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I live in Staunton, VA. We have a Whole Foods market about 40 min. away. There

is a 's that just opened up about 20 minutes away. I'll start to look

into it.

Jeni Lynn (gastrointestinal problems)

SCD day 1

Re: Fish

> >Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 20:51:12 -0000

> >

> >Dear ,

> >

> >You are correct! I got my vitamin forms backwards. I just checked

> >Dr. Megson's website with her research paper postings. Vitamin

> >palmitate is the form that my kids cannot absorb. They need the kind

> >in cod liver oil which is the natural, unsaturated cis form. Good

> >eye! Thanks for helping get it straight.

> >

> >As far as the fish thing goes. I was stating Dr. ph Mercola's

> >findings (which I trust). In his book, Dr. Mercola's Total Health

> >Program he writes: " Sadly in the last 50 years, the oceans and lakes

> >have become polluted with hundreds of millions of tons of mercury

> >primarily from burning coal for electricity. . . . many health

> >experts, myself included, are now warning against any type of fish,

> >as nearly all have toxic levels of mercury . . . . Fish consumption

> >is particularly hazardous to pregnant women and children as the

> >mercury can cause birth defects and harm the sensitive physiology of

> >children. " He also states: " My best advice in descending order is: 1)

> >avoid eating any fish unless you know it has been laboratory-tested

> >and proven to be free from mercury and other toxins. 2) If you do eat

> >fish that you are not sure has been laboratory-tested and proven to

> >be free of toxins, at least choose from among the following six

> >safest fish:* wild pacific salmon* tilapia* croaker* sardines*

> >haddock* summer flounder. 3) Eat fish sustainably harvested from the

> >wild (such as the toxin-free Vital Choice salmon . . .), not " farm

> >raised. "

> >

> >Again, this is Dr. Mercola's standpoint. Everyone has to make their

> >own decisions about what they feel comfortable with. Anyway, this is

> >some of the information that I have been able to get my hands on. I

> >hope you find it helpful.

> >

> >Agape to you,

> >Jeni Lynn

> >

> > > >

> > > > Since my daughter is autistic, is it better for me not to give

> >her

> > > > fish, fresh and from a can, due to the mrecury levels and metals?

> >Or

> > > > am I OK to do so?

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the

> >book _Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the

> >following websites:

> > >

>http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.infohttp://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info\

/http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/>>

> > > and

> > >

http://www.pecanbread.comhttp://www.pecanbread.com/http://www.pecanbread.com

ttp://www.pecanbread.com/>>

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

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I live in Staunton, VA. We have a Whole Foods market about 40 min. away. There

is a 's that just opened up about 20 minutes away. I'll start to look

into it.

Jeni Lynn (gastrointestinal problems)

SCD day 1

Re: Fish

> >Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 20:51:12 -0000

> >

> >Dear ,

> >

> >You are correct! I got my vitamin forms backwards. I just checked

> >Dr. Megson's website with her research paper postings. Vitamin

> >palmitate is the form that my kids cannot absorb. They need the kind

> >in cod liver oil which is the natural, unsaturated cis form. Good

> >eye! Thanks for helping get it straight.

> >

> >As far as the fish thing goes. I was stating Dr. ph Mercola's

> >findings (which I trust). In his book, Dr. Mercola's Total Health

> >Program he writes: " Sadly in the last 50 years, the oceans and lakes

> >have become polluted with hundreds of millions of tons of mercury

> >primarily from burning coal for electricity. . . . many health

> >experts, myself included, are now warning against any type of fish,

> >as nearly all have toxic levels of mercury . . . . Fish consumption

> >is particularly hazardous to pregnant women and children as the

> >mercury can cause birth defects and harm the sensitive physiology of

> >children. " He also states: " My best advice in descending order is: 1)

> >avoid eating any fish unless you know it has been laboratory-tested

> >and proven to be free from mercury and other toxins. 2) If you do eat

> >fish that you are not sure has been laboratory-tested and proven to

> >be free of toxins, at least choose from among the following six

> >safest fish:* wild pacific salmon* tilapia* croaker* sardines*

> >haddock* summer flounder. 3) Eat fish sustainably harvested from the

> >wild (such as the toxin-free Vital Choice salmon . . .), not " farm

> >raised. "

> >

> >Again, this is Dr. Mercola's standpoint. Everyone has to make their

> >own decisions about what they feel comfortable with. Anyway, this is

> >some of the information that I have been able to get my hands on. I

> >hope you find it helpful.

> >

> >Agape to you,

> >Jeni Lynn

> >

> > > >

> > > > Since my daughter is autistic, is it better for me not to give

> >her

> > > > fish, fresh and from a can, due to the mrecury levels and metals?

> >Or

> > > > am I OK to do so?

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the

> >book _Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the

> >following websites:

> > >

>http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.infohttp://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info\

/http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/>>

> > > and

> > >

http://www.pecanbread.comhttp://www.pecanbread.com/http://www.pecanbread.com

ttp://www.pecanbread.com/>>

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

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Guest guest

>

> Hi !

>

> Your point is valid and good in my opinion. Thank you for the extra resource.

I intend

to check it out.

>

> Where do you buy your fish? How did you go about investigating the quality of

it? I

have never bought Vital Choice (and I don't intend to) because it probably costs

more than

I am willing to pay. If I could find good, quality fish sold locally, though, I

would be very

interested in adding it to my family's menu.

>

> Once, I asked around at the local fish market, Walmart fish market, etc. about

their fish

source. They had no idea where the fish came from or anything like that. I

gave up after

that and went fish-free.

>

> Can you give me some pointers on " fish investigation " ?

>

> Thanks!

