and the quality

has not been all that

just look at BL5's audio

Barb

who thinks this company is risking a huge account by its tactics

AKA: POMBarb, Mad-Dame Yenta, Tae-Bo Barb

" You can lead a horse to water but cannot make him drink "

so horsemom2 was the perfect addy for me cuz my son is one stubborn horse

<A HREF= " http://hometown.aol.com/horsemom2/myhomepage/index.html " >Barb's

Places on the web</A>

don't forget to *vote for* this site once a day from each browser

<A HREF= " http://www.stankirsch.com/ " >Stan Kirsch - My Official Website -

Welcome!</A>

[Guest guest]

Mizithra cheese...made from sheeps milk....can we have that? Didn't know if it

was kinda the same as goat cheese.

Coryn

[Guest guest]

<<Mizithra cheese...made from sheeps milk....can we have that? Didn't know

if it was kinda the same as goat cheese.>>

Sheep's milk cheeses of all kinds are neutral for secretors, avoid for us

nonnies.

Dianne in L.A.

O+ nonnie

[Guest guest]

Let me reassure you that I wore casts from the age of 6 months until

I was 10, and suffered NO rib damage at all. I know of any other

cases where this has happened either. It shocks me that

professional, experienced orthos can say this sort of thing....and

as you say, braces can be just as rigid!

Toni xx

> > Hi Nola

> >

> > Does your doctor do casts on any of his patients?

> > Did he tell you his points on if they are good or bad?

> >

> > Our Doctor said he hates them but I don't understand why if they

> are

> > successful...I need to see what other doctor's say about them

and

> > why they will or will not do them

> >

> > Keeping an open mind in all directions and trying to gather

info...

> > to help me make a decision.......

> >

> > Thanks

> >

[Guest guest]

Thanks Toni, I think alot of people needed to hear that. The Ortho Dr.'s here in the U.S. like to scare parents with that. My child had chest wall deformity at the age of 5 months from his 50 degree curve!

Crista

[Guest guest]

Thanks Toni. Its good to hear from adults that have actually lived

with casting successfully.

My little girl is doing fantastically well in her cast, as I knew

she would. It was just reassuring for me (her worried mum) to see a

whole cut out of her cast, for her ribs to grow and not get squashed.

Jacki

> > > Hi Nola

> > >

> > > Does your doctor do casts on any of his patients?

> > > Did he tell you his points on if they are good or bad?

> > >

> > > Our Doctor said he hates them but I don't understand why if

they

> > are

> > > successful...I need to see what other doctor's say about them

> and

> > > why they will or will not do them

> > >

> > > Keeping an open mind in all directions and trying to gather

> info...

> > > to help me make a decision.......

> > >

> > > Thanks

> > >

[Guest guest]

Lida,

It's the $$$! Sounds like a great way to scare a mother though doesn't it?

[Guest guest]

As we all know, scoliosis causes deformity of the chest wall so why do you think

some orthos state that it's the cast that will do that? It must be either (i)

ignorance, or (ii) some self-serving dodginess to do with their career or $.

Lida in London

In an email dated 4/8/2004 3:14:12 pm GMT Daylight time, cristab@... writes:

>

>Thanks Toni, I think alot of people needed to hear that.  The Ortho Dr.'s

>here in the U.S. like to scare parents with that.  My child had chest wall

>deformity at the age of 5 months from his 50 degree curve!

>

>Crista

>

[Guest guest]

You can go to the Hussman site and punch in some info and it will

tell you how many calories you should be eating...

>

> Oh the other thing I just remember: Tonight I plan on spending time

> in the photo area... I will be looking at all the pics to give me

> some more encouragement!!

>

>

> BTW I also got my calories up to 1206 for tomorrow... I plan on

> raising them each week as I go along so eventually I get to around

> 1500-1600... I am not really sure how many I should be eating to

> still lose fat but to also gain muscle... Any ideas?

>

> Okay now to the gym I go... can you tell I am a tad bit hyper

> tonight?!

>

> Juls

[Guest guest]

Does anyone monitor this group? If so do you really want the kind of

venemous, racist, disgusting personal attacks that is viciously pouring

onto

someone expressing their experiences? Will no-one else protest? Is this the

way you all think? Will you allow it to go unchecked? I have had to write to

this person seperately to let them know that this in no way reflects my views

and

that I am appalled, and frankly it makes me sicker than words can even say.

