Guest guest Posted January 1, 2006 Report Share Posted January 1, 2006 Jenn, Here we go, sorry I did not have one of these handy before. http://www.danasview.net/phenol.htm Great, great information!!! Then, of course, www.feingold.org. Many people around here adopt some of the Feingold stuff, in different ways, to the SCD protocol. For instance, we found that annato was terrible for us, increased hyperactivity and dazed and confused symptoms for Hunter. We also stay away from all those nasty preservatives. Many of the Feingold things are an automatic duplication of what SCD is already doing. Dana's View is very descriptive, and is an invaluable resource. Summer --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2006 Report Share Posted January 1, 2006 Summer, YOU ARE AWESOME!! I needed every bit of that. Thank you for being one of our angels watching over us. I know what I need to do now. I will be sticking with scd and waiting for test results. Don't know what to do about the worms yet. I'm not sure if she got sick from the actual medicine, die-off or ? I can't give her the med. if I think she just can't tolerate it. But, I can't send her to school with worms either....I have been researching stuff and enzymes will be our next change. Thanks. Jenn & Kali 7 months scd Re: For Jenn > > > Jenn, > > > Here we go, sorry I did not have one of these handy before. > > http://www.danasview.net/phenol.htm Great, great information!!! > > Then, of course, www.feingold.org. > > Many people around here adopt some of the Feingold stuff, in different ways, to the SCD protocol. For instance, we found that annato was terrible for us, increased hyperactivity and dazed and confused symptoms for Hunter. We also stay away from all those nasty preservatives. Many of the Feingold things are an automatic duplication of what SCD is already doing. Dana's View is very descriptive, and is an invaluable resource. > > Summer > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2006 Report Share Posted January 1, 2006 Jenn, LOL! Angel I am not! Crazy Mom, most definitely! You are welcome, I really hope the enzymes will help you alot. So, I was doing a little bit, just a little bit of research into Vermox. Besides the SCD illegality of filler ingredients, it can have some other possible side effects. Have you heard of neutropenia or agranulocytosis? Basically, in some people, especially immune suppressed people, and I would venture to say, Kali has immune suppression, much like we experience. Anyway, in some people, this medication can actually cause the attacking white blood cells decline, by affecting their production in the bone marrow. This is generally temporary, only lasting up 7-14 days, according to places like Medline, but the big but of it all is, during this time, pathogenic gut bugs from yeast to clostridia are multiplying like mad. I am NOT saying Kali has this, you would need to get a good blood differential from your doctor, to look at the levels of all the white blood cells...even though you discontinued the medication, if the numbers went down, they may still be trying to work up again. This is only a POSSIBILITY that happens to a few people who take Vermox. Personally, I would follow your instinct and not take this medicene again. Even if the worms die off, there is a good chance they will reappear again, because the defenses in the whole digestive system, from mouth to colon, should be able to flush alot of it out. There are other options, though. Summer --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2006 Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 Summer, I do fear this medicine for her. I was also looking it up last night. My baby had a fever last night that spiked up to 103* for most of the night. I had to use cool compresses to get it to stay down. I do think that this medicine has messed her up more at this point in time. Although, there has been a bug going around here with the vomiting, fever lately, I am taking no chances. etc. Could a med. like this actually give a person such a high fever? I read somewhere that in other cultures, if someone does not get the pinworms as a child then, they are shunned out of the group because that means that their immune systems are not developing right. I believe they just use diet to get rid of the worms. It would probably be extremely beneficial for me to give her lots of acidopholus today and extra fluids. I don't believe her body is strong enough to take this med. and lots of others. It's part of her susceptibility. I will call the Dr. today to see what he says and just maybe we can discuss wiping them out with foods, herbs etc. Thank you so very much Summer. Thanks for being the " crazy mom " helping us too! Jenn & Kali 7 months scd Re: For Jenn > > Jenn, > > LOL! Angel I am not! Crazy Mom, most definitely! You are welcome, I really hope the enzymes will help you