> Jeni Lynn (gastrointestinal problems)

> SCD 2 hours

> RE: Re: Fish

>

>

> I think we all need to be careful about fish, BUT, let's not forget, as far

> as Dr. Mercola goes- He has vested interested in selling vital choice

> salmon, of course he is going to tell you not to eat any other fish- buying

> other fish doesn't make him money.

I know was trying to help.

Elaine had issues with Dr. Mercola, his protocols and products. I composed a

really long

post about this and held it back pending a cooling off period as it may offend.

It's my

annual rant.

If the moderators apporve what I wrote I will post it.

Carol F.

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Guest guest

>

> Hi !

>

> Your point is valid and good in my opinion. Thank you for the extra resource.

I intend

to check it out.

>

> Where do you buy your fish? How did you go about investigating the quality of

it? I

have never bought Vital Choice (and I don't intend to) because it probably costs

more than

I am willing to pay. If I could find good, quality fish sold locally, though, I

would be very

interested in adding it to my family's menu.

>

> Once, I asked around at the local fish market, Walmart fish market, etc. about

their fish

source. They had no idea where the fish came from or anything like that. I

gave up after

that and went fish-free.

>

> Can you give me some pointers on " fish investigation " ?

>

> Thanks!

> Jeni Lynn (gastrointestinal problems)

> SCD 2 hours

> RE: Re: Fish

>

>

> I think we all need to be careful about fish, BUT, let's not forget, as far

> as Dr. Mercola goes- He has vested interested in selling vital choice

> salmon, of course he is going to tell you not to eat any other fish- buying

> other fish doesn't make him money.

I know was trying to help.

Elaine had issues with Dr. Mercola, his protocols and products. I composed a

really long

post about this and held it back pending a cooling off period as it may offend.

It's my

annual rant.

If the moderators apporve what I wrote I will post it.

Carol F.

Share this post


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Share on other sites
Guest guest

>

> Hi !

>

> Your point is valid and good in my opinion. Thank you for the extra resource.

I intend

to check it out.

>

> Where do you buy your fish? How did you go about investigating the quality of

it? I

have never bought Vital Choice (and I don't intend to) because it probably costs

more than

I am willing to pay. If I could find good, quality fish sold locally, though, I

would be very

interested in adding it to my family's menu.

>

> Once, I asked around at the local fish market, Walmart fish market, etc. about

their fish

source. They had no idea where the fish came from or anything like that. I

gave up after

that and went fish-free.

>

> Can you give me some pointers on " fish investigation " ?

>

> Thanks!

> Jeni Lynn (gastrointestinal problems)

> SCD 2 hours

> RE: Re: Fish

>

>

> I think we all need to be careful about fish, BUT, let's not forget, as far

> as Dr. Mercola goes- He has vested interested in selling vital choice

> salmon, of course he is going to tell you not to eat any other fish- buying

> other fish doesn't make him money.

I know was trying to help.

Elaine had issues with Dr. Mercola, his protocols and products. I composed a

really long

post about this and held it back pending a cooling off period as it may offend.

It's my

annual rant.

If the moderators apporve what I wrote I will post it.

Carol F.

Share this post


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Guest guest

>

> Hi !

>

> Your point is valid and good in my opinion. Thank you for the extra resource.

I intend

to check it out.

>

> Where do you buy your fish?

My two cents:

Wherever I buy fish I look for " Ocean caught. " Whole Foods feeds their fish with

other fish

and not grain but i am brainwashed against farmed fish. Costco has ocea caught

shrimps,

sole and scallops which i have found to taste good and can only hope they are

good.

I rarely use canned tuna any more but do so occasionally.

Carol F.

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Guest guest

>

> Hi !

>

> Your point is valid and good in my opinion. Thank you for the extra resource.

I intend

to check it out.

>

> Where do you buy your fish?

My two cents:

Wherever I buy fish I look for " Ocean caught. " Whole Foods feeds their fish with

other fish

and not grain but i am brainwashed against farmed fish. Costco has ocea caught

shrimps,

sole and scallops which i have found to taste good and can only hope they are

good.

I rarely use canned tuna any more but do so occasionally.

Carol F.

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Guest guest

Carol,

I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. I never advised

any one to follow Dr. Mercola's health program or purchase any products. I

simply stated his stance on the fish/mercury issue (a wise one in my opinion).

Someone had a legitimate fish question. When you are trying to find an answer,

information is helpful in reaching a conclusion. And -- as I stated in my post

to her -- everyone has to make their own decision about what to do concerning

the mercury/fish problem.

You expressed yourself that everyone has heard the cautions about fish, so I

don't understand why Dr. Mercola's caution should be excluded. I am not

promoting a separate diet, I am extending information about the condition of

fish in our world (just as Jody and did with their mercury website). I

don't think it is cause for an annual rant, shake-up, or anything else.

I don't believe Elaine's legacy has been attacked here, and I don't believe it

warrants your adamant protection on this point. And while you certainly are at

liberty to express your POV (as am I), your POV didn't seem very relevant to the

issue of mercury in fish. If you would like to post your POV about mercury in

fish or even Elaine's POV about mercury in fish, that would be helpful and

welcome. But as your curt comment just stated that Dr. Mercola didn't develop

SCD, it didn't state anything helpful or productive.

I realize that you are an asset to this group. Many of your posts are direct,

specific, and provide helpful direction and information (such as your reply to

me concerning Elaine's position with SCD and chelation). However, this one was

not.

Jeni Lynn

, you did no harm. It's time for my annual rant when I perceive

that Pecanbread could use a shakeup.

Its really hard to dance at two weddings at once.!

Adam is a man. Adam has a beard. Therefore can we conclude all men have

beards?

Macs serves salads with dressing on the side.