Please people let me know how you feel about this, so that if you all feel this

way I can take my name off of this list. I cannot be party to this kind of

racism and abusive language, nor should anyone have to be. I have received SEVEN

disgusting emails from this morning. Who will stop it?!

[Guest guest]

...

Africa is doing the best they can with the knowledge they have. The fact is, we

helped to f*ck them up pretty badly, with our offers of buying their cash crops

and then abandoning them. Rich white people like poor brown people to do the

dirty work.

And we're not taking care of our own. We've doen better because we're a rich

and secluded nation. However, we're killing Americans with poison too... not

just Africans.

Stop with the harsh words and get back to reason. No one insulted you. Calm

down man!

Caer

One more thing...

Wake the Fuck UP!!! and start looking after your own...

If you expect me to have sympathy for you have'n chosen leaders that

lok the other way while orphans are wallowing in excrement...

quite frankly, it makes me think that, perhaps, you are looking to

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$\

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$\

$$$$$$$$$$$$

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$4

KISS MY ASS...wake up or die. THERE IS NO NEW VIRUS DECIMATING YOUR

POPULACE... YOU ARE LIVING IN filth COMPARED TO " US " it's " US "

again, ... trying to make money OFF'A Y'A...)( ...call a " spade " a

" spade " ...)

-Alen Graves, Portland, OR ( you scum- wake THE FUCK UP OR DIE... )

Read AIDS-Cured

[Guest guest]

:

Let me get this right, America chose the leader that it likes and he does

not turn away from the slums? He is a poor man dedicated to his cause, so

you wish that the Africans should learn from that and emulate it and then

their suffering would be over, is that what you are trying to say?

May God Bless You And Keep You Well:

Professor Ozone ()

www.ozoneuniversity.com

professorozone@...

Without prejudice to the generality of the contents herein, this

communication does not attach any legal liability on the originator thereof.

This communication contains information, which is confidential and may also

be privileged. It is for the exclusive use of the intended recipient(s). If

you have received this communication by error, please delete the email and

destroy any copies of it.

One more thing...

Wake the Fuck UP!!! and start looking after your own...

If you expect me to have sympathy for you have'n chosen leaders that lok the

other way while orphans are wallowing in excrement...

quite frankly, it makes me think that, perhaps, you are looking to

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$4

KISS MY ASS...wake up or die. THERE IS NO NEW VIRUS DECIMATING YOUR

POPULACE... YOU ARE LIVING IN filth COMPARED TO " US " it's " US "

again, ... trying to make money OFF'A Y'A...)( ...call a " spade " a

" spade " ...)

-Alen Graves, Portland, OR ( you scum- wake THE FUCK UP OR DIE... )

[Guest guest]

Thank you for these words of encouragement. They are sooo true for me also.brgk44 <brgk44@...> wrote: "Weight loss *can* be done, but it's a full time job."I wanted to say something about this earlier, but couldn't quite thinkof how to put it. It kept coming back to me all morning, though, andI've finally figured out why it was bugging me. Sue, you're right, itis a full time job...but not just for us fat folks. All of my thinfriends make good food choices--and not because they really want

to,but because they want to stay thin/fit/healthy. None are stick thin,just healthy. So, really, it's our choice: is it more important to just eat and eatand eat--whatever we want, whenever we want--or is it more importantto get healthy?Heck, just overeating used to be my 'full time job'. I wish was wasjoking. I would eat, feel bad because I ate so much, and then findmore to eat to try to bury the bad feelings I'd created.So, I've switched jobs. Instead of eating full time, I monitor and amaware of my choices now. I guess I just don't want anyone to give upbecause they feel like they don't have a choice. Everyone has achoice. Do it or don't do it, eat right or don't. But takeresponsibility and don't complain when the consequences hit. I livedtoo long thinking I just didn't have a choice. It was a happysurprise when I realized I *do* have a choice. It's not always easy,but nothing ever

is.-Bonnie

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: brgk44

> I wanted to say something about this earlier, but couldn't quite think

of how to put it.

I wrote a response to Sue but I haven't sent it yet. It needs to sit for a

day and be edited before I can send it to the list.

Sue, we've been friends for years now but sometimes you are over the top

girl!