alot. > > So, I was doing a little bit, just a little bit of research into Vermox. Besides the SCD illegality of filler ingredients, it can have some other possible side effects. Have you heard of neutropenia or agranulocytosis? Basically, in some people, especially immune suppressed people, and I would venture to say, Kali has immune suppression, much like we experience. Anyway, in some people, this medication can actually cause the attacking white blood cells decline, by affecting their production in the bone marrow. This is generally temporary, only lasting up 7-14 days, according to places like Medline, but the big but of it all is, during this time, pathogenic gut bugs from yeast to clostridia are multiplying like mad. > > I am NOT saying Kali has this, you would need to get a good blood differential from your doctor, to look at the levels of all the white blood cells...even though you discontinued the medication, if the numbers went down, they may still be trying to work up again. > > This is only a POSSIBILITY that happens to a few people who take Vermox. Personally, I would follow your instinct and not take this medicene again. Even if the worms die off, there is a good chance they will reappear again, because the defenses in the whole digestive system, from mouth to colon, should be able to flush alot of it out. There are other options, though. > > Summer > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Shopping > Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2006 Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 Hi Jenn, Don't underestimate the power of a mother's intuition. If the Vermox doesn't " feel right " for Kali at the moment then don't use it until it does (if it ever does). Hang in there. Sharon Re: For Jenn > > Jenn, > > LOL! Angel I am not! Crazy Mom, most definitely! You are welcome, I really hope the enzymes will help you alot. > > So, I was doing a little bit, just a little bit of research into Vermox. Besides the SCD illegality of filler ingredients, it can have some other possible side effects. Have you heard of neutropenia or agranulocytosis? Basically, in some people, especially immune suppressed people, and I would venture to say, Kali has immune suppression, much like we experience. Anyway, in some people, this medication can actually cause the attacking white blood cells decline, by affecting their production in the bone marrow. This is generally temporary, only lasting up 7-14 days, according to places like Medline, but the big but of it all is, during this time, pathogenic gut bugs from yeast to clostridia are multiplying like mad. > > I am NOT saying Kali has this, you would need to get a good blood differential from your doctor, to look at the levels of all the white blood cells...even though you discontinued the medication, if the numbers went down, they may still be trying to work up again. > > This is only a POSSIBILITY that happens to a few people who take Vermox. Personally, I would follow your instinct and not take this medicene again. Even if the worms die off, there is a good chance they will reappear again, because the defenses in the whole digestive system, from mouth to colon, should be able to flush alot of it out. There are other options, though. > > Summer > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Shopping > Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2006 Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 I do believe it was given at too strong of a dose and is causing her MASSIVE DIE-OFF symptoms today. I didn't know a fever could get that high from die-off. I have never seen her so white and weak. Thanks for your support Sharon. Jenn & Kali 7 months scd Re: For Jenn > > > > > > Jenn, > > > > LOL! Angel I am not! Crazy Mom, most definitely! You are welcome, I > really hope the enzymes will help you alot. > > > > So, I was doing a little bit, just a little bit of research into Vermox. > Besides the SCD illegality of filler ingredients, it can have some other > possible side effects. Have you heard of neutropenia or agranulocytosis? > Basically, in some people, especially immune suppressed people, and I would > venture to say, Kali has immune suppression, much like we experience. > Anyway, in some people, this medication can actually cause the attacking > white blood cells decline, by affecting their production in the bone marrow. > This is generally temporary, only lasting up 7-14 days, according to places > like Medline, but the big but of it all is, during this time, pathogenic gut > bugs from yeast to clostridia are multiplying like mad. > > > > I am NOT saying Kali has this, you would need to get a good blood > differential from your doctor, to look at the levels of all the white blood > cells...even though you discontinued the medication, if the numbers went > down, they may still be trying to work up again. > > > > This is only a