Therefore should we conclude Macs has similarities to SCD?

Elaine asked me in 2002 not to contact Dr. Mercola about the

similarities between his

protocols and SCD. She was emphatic! ( Mercola has a proclivity to

borrow from others without credit and he never heard of SCD at the

time) He also sells a slew of stuff.

The alternative medicine community is filled with therapies which

appear as valuable adjuncts to SCD but often are not. As new scientific

findings came along Elaine was interested and open to them if they were

proven just as we are constantly asked for more scientific prooof of

the effacy of SCD. Elaine never stopped researching! And we have all

heard the cautions about fish.

It may seem to outsiders that SCD is either a cult or a dictatorship,

but Elaine was determined to keep her diet intact. I am determined to

protect her legacy.

The FAQs of the Pecanbread list ask us not to discuss other diets and

practices. The official moderators are very lenient about this because

they know the stresses and desperation autism families suffer.

I am not an official moderator and express my own POV when it comes to

things

Elaine opposed ; some of Dr. Mercola's advice qualifies.

I am not harsh, not nasty... maybe just not so tactful ... an SCD

purist who has had the good fortune to meet or correspond with people

whose lives have been saved by SCD.

The SCD diet was originated by Dr. S.V. Haas and further rearched and

illuminated by

Elaine. She was clear on her opinions and equally clear if she was

uncertain about

something.

Every now and then I get so upset with extraneous suggestions that are

brought

to SCD support lists IN GOOD FAITH that I need to take a leave of

absence before I'm told I don't belong.

(It does not trouble me to become unpopular if a person's health can be

saved as a result.) This list is supposed to be about Mutual Support,

not " Ask Jeeves. "

I urge people to learn SCD, give it a fair trial to the best of their

ability..as it is written

without complicating it. Read the book and study the two web sites

before jumping in.

Learn how to look for answers that are in the book and on the SCD

Internet sites.. Correspond with companies to determine if store bought

food is legal instead of expecting the moderators to do it all. These

women are unpaid, give of their time freely and have families and other

responsibilities just like members and it is a miracle that they can

keep their cool when I do not..

I realize that autism is complex, multi faceted with a multitude of

suspected causes

and proposed treatments and parents pursue many paths in search of a

cure.

Being an adult on the diet is different. An adult can report on how it

feels to be sick and what makes things feel better. I offer my

experience of six years on the adult and original version of the diet.

The autism version co-exists with it side by side. The integrity of

both versions has to be maintained.

SCD is not about the beliefs of Donna Gates, Jordan Rubin, Sally

Fallon, Joe Mercola or the other diets that appear to have similarities

to SCD. Everyone eats food and so food on one diet is bound to appear

on another but not ALL foods.It is about the use of specific

carbohydrates and the elimination of starch, sugar and gluten to

promote healing the gut and improving brain function.

For everything else there is Mastercard :-)

Carol F.

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.infohttp://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/\

>

and

http://www.pecanbread.comhttp://www.pecanbread.com/>

Share this post


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Guest guest

Carol,

I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. I never advised

any one to follow Dr. Mercola's health program or purchase any products. I

simply stated his stance on the fish/mercury issue (a wise one in my opinion).

Someone had a legitimate fish question. When you are trying to find an answer,

information is helpful in reaching a conclusion. And -- as I stated in my post

to her -- everyone has to make their own decision about what to do concerning

the mercury/fish problem.

You expressed yourself that everyone has heard the cautions about fish, so I

don't understand why Dr. Mercola's caution should be excluded. I am not

promoting a separate diet, I am extending information about the condition of

fish in our world (just as Jody and did with their mercury website). I

don't think it is cause for an annual rant, shake-up, or anything else.

I don't believe Elaine's legacy has been attacked here, and I don't believe it

warrants your adamant protection on this point. And while you certainly are at

liberty to express your POV (as am I), your POV didn't seem very relevant to the

issue of mercury in fish. If you would like to post your POV about mercury in

fish or even Elaine's POV about mercury in fish, that would be helpful and

welcome. But as your curt comment just stated that Dr. Mercola didn't develop

SCD, it didn't state anything helpful or productive.

I realize that you are an asset to this group. Many of your posts are direct,

specific, and provide helpful direction and information (such as your reply to

me concerning Elaine's position with SCD and chelation). However, this one was

not.

Jeni Lynn

, you did no harm. It's time for my annual rant when I perceive

that Pecanbread could use a shakeup.

Its really hard to dance at two weddings at once.!

Adam is a man. Adam has a beard. Therefore can we conclude all men have

beards?

Macs serves salads with dressing on the side.

Therefore should we conclude Macs has similarities to SCD?

Elaine asked me in 2002 not to contact Dr. Mercola about the

similarities between his

protocols and SCD. She was emphatic! ( Mercola has a proclivity to

borrow from others without credit and he never heard of SCD at the

time) He also sells a slew of stuff.

The alternative medicine community is filled with therapies which

appear as valuable adjuncts to SCD but often are not. As new scientific

findings came along Elaine was interested and open to them if they were

proven just as we are constantly asked for more scientific prooof of

the effacy of SCD. Elaine never stopped researching! And we have all

heard the cautions about fish.

It may seem to outsiders that SCD is either a cult or a dictatorship,

but Elaine was determined to keep her diet intact. I am determined to

protect her legacy.

The FAQs of the Pecanbread list ask us not to discuss other diets and

practices. The official moderators are very lenient about this because

they know the stresses and desperation autism families suffer.

I am not an official moderator and express my own POV when it comes to

things

Elaine opposed ; some of Dr. Mercola's advice qualifies.

I am not harsh, not nasty... maybe just not so tactful ... an SCD

purist who has had the good fortune to meet or correspond with people

whose lives have been saved by SCD.