Ann

lucky to be alive with her amputated stomach

[Guest guest]

Ladies,

I just wanted to say I am sorry for starting a controversey. I didn't mean to. I was just having a pity party. It should never have been sent, but that's a trademark move for me speaking (or in this case sending) before I think. I just needed to vent I guess. However, I shouldn't have. You are all such nice ladies and to have you angry at one another makes my heart sick. Sue had every right to lay into me. I deserved it. A good kick in the pants is what I needed. That's a can of worms that was better left unopened. I am very sew to this group and should have kept my mouth shut. Feeling sorry for myself over a number on a scale is ridiculous. It happened and I am so sorry. I really like you all and think I have met some great friends.Support like this is hard to find. Other than my husband I have vo support at all in the weight loss arena. I met you all and felt comfortableand I am sorry for my stupid e-mail. BUT If you all would rather I take

my pity party and leave I will. Sue this is your right, if you ask me I will leave. Ever so sorry,

[Guest guest]

Well shoot I just responded to Bonnie's note before I seen this. , I don't think you have started a controversary. You just gave us a topic of conversation. Weight loss. And yes, I think you should have sent it. Thats what we are here for. We are here for you to vent. We are here to vent ourselves. As I said, I think as long as we say what is on our minds with a kind word and a kind heart then its all good.I have been here since the end of January and so far I think all these Ladies that post has a good heart in them. I don't see Sue taking out her wet noodle to any of us yet so I don't think she minded some of us disagreeing with her. I agree sometimes we need someone to tell us when we are full of crap and using excuses and etc.... But we all also need that extra push and encouragement and kind word. Thats why we are all here. I think all the new members should feel free to post what ever is in their hearts . Please stay. My personal gut feeling here is noone has any bad feelings here. I think people was just afraid they stepped on toes by expressing themselves. I think its great! So keep posting and I for one will continue to tell you what I think too:)

Ladies,

I just wanted to say I am sorry for starting a controversey. I didn't mean to. I was just having a pity party. It should never have been sent, but that's a trademark move for me speaking (or in this case sending) before I think. I just needed to vent I guess. However, I shouldn't have. You are all such nice ladies and to have you angry at one another makes my heart sick. Sue had every right to lay into me. I deserved it. A good kick in the pants is what I needed. That's a can of worms that was better left unopened. I am very sew to this group and should have kept my mouth shut. Feeling sorry for myself over a number on a scale is ridiculous. It happened and I am so sorry. I really like you all and think I have met some great friends.Support like this is hard to find. Other than my husband I have vo support at all in the weight loss arena. I met you all and felt comfortableand I am sorry for my stupid e-mail. BUT If you all would rather I take my pity party and leave I will. Sue this is your right, if you ask me I will leave. Ever so sorry,

[Guest guest]

Nobody's angry. Vent what you want. ODell <ib_domesticdiva@...> wrote: Ladies, I just wanted to say I am sorry for starting a controversey. I didn't mean to. I was just having a pity party. It should never have been sent, but that's a trademark move for me speaking (or in this case sending) before I think. I just needed to vent I guess. However, I shouldn't have. You

are all such nice ladies and to have you angry at one another makes my heart sick. Sue had every right to lay into me. I deserved it. A good kick in the pants is what I needed. That's a can of worms that was better left unopened. I am very sew to this group and should have kept my mouth shut. Feeling sorry for myself over a number on a scale is ridiculous. It happened and I am so sorry. I really like you all and think I have met some great friends.Support like this is hard to find. Other than my husband I have vo support at all in the weight loss arena. I met you all and felt comfortableand I am sorry for my stupid e-mail. BUT If you all would rather I take my pity party and leave I will. Sue this is your right, if you ask me I will leave. Ever so sorry,

How low will we go? Check out Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates.

[Guest guest]

, I feel like I missed something because I'm under the impression that you are a valuable and welcomed member of this group. Anyway whatever I missed let me add my thoughts to those of others I've read in reply to this post. First - Pity parties! You know what the motivator for me was when I had my last pity party and invited only one guest? My mother in law....my sweet, supportive mother in law who I love dearly and who felt guilty about it and apologised for days....told it like it was. Was she right in some things...yes....wrong in others....yes....but the fact that she cares enough to tell me the truth even when I don't want to hear it is a blessing for me. I think of this group the same way. There aren't a lot of people who know my heaviest weight was 320lb. There aren't a lot of people I could complain to about always having