POSSIBILITY that happens to a few people who take Vermox. > Personally, I would follow your instinct and not take this medicene again. > Even if the worms die off, there is a good chance they will reappear again, > because the defenses in the whole digestive system, from mouth to colon, > should be able to flush alot of it out. There are other options, though. > > > > Summer > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! Shopping > > Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2006 Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 Hey Jenn! Garlic and acidolphilus and staying on SCD, each of these cause massive die-off as well. So, while the Vermox may be contributing to the deworming, it can't be credited with all this other die-off. So far, I have found nothing to support much yeast and viral die off. SCD, acidolphilus and garlic all have the same effect on us. Be sure to administer the garlic at different times from the acidolphilus, just in case. If the neurtophil count is lower than normal, that is considered an adverse reaction, even if the worming is on schedule. It will not allow the intestine, to necessarily rid itself of all the eggs, for one. In people where such an adverse reaction doesn't happen, they are more likely to have complete success. A pinworm test 6 months from now should be able to tell you one way or another. Anyway, that is what I have found out so far. A blood differential is still a good idea. When the neutrophil count gets low, even if a medicene works, is it worth trading incomplete pinworm irradication for even more susceptability of e.coli, clostridia and other pathogenic bugs to set in? Are you trading infections for one another? With adverse reactions, medicenes often cannot work as intended, and white blood cells are needed to clean up the after effects, right? I am not asking this question of you, but you can ask this question in turn of your doctor after the results of a fresh blood differential come back. There must be other options. Vermox is not supposed to cause low white blood cell count, it is a rare occurance only in immuno-depressed individuals. These are just my own opinions from some research I did, just trying to play a little devils advocate as well. Fevers are good, as long as they don't spike high. Kali's immune system is at work! Summer Jim and Jen jlessard@...> wrote: I do believe it was given at too strong of a dose and is causing her MASSIVE DIE-OFF symptoms today. I didn't know a fever could get that high from die-off. I have never seen her so white and weak. Thanks for your support Sharon. Jenn & Kali 7 months scd Re: For Jenn > > > > > > Jenn, > > > > LOL! Angel I am not! Crazy Mom, most definitely! You are welcome, I > really hope the enzymes will help you alot. > > > > So, I was doing a little bit, just a little bit of research into Vermox. > Besides the SCD illegality of filler ingredients, it can have some other > possible side effects. Have you heard of neutropenia or agranulocytosis? > Basically, in some people, especially immune suppressed people, and I would > venture to say, Kali has immune suppression, much like we experience. > Anyway, in some people, this medication can actually cause the attacking > white blood cells decline, by affecting their production in the bone marrow. > This is generally temporary, only lasting up 7-14 days, according to places > like Medline, but the big but of it all is, during this time, pathogenic gut > bugs from yeast to clostridia are multiplying like mad. > > > > I am NOT saying Kali has this, you would need to get a good blood > differential from your doctor, to look at the levels of all the white blood > cells...even though you discontinued the medication, if the numbers went > down, they may still be trying to work up again. > > > > This is only a POSSIBILITY that happens to a few people who take Vermox. > Personally, I would follow your instinct and not take this medicene again. > Even if the worms die off, there is a good chance they will reappear again, > because the defenses in the whole digestive system, from mouth to colon, > should be able to flush alot of it out. There are other options, though. > > > > Summer > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! Shopping > > Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2006 Report Share Posted January 3, 2006 I am so happy to hear that she still has an immune system after everything she has been through. Thanks for doing the research. It is more clear to me now what is going on with her and the med. I do some research and sometimes and I get called away so I don't have enough time to finish it. Only reading part of the info. doesn't help me. I did read what you are talking about here but, didn't understand what exactly was going on. Thank you again for clarifying this info. for me. Jenn & Kali 7 months scd ----- Original Message ----- To: pecanbread > Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 11:41 PM Subject: Re: For Jenn > Hey Jenn! > > Garlic and acidolphilus and staying on SCD, each of these cause massive die-off as well. So, while the Vermox may be contributing to the deworming, it can't be credited with all this other die-off. So far, I have found nothing to support much yeast and viral die off. SCD, acidolphilus and garlic all have the same effect on us. Be sure to administer the garlic at different times from the acidolphilus, just in case. > > If the neurtophil count is lower than normal, that is considered an adverse reaction, even if the worming is on schedule. It will not allow the intestine, to necessarily rid itself of all the eggs, for one. In people where such an adverse reaction doesn't happen, they are more likely to have complete success. A pinworm test 6 months from now should be able to tell you one way or another. Anyway, that is what I have found out so far. A blood differential is still a good idea. When the neutrophil count gets low, even if a medicene works, is it worth trading incomplete pinworm irradication for even more susceptability of e.coli, clostridia and other pathogenic bugs to set in? Are you trading infections for one another? With adverse reactions, medicenes often cannot work as intended, and white blood cells are needed to clean up the after effects, right? I am not asking this question of you, but you can ask this question in turn of your doctor after the results of a fresh blood > differential come back. There must be other options. Vermox is not supposed to cause low white blood cell count, it is a rare occurance only in immuno-depressed individuals. > > These are just my own opinions from some research I did, just trying to play a little devils advocate as well. > > Fevers are good, as long as they don't spike high. Kali's immune system is at work! > > Summer > > Jim and Jen jlessard@...> wrote: > I do believe it was given at too strong of a dose and is causing her MASSIVE > DIE-OFF symptoms today. I didn't know a fever could get that high from > die-off. I have never seen her so white and weak. Thanks for your support > Sharon. Jenn & Kali 7 months scd > Re: For Jenn > > > > > > > > > > Jenn, > > > > > > LOL! Angel I am not! Crazy Mom, most definitely! You are welcome, I > > really hope the enzymes will help you alot. > > > > > > So, I was doing a little bit, just a little bit of research into > Vermox. > > Besides the SCD illegality of filler ingredients, it can have some other > > possible side effects. Have you heard of neutropenia or agranulocytosis? > > Basically, in some people, especially immune suppressed people, and I > would > > venture to say, Kali has immune suppression, much like we experience. > > Anyway, in some people, this medication can actually cause the attacking > > white blood cells decline, by affecting their production in the bone > marrow. > > This is generally temporary, only lasting up 7-14 days, according to > places > > like Medline, but the big but of it all is, during this time, pathogenic > gut > > bugs from yeast to clostridia are multiplying like mad. > > > > > > I am NOT saying Kali has this, you would need to get a good blood > > differential from your doctor, to look at the levels of all the white > blood > > cells...even though you discontinued the medication, if the numbers went > > down, they may still be trying to work up again. > > > > > > This is only a POSSIBILITY that happens to a few people who take > Vermox. > > Personally, I would follow your instinct and not take this medicene > again. > > Even if the worms die off, there is a good chance they will reappear > again, > > because the defenses in the whole digestive system, from mouth to colon, > > should be able to flush alot of it out. There are other options, though. > > > > > > Summer > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > Yahoo! Shopping > > > Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 6, 2006 Report Share Posted January 6, 2006 Summer, I have been doing my research and reading lots of autism related articles. Check this one out.... Steenblock, M.S., D.O. There is a particular part in this article that discusses the low white blood count in some autistics. When I talked to Dr. Buie about it, he said it was interesting to him and that he has never had a child react this way to the VERMOX. He still wants her to have another dose and he said her reaction was die-off and that it wouldn't be that bad the next time around. I am so scared. I beg to differ. My child had low neutrophil count and percentage seems everytime she has had this sort of blood test done. After I gave her the vermox, her fever spiked so fast so high. I think I may have given her body some time to deal with whatever was making her so sick but, I had to act fast and I believe in this situation, I may have saved