The SCD diet was originated by Dr. S.V. Haas and further rearched and

illuminated by

Elaine. She was clear on her opinions and equally clear if she was

uncertain about

something.

Every now and then I get so upset with extraneous suggestions that are

brought

to SCD support lists IN GOOD FAITH that I need to take a leave of

absence before I'm told I don't belong.

(It does not trouble me to become unpopular if a person's health can be

saved as a result.) This list is supposed to be about Mutual Support,

not " Ask Jeeves. "

I urge people to learn SCD, give it a fair trial to the best of their

ability..as it is written

without complicating it. Read the book and study the two web sites

before jumping in.

Learn how to look for answers that are in the book and on the SCD

Internet sites.. Correspond with companies to determine if store bought

food is legal instead of expecting the moderators to do it all. These

women are unpaid, give of their time freely and have families and other

responsibilities just like members and it is a miracle that they can

keep their cool when I do not..

I realize that autism is complex, multi faceted with a multitude of

suspected causes

and proposed treatments and parents pursue many paths in search of a

cure.

Being an adult on the diet is different. An adult can report on how it

feels to be sick and what makes things feel better. I offer my

experience of six years on the adult and original version of the diet.

The autism version co-exists with it side by side. The integrity of

both versions has to be maintained.

SCD is not about the beliefs of Donna Gates, Jordan Rubin, Sally

Fallon, Joe Mercola or the other diets that appear to have similarities

to SCD. Everyone eats food and so food on one diet is bound to appear

on another but not ALL foods.It is about the use of specific

carbohydrates and the elimination of starch, sugar and gluten to

promote healing the gut and improving brain function.

For everything else there is Mastercard :-)

Carol F.

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.infohttp://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/\

>

and

http://www.pecanbread.comhttp://www.pecanbread.com/>

Share this post


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Guest guest

Carol,

I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. I never advised

any one to follow Dr. Mercola's health program or purchase any products. I

simply stated his stance on the fish/mercury issue (a wise one in my opinion).

Someone had a legitimate fish question. When you are trying to find an answer,

information is helpful in reaching a conclusion. And -- as I stated in my post

to her -- everyone has to make their own decision about what to do concerning

the mercury/fish problem.

You expressed yourself that everyone has heard the cautions about fish, so I

don't understand why Dr. Mercola's caution should be excluded. I am not

promoting a separate diet, I am extending information about the condition of

fish in our world (just as Jody and did with their mercury website). I

don't think it is cause for an annual rant, shake-up, or anything else.

I don't believe Elaine's legacy has been attacked here, and I don't believe it

warrants your adamant protection on this point. And while you certainly are at

liberty to express your POV (as am I), your POV didn't seem very relevant to the

issue of mercury in fish. If you would like to post your POV about mercury in

fish or even Elaine's POV about mercury in fish, that would be helpful and

welcome. But as your curt comment just stated that Dr. Mercola didn't develop

SCD, it didn't state anything helpful or productive.

I realize that you are an asset to this group. Many of your posts are direct,

specific, and provide helpful direction and information (such as your reply to

me concerning Elaine's position with SCD and chelation). However, this one was

not.

Jeni Lynn

, you did no harm. It's time for my annual rant when I perceive

that Pecanbread could use a shakeup.

Its really hard to dance at two weddings at once.!

Adam is a man. Adam has a beard. Therefore can we conclude all men have

beards?

Macs serves salads with dressing on the side.

Therefore should we conclude Macs has similarities to SCD?

Elaine asked me in 2002 not to contact Dr. Mercola about the

similarities between his

protocols and SCD. She was emphatic! ( Mercola has a proclivity to

borrow from others without credit and he never heard of SCD at the

time) He also sells a slew of stuff.

The alternative medicine community is filled with therapies which

appear as valuable adjuncts to SCD but often are not. As new scientific

findings came along Elaine was interested and open to them if they were

proven just as we are constantly asked for more scientific prooof of

the effacy of SCD. Elaine never stopped researching! And we have all

heard the cautions about fish.

It may seem to outsiders that SCD is either a cult or a dictatorship,

but Elaine was determined to keep her diet intact. I am determined to

protect her legacy.

The FAQs of the Pecanbread list ask us not to discuss other diets and

practices. The official moderators are very lenient about this because

they know the stresses and desperation autism families suffer.

I am not an official moderator and express my own POV when it comes to

things

Elaine opposed ; some of Dr. Mercola's advice qualifies.

I am not harsh, not nasty... maybe just not so tactful ... an SCD

purist who has had the good fortune to meet or correspond with people

whose lives have been saved by SCD.

The SCD diet was originated by Dr. S.V. Haas and further rearched and

illuminated by

Elaine. She was clear on her opinions and equally clear if she was

uncertain about

something.

Every now and then I get so upset with extraneous suggestions that are

brought

to SCD support lists IN GOOD FAITH that I need to take a leave of

absence before I'm told I don't belong.

(It does not trouble me to become unpopular if a person's health can be

saved as a result.) This list is supposed to be about Mutual Support,

not " Ask Jeeves. "

I urge people to learn SCD, give it a fair trial to the best of their

ability..as it is written

without complicating it. Read the book and study the two web sites

before jumping in.

Learn how to look for answers that are in the book and on the SCD

Internet sites.. Correspond with companies to determine if store bought

food is legal instead of expecting the moderators to do it all. These

women are unpaid, give of their time freely and have families and other

responsibilities just like members and it is a miracle that they can

keep their cool when I do not..

I realize that autism is complex, multi faceted with a multitude of

suspected causes

and proposed treatments and parents pursue many paths in search of a

cure.