to use the disabled stall in the bathroom because the others are to small, about how turning over in bed at night is like doing a three point turn, about how I always choose a booth over a stool because no matter how sturdy they assure me those things are I always picture myself breaking them. I could go on but you get the picture. I like this group because I was welcomed, I feel comfortable and I know they'll tell me the truth, support me, help me when I'm down and give me a kick in the patootie when I need it. And that makes me accountable....but it also makes me want to do my very best. Hang on....did this reply to your post just become all about me???? Oooops...gotta work on that. Anyway...I didn't feel you started a controversy, and I didn't see any replies to your initial post that weren't just friendly,

understanding and supportive. We might have different ways of expressing those things but I know they are offered to all of us....so don't go anywhere, keep helping us and letting us help you on this journey we are all taking. Lu ODell <ib_domesticdiva@...> wrote: Ladies, I just wanted to say I am sorry for starting a

controversey. I didn't mean to. I was just having a pity party. It should never have been sent, but that's a trademark move for me speaking (or in this case sending) before I think. I just needed to vent I guess. However, I shouldn't have. You are all such nice ladies and to have you angry at one another makes my heart sick. Sue had every right to lay into me. I deserved it. A good kick in the pants is what I needed. That's a can of worms that was better left unopened. I am very sew to this group and should have kept my mouth shut. Feeling sorry for myself over a number on a scale is ridiculous. It happened and I am so sorry. I really like you all and think I have met some great friends.Support like this is hard to find. Other than my husband I have vo support at all in the weight loss arena. I met you all and felt comfortableand I am sorry for my stupid e-mail. BUT If you all would rather I take my pity party and leave I will. Sue this is your

right, if you ask me I will leave. Ever so sorry,

Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: ODell

> I just wanted to say I am sorry for starting a controversey. I didn't mean

> to. I was just having a pity party. It should never have been sent,

This is a support group. If you can't vent here what's the point? We share

good times and bad. That's what we're here for.

Sue and I have been on this list together for years. I went over to the

dark side in March and had my stomach " amputated. " Sue's entitled to her

opinion and I'm entitled to respond. I promise we won't start a full blown

flame fest. I like Sue. She and have been the glue that's held

this list together for so long as so many people have come and gone.

Why are so many women afraid of discussion? I never have understood that.

Just talk and we'll listen. Sometimes we'll disagree. No big deal.

Ann

[Guest guest]

Lu,

>>First - Pity parties! You know what the motivator for me was when I had my last pity party and invited only one guest? My mother in law....my sweet, supportive mother in law who I love dearly and who felt guilty about it and apologised for days....told it like it was. Was she right in some things...yes. ...wrong in others....yes. ...but the fact that she cares enough to tell me the truth even when I don't want to hear it is a blessing for me.

You are so lucky. If my MIL knew how much I weigh I'd probably NEVER hear the end of it. She is a great lady but doesn't understand about the weight thing, she is more than 20 lbs underweight and can't gain. She would tell the truth but she expresses her opinion in a careless way. I'd end up in tears.

>>I like this group because I was welcomed, I feel comfortable and I know they'll tell me the truth, support me, help me when I'm down and give me a kick in the patootie when I need it. And that makes me accountable. ...but it also makes me want to do my very best. Hang on....

I just thought because of Sue's post she'd rather I leave. She gave a swift kick and I appreciate it. BUT I just figured she'd want this whiner gone. Then all the posts countering Sue's post made me feel like she'd probably be pissed at me.But thanks to Sue I got my fanny off the couch and started moving this body! Thanks everyone for your support I REALLY need it! Blessed be,

[Guest guest]

Thanks Ann,

I just figured Sue hated me for all the posts against hers. Blessed be,

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: brgk44

> All of my thin friends make good food choices--and not because they really

> want to, but because they want to stay thin/fit/healthy. None are stick

> thin, just healthy.

Good point. I'm the only fat person in the company gym from what I've seen

the 3 days I've been there. Everyone else is trim and fit and working their

butts off to stay that way. Some people stay thin due to lucky genes but

most people have to really work for it.

Ann

[Guest guest]

Maybe I'll recommend to Marina that she try a coffee enema... she hasn't tried

that before. She's done the 9-day program a couple of times. If she can do

that again, maybe it's time for another shot of it..,

Also, I've doubled up her magnesium so she takes it all with breakfast and

supper instead of a dose before bed. Stopping the probiotics as well.