her life. Her fever may have spiked so high too fast and I may have suffered encephalopy(sp). We have been through high fevers before but, NOTHING like this with all those other symptoms. I am trying to get K in to see Dr. Steenblock who also works at Mass General. He would know exactly what we are talking about. And, he works closely with Dr. Buie. Dr. Buie does the gut clean-up part and then when he can't offer more help and more is needed, he will refer out to this doc. I know if I could make doc Steenblock take her as a patient and get him to understand what happened to k on this med. then, in his communications with Dr. Buie he would be able to make him understand what had happened. Thank you for all your help. I just wanted to drop you a note as to where we were on this. Jenn & Kali Lessard 7 Months scd ---- Original Message ----- To: pecanbread > Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 11:41 PM Subject: Re: For Jenn > Hey Jenn! > > Garlic and acidolphilus and staying on SCD, each of these cause massive die-off as well. So, while the Vermox may be contributing to the deworming, it can't be credited with all this other die-off. So far, I have found nothing to support much yeast and viral die off. SCD, acidolphilus and garlic all have the same effect on us. Be sure to administer the garlic at different times from the acidolphilus, just in case. > > If the neurtophil count is lower than normal, that is considered an adverse reaction, even if the worming is on schedule. It will not allow the intestine, to necessarily rid itself of all the eggs, for one. In people where such an adverse reaction doesn't happen, they are more likely to have complete success. A pinworm test 6 months from now should be able to tell you one way or another. Anyway, that is what I have found out so far. A blood differential is still a good idea. When the neutrophil count gets low, even if a medicene works, is it worth trading incomplete pinworm irradication for even more susceptability of e.coli, clostridia and other pathogenic bugs to set in? Are you trading infections for one another? With adverse reactions, medicenes often cannot work as intended, and white blood cells are needed to clean up the after effects, right? I am not asking this question of you, but you can ask this question in turn of your doctor after the results of a fresh blood > differential come back. There must be other options. Vermox is not supposed to cause low white blood cell count, it is a rare occurance only in immuno-depressed individuals. > > These are just my own opinions from some research I did, just trying to play a little devils advocate as well. > > Fevers are good, as long as they don't spike high. Kali's immune system is at work! > > Summer > > Jim and Jen jlessard@...> wrote: > I do believe it was given at too strong of a dose and is causing her MASSIVE > DIE-OFF symptoms today. I didn't know a fever could get that high from > die-off. I have never seen her so white and weak. Thanks for your support > Sharon. Jenn & Kali 7 months scd > Re: For Jenn > > > > > > > > > > Jenn, > > > > > > LOL! Angel I am not! Crazy Mom, most definitely! You are welcome, I > > really hope the enzymes will help you alot. > > > > > > So, I was doing a little bit, just a little bit of research into > Vermox. > > Besides the SCD illegality of filler ingredients, it can have some other > > possible side effects. Have you heard of neutropenia or agranulocytosis? > > Basically, in some people, especially immune suppressed people, and I > would > > venture to say, Kali has immune suppression, much like we experience. > > Anyway, in some people, this medication can actually cause the attacking > > white blood cells decline, by affecting their production in the bone > marrow. > > This is generally temporary, only lasting up 7-14 days, according to > places > > like Medline, but the big but of it all is, during this time, pathogenic > gut > > bugs from yeast to clostridia are multiplying like mad. > > > > > > I am NOT saying Kali has this, you would need to get a good blood > > differential from your doctor, to look at the levels of all the white > blood > > cells...even though you discontinued the medication, if the numbers went > > down, they may still be trying to work up again. > > > > > > This is only a POSSIBILITY that happens to a few people who take > Vermox. > > Personally, I would follow your instinct and not take this medicene > again. > > Even if the worms die off, there is a good chance they will reappear > again, > > because the defenses in the whole digestive system, from mouth to colon, > > should be able to flush alot of it out. There are other options, though. > > > > > > Summer > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > Yahoo! Shopping > > > Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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