Being an adult on the diet is different. An adult can report on how it

feels to be sick and what makes things feel better. I offer my

experience of six years on the adult and original version of the diet.

The autism version co-exists with it side by side. The integrity of

both versions has to be maintained.

SCD is not about the beliefs of Donna Gates, Jordan Rubin, Sally

Fallon, Joe Mercola or the other diets that appear to have similarities

to SCD. Everyone eats food and so food on one diet is bound to appear

on another but not ALL foods.It is about the use of specific

carbohydrates and the elimination of starch, sugar and gluten to

promote healing the gut and improving brain function.

For everything else there is Mastercard :-)

Carol F.

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.infohttp://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/\

>

and

http://www.pecanbread.comhttp://www.pecanbread.com/>

Share this post


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Guest guest

>

> Carol,

>

> I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. I never advised

any one to

follow Dr. Mercola's health program or purchase any products. I simply stated

his stance

on the fish/mercury issue (a wise one in my opinion). Someone had a legitimate

fish

question. When you are trying to find an answer, information is helpful in

reaching a

conclusion. And -- as I stated in my post to her -- everyone has to make their

own

decision about what to do concerning the mercury/fish problem.

>

> You expressed yourself that everyone has heard the cautions about fish, so I

don't

understand why Dr. Mercola's caution should be excluded. I am not promoting a

separate

diet, I am extending information about the condition of fish in our world (just

as Jody and

did with their mercury website). I don't think it is cause for an annual

rant, shake-

up, or anything else.

>

> I don't believe Elaine's legacy has been attacked here, and I don't believe it

warrants

your adamant protection on this point. And while you certainly are at liberty

to express

your POV (as am I), your POV didn't seem very relevant to the issue of mercury

in fish. If

you would like to post your POV about mercury in fish or even Elaine's POV about

mercury

in fish, that would be helpful and welcome. But as your curt comment just

stated that Dr.

Mercola didn't develop SCD, it didn't state anything helpful or productive.

>

> I realize that you are an asset to this group. Many of your posts are direct,

specific, and

provide helpful direction and information (such as your reply to me concerning

Elaine's

position with SCD and chelation). However, this one was not.

>

Which is why I consulted Jody before posting it. Like I said, Elaine had no use

for Dr.

Mercola and I stand by everything else I said.

Carol F.

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>

> Carol,

>

> I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. I never advised

any one to

follow Dr. Mercola's health program or purchase any products. I simply stated

his stance

on the fish/mercury issue (a wise one in my opinion). Someone had a legitimate

fish

question. When you are trying to find an answer, information is helpful in

reaching a

conclusion. And -- as I stated in my post to her -- everyone has to make their

own

decision about what to do concerning the mercury/fish problem.

>

> You expressed yourself that everyone has heard the cautions about fish, so I

don't

understand why Dr. Mercola's caution should be excluded. I am not promoting a

separate

diet, I am extending information about the condition of fish in our world (just

as Jody and

did with their mercury website). I don't think it is cause for an annual

rant, shake-

up, or anything else.

>

> I don't believe Elaine's legacy has been attacked here, and I don't believe it

warrants

your adamant protection on this point. And while you certainly are at liberty

to express

your POV (as am I), your POV didn't seem very relevant to the issue of mercury

in fish. If

you would like to post your POV about mercury in fish or even Elaine's POV about

mercury

in fish, that would be helpful and welcome. But as your curt comment just

stated that Dr.

Mercola didn't develop SCD, it didn't state anything helpful or productive.

>

> I realize that you are an asset to this group. Many of your posts are direct,

specific, and

provide helpful direction and information (such as your reply to me concerning

Elaine's

position with SCD and chelation). However, this one was not.

>

Which is why I consulted Jody before posting it. Like I said, Elaine had no use

for Dr.

Mercola and I stand by everything else I said.

Carol F.

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>

> Carol,

>

> I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. I never advised

any one to

follow Dr. Mercola's health program or purchase any products. I simply stated

his stance

on the fish/mercury issue (a wise one in my opinion). Someone had a legitimate

fish

question. When you are trying to find an answer, information is helpful in

reaching a

conclusion. And -- as I stated in my post to her -- everyone has to make their

own

decision about what to do concerning the mercury/fish problem.

>

> You expressed yourself that everyone has heard the cautions about fish, so I

don't

understand why Dr. Mercola's caution should be excluded. I am not promoting a

separate

diet, I am extending information about the condition of fish in our world (just

as Jody and

did with their mercury website). I don't think it is cause for an annual

rant, shake-

up, or anything else.

>

> I don't believe Elaine's legacy has been attacked here, and I don't believe it

warrants

your adamant protection on this point. And while you certainly are at liberty

to express

your POV (as am I), your POV didn't seem very relevant to the issue of mercury

in fish. If

you would like to post your POV about mercury in fish or even Elaine's POV about

mercury

in fish, that would be helpful and welcome. But as your curt comment just

stated that Dr.

Mercola didn't develop SCD, it didn't state anything helpful or productive.

>

> I realize that you are an asset to this group. Many of your posts are direct,

specific, and

provide helpful direction and information (such as your reply to me concerning

Elaine's

position with SCD and chelation). However, this one was not.

>

Which is why I consulted Jody before posting it. Like I said, Elaine had no use

for Dr.

Mercola and I stand by everything else I said.

Carol F.

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>

> Carol,

>

> I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. >> Jeni Lynn

In my previous response I negelected to mention I checked Dr. Mercola's position

on celiac

disease. He has an entire page of his own " Google' sites on celiac and addresses

on each

suggests the Gluten Free Diet and avoiding wheat. So he is not recognizing the

importance

of avoiding starch and sugar as well. Why should I consider him a reliable

source about

fish when he advocates the GF diet?

Carol F.

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Guest guest

>

> Carol,

>

> I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. >> Jeni Lynn

In my previous response I negelected to mention I checked Dr. Mercola's position

on celiac

disease. He has an entire page of his own " Google' sites on celiac and addresses

on each

suggests the Gluten Free Diet and avoiding wheat. So he is not recognizing the

importance

of avoiding starch and sugar as well. Why should I consider him a reliable

source about

fish when he advocates the GF diet?

Carol F.

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Guest guest

Carol(with a sense of humor at the end), you go girl!!!!

Agape,

Carol Frilegh c.frilegh@...> wrote:

>

> Dear Carol,

>

> I understand that Dr. Mercola did not develop SCD, but interestingly

enough much of

what he says lines up with SCD. His book is not geared for people with

intestinal issues;

however, what he recommends for the " average " person is not far off

from what Elaine

suggests we do (such as removing grains, corn, soy, etc. from the diet).

>

> My point in providing the information was to help someone out with a

mercury / fish

question. Elaine does not address this in SCD, so are we not to

investigate answers to any

questions that Elaine didn't personally address?

>

> I saw no harm in providing this information to a person who is trying

to find answers. It

doesn't conflict with SCD in any way and may, in fact, end up helping

this woman's child.

>

, you did no harm. It's time for my annual rant when I perceive

that Pecanbread could use a shakeup.

Its really hard to dance at two weddings at once.!

Adam is a man. Adam has a beard. Therefore can we conclude all men have

beards?

Macs serves salads with dressing on the side.

Therefore should we conclude Macs has similarities to SCD?

Elaine asked me in 2002 not to contact Dr. Mercola about the

similarities between his

protocols and SCD. She was emphatic! ( Mercola has a proclivity to

borrow from others without credit and he never heard of SCD at the

time) He also sells a slew of stuff.

The alternative medicine community is filled with therapies which

appear as valuable adjuncts to SCD but often are not. As new scientific

findings came along Elaine was interested and open to them if they were

proven just as we are constantly asked for more scientific prooof of

the effacy of SCD. Elaine never stopped researching! And we have all

heard the cautions about fish.

It may seem to outsiders that SCD is either a cult or a dictatorship,

but Elaine was determined to keep her diet intact. I am determined to

protect her legacy.

The FAQs of the Pecanbread list ask us not to discuss other diets and

practices. The official moderators are very lenient about this because

they know the stresses and desperation autism families suffer.

I am not an official moderator and express my own POV when it comes to

things

Elaine opposed ; some of Dr. Mercola's advice qualifies.

I am not harsh, not nasty... maybe just not so tactful ... an SCD

purist who has had the good fortune to meet or correspond with people

whose lives have been saved by SCD.

The SCD diet was originated by Dr. S.V. Haas and further rearched and

illuminated by

Elaine. She was clear on her opinions and equally clear if she was

uncertain about

something.

Every now and then I get so upset with extraneous suggestions that are

brought

to SCD support lists IN GOOD FAITH that I need to take a leave of

absence before I'm told I don't belong.

(It does not trouble me to become unpopular if a person's health can be

saved as a result.) This list is supposed to be about Mutual Support,

not " Ask Jeeves. "

I urge people to learn SCD, give it a fair trial to the best of their

ability..as it is written

without complicating it. Read the book and study the two web sites

before jumping in.

Learn how to look for answers that are in the book and on the SCD

Internet sites.. Correspond with companies to determine if store bought

food is legal instead of expecting the moderators to do it all. These

women are unpaid, give of their time freely and have families and other

responsibilities just like members and it is a miracle that they can

keep their cool when I do not..

I realize that autism is complex, multi faceted with a multitude of

suspected causes

and proposed treatments and parents pursue many paths in search of a

cure.

Being an adult on the diet is different. An adult can report on how it

feels to be sick and what makes things feel better. I offer my

experience of six years on the adult and original version of the diet.

The autism version co-exists with it side by side. The integrity of

both versions has to be maintained.

SCD is not about the beliefs of Donna Gates, Jordan Rubin, Sally

Fallon, Joe Mercola or the other diets that appear to have similarities

to SCD. Everyone eats food and so food on one diet is bound to appear

on another but not ALL foods.It is about the use of specific

carbohydrates and the elimination of starch, sugar and gluten to

promote healing the gut and improving brain function.

For everything else there is Mastercard :-)

Carol F.

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

and

http://www.pecanbread.com

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Guest guest

Carol(with a sense of humor at the end), you go girl!!!!

Agape,

Carol Frilegh c.frilegh@...> wrote:

>

> Dear Carol,

>

> I understand that Dr. Mercola did not develop SCD, but interestingly

enough much of

what he says lines up with SCD. His book is not geared for people with

intestinal issues;

however, what he recommends for the " average " person is not far off

from what Elaine

suggests we do (such as removing grains, corn, soy, etc. from the diet).

>

> My point in providing the information was to help someone out with a

mercury / fish

question. Elaine does not address this in SCD, so are we not to

investigate answers to any

questions that Elaine didn't personally address?

>

> I saw no harm in providing this information to a person who is trying

to find answers. It

doesn't conflict with SCD in any way and may, in fact, end up helping

this woman's child.

>

, you did no harm. It's time for my annual rant when I perceive

that Pecanbread could use a shakeup.

Its really hard to dance at two weddings at once.!

Adam is a man. Adam has a beard. Therefore can we conclude all men have

beards?

Macs serves salads with dressing on the side.

Therefore should we conclude Macs has similarities to SCD?

Elaine asked me in 2002 not to contact Dr. Mercola about the

similarities between his

protocols and SCD. She was emphatic! ( Mercola has a proclivity to

borrow from others without credit and he never heard of SCD at the

time) He also sells a slew of stuff.

The alternative medicine community is filled with therapies which

appear as valuable adjuncts to SCD but often are not. As new scientific

findings came along Elaine was interested and open to them if they were

proven just as we are constantly asked for more scientific prooof of

the effacy of SCD. Elaine never stopped researching! And we have all

heard the cautions about fish.

It may seem to outsiders that SCD is either a cult or a dictatorship,

but Elaine was determined to keep her diet intact. I am determined to

protect her legacy.

The FAQs of the Pecanbread list ask us not to discuss other diets and

practices. The official moderators are very lenient about this because

they know the stresses and desperation autism families suffer.

I am not an official moderator and express my own POV when it comes to

things

Elaine opposed ; some of Dr. Mercola's advice qualifies.

I am not harsh, not nasty... maybe just not so tactful ... an SCD

purist who has had the good fortune to meet or correspond with people

whose lives have been saved by SCD.

The SCD diet was originated by Dr. S.V. Haas and further rearched and

illuminated by

Elaine. She was clear on her opinions and equally clear if she was

uncertain about

something.

Every now and then I get so upset with extraneous suggestions that are

brought

to SCD support lists IN GOOD FAITH that I need to take a leave of

absence before I'm told I don't belong.

(It does not trouble me to become unpopular if a person's health can be

saved as a result.) This list is supposed to be about Mutual Support,

not " Ask Jeeves. "

I urge people to learn SCD, give it a fair trial to the best of their

ability..as it is written

without complicating it. Read the book and study the two web sites

before jumping in.

Learn how to look for answers that are in the book and on the SCD

Internet sites.. Correspond with companies to determine if store bought

food is legal instead of expecting the moderators to do it all. These

women are unpaid, give of their time freely and have families and other

responsibilities just like members and it is a miracle that they can

keep their cool when I do not..

I realize that autism is complex, multi faceted with a multitude of

suspected causes

and proposed treatments and parents pursue many paths in search of a

cure.

Being an adult on the diet is different. An adult can report on how it

feels to be sick and what makes things feel better. I offer my

experience of six years on the adult and original version of the diet.

The autism version co-exists with it side by side. The integrity of

both versions has to be maintained.

SCD is not about the beliefs of Donna Gates, Jordan Rubin, Sally

Fallon, Joe Mercola or the other diets that appear to have similarities

to SCD. Everyone eats food and so food on one diet is bound to appear

on another but not ALL foods.It is about the use of specific

carbohydrates and the elimination of starch, sugar and gluten to

promote healing the gut and improving brain function.

For everything else there is Mastercard :-)

Carol F.

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

and

http://www.pecanbread.com

Share this post


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Guest guest

Carol(with a sense of humor at the end), you go girl!!!!

Agape,

Carol Frilegh c.frilegh@...> wrote:

>

> Dear Carol,

>

> I understand that Dr. Mercola did not develop SCD, but interestingly

enough much of

what he says lines up with SCD. His book is not geared for people with

intestinal issues;

however, what he recommends for the " average " person is not far off

from what Elaine

suggests we do (such as removing grains, corn, soy, etc. from the diet).

>

> My point in providing the information was to help someone out with a

mercury / fish

question. Elaine does not address this in SCD, so are we not to

investigate answers to any

questions that Elaine didn't personally address?

>

> I saw no harm in providing this information to a person who is trying

to find answers. It

doesn't conflict with SCD in any way and may, in fact, end up helping

this woman's child.

>

, you did no harm. It's time for my annual rant when I perceive

that Pecanbread could use a shakeup.

Its really hard to dance at two weddings at once.!

Adam is a man. Adam has a beard. Therefore can we conclude all men have

beards?

Macs serves salads with dressing on the side.

Therefore should we conclude Macs has similarities to SCD?

Elaine asked me in 2002 not to contact Dr. Mercola about the

similarities between his

protocols and SCD. She was emphatic! ( Mercola has a proclivity to

borrow from others without credit and he never heard of SCD at the

time) He also sells a slew of stuff.

The alternative medicine community is filled with therapies which

appear as valuable adjuncts to SCD but often are not. As new scientific

findings came along Elaine was interested and open to them if they were

proven just as we are constantly asked for more scientific prooof of

the effacy of SCD. Elaine never stopped researching! And we have all

heard the cautions about fish.

It may seem to outsiders that SCD is either a cult or a dictatorship,

but Elaine was determined to keep her diet intact. I am determined to

protect her legacy.

The FAQs of the Pecanbread list ask us not to discuss other diets and

practices. The official moderators are very lenient about this because

they know the stresses and desperation autism families suffer.

I am not an official moderator and express my own POV when it comes to

things

Elaine opposed ; some of Dr. Mercola's advice qualifies.

I am not harsh, not nasty... maybe just not so tactful ... an SCD

purist who has had the good fortune to meet or correspond with people

whose lives have been saved by SCD.

The SCD diet was originated by Dr. S.V. Haas and further rearched and

illuminated by

Elaine. She was clear on her opinions and equally clear if she was

uncertain about

something.

Every now and then I get so upset with extraneous suggestions that are

brought

to SCD support lists IN GOOD FAITH that I need to take a leave of

absence before I'm told I don't belong.

(It does not trouble me to become unpopular if a person's health can be

saved as a result.) This list is supposed to be about Mutual Support,

not " Ask Jeeves. "

I urge people to learn SCD, give it a fair trial to the best of their

ability..as it is written

without complicating it. Read the book and study the two web sites

before jumping in.

Learn how to look for answers that are in the book and on the SCD

Internet sites.. Correspond with companies to determine if store bought

food is legal instead of expecting the moderators to do it all. These

women are unpaid, give of their time freely and have families and other

responsibilities just like members and it is a miracle that they can

keep their cool when I do not..

I realize that autism is complex, multi faceted with a multitude of

suspected causes

and proposed treatments and parents pursue many paths in search of a

cure.

Being an adult on the diet is different. An adult can report on how it

feels to be sick and what makes things feel better. I offer my

experience of six years on the adult and original version of the diet.

The autism version co-exists with it side by side. The integrity of

both versions has to be maintained.

SCD is not about the beliefs of Donna Gates, Jordan Rubin, Sally

Fallon, Joe Mercola or the other diets that appear to have similarities

to SCD. Everyone eats food and so food on one diet is bound to appear

on another but not ALL foods.It is about the use of specific

carbohydrates and the elimination of starch, sugar and gluten to

promote healing the gut and improving brain function.

For everything else there is Mastercard :-)

Carol F.

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

and

http://www.pecanbread.com

Share this post


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Guest guest

Carol,

You are not obligated to consider him a reliable source, and neither is the

original woman with the fish question. This is one of the reasons that I sited

my information, so that people can investigate the info and the source for

themselves. Everyone is free to make their own judgments about posted

information. This is my point, and I am losing yours.

Jeni Lynn

Re: Fish

>

> Carol,

>

> I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. >> Jeni Lynn

In my previous response I negelected to mention I checked Dr. Mercola's

position on celiac

disease. He has an entire page of his own " Google' sites on celiac and

addresses on each

suggests the Gluten Free Diet and avoiding wheat. So he is not recognizing the

importance

of avoiding starch and sugar as well. Why should I consider him a reliable

source about

fish when he advocates the GF diet?

Carol F.

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.infohttp://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/\

>

and

http://www.pecanbread.comhttp://www.pecanbread.com/>

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Carol,

You are not obligated to consider him a reliable source, and neither is the

original woman with the fish question. This is one of the reasons that I sited

my information, so that people can investigate the info and the source for

themselves. Everyone is free to make their own judgments about posted

information. This is my point, and I am losing yours.

Jeni Lynn

Re: Fish

>

> Carol,

>

> I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. >> Jeni Lynn

In my previous response I negelected to mention I checked Dr. Mercola's

position on celiac

disease. He has an entire page of his own " Google' sites on celiac and

addresses on each

suggests the Gluten Free Diet and avoiding wheat. So he is not recognizing the

importance

of avoiding starch and sugar as well. Why should I consider him a reliable

source about

fish when he advocates the GF diet?

Carol F.

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.infohttp://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/\

>

and

http://www.pecanbread.comhttp://www.pecanbread.com/>

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Carol,

You are not obligated to consider him a reliable source, and neither is the

original woman with the fish question. This is one of the reasons that I sited

my information, so that people can investigate the info and the source for

themselves. Everyone is free to make their own judgments about posted

information. This is my point, and I am losing yours.

Jeni Lynn

Re: Fish

>

> Carol,

>

> I think you are blowing things completely out of proportion. >> Jeni Lynn

In my previous response I negelected to mention I checked Dr. Mercola's

position on celiac

disease. He has an entire page of his own " Google' sites on celiac and

addresses on each

suggests the Gluten Free Diet and avoiding wheat. So he is not recognizing the

importance

of avoiding starch and sugar as well. Why should I consider him a reliable

source about

fish when he advocates the GF diet?

Carol F.

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.infohttp://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/\

>

and

http://www.pecanbread.comhttp://www.pecanbread.com/>

Share this post


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Share on other sites
Guest guest

Thank you Carol. As a newbie, I want very much to distinguish

between " Pure " SCD and the various interpretations that exist in the

autism community. That's why I'm asking so many questions here, and

not on all those other lists. As I read and learn, I realize that the

quote-unquote " SCD diet " as practiced by many of the parents I know

isn't a true SCD diet. I want to do it right, for benefit of my son.

Therefore, I appreciate your answering all my piddly little newbie

questions (though I've read the SCD and pecanbread sites to

exhaustion, my son is a tough case and I can't find exact answers

that fit him). I also appreciate your setting us all straight on

what's true SCD as Elaine intended it, and what's not. We need

someone to separate the wheat from the chaff.

Suzanne

> >

> > Dear Carol,

> >

> > I understand that Dr. Mercola did not develop SCD, but

interestingly

> enough much of

> what he says lines up with SCD. His book is not geared for people

with

> intestinal issues;

> however, what he recommends for the " average " person is not far off

> from what Elaine

> suggests we do (such as removing grains, corn, soy, etc. from the

diet).

> >

> > My point in providing the information was to help someone out

with a

> mercury / fish

> question. Elaine does not address this in SCD, so are we not to

> investigate answers to any

> questions that Elaine didn't personally address?

> >

> > I saw no harm in providing this information to a person who is

trying

> to find answers. It

> doesn't conflict with SCD in any way and may, in fact, end up

helping

> this woman's child.

> >

>

> , you did no harm. It's time for my annual rant when I perceive

> that Pecanbread could use a shakeup.

> Its really hard to dance at two weddings at once.!

>

> Adam is a man. Adam has a beard. Therefore can we conclude all men

have

> beards?

>

> Macs serves salads with dressing on the side.

> Therefore should we conclude Macs has similarities to SCD?

>

> Elaine asked me in 2002 not to contact Dr. Mercola about the

> similarities between his

> protocols and SCD. She was emphatic! ( Mercola has a proclivity to

> borrow from others without credit and he never heard of SCD at the

> time) He also sells a slew of stuff.

>

> The alternative medicine community is filled with therapies which

> appear as valuable adjuncts to SCD but often are not. As new

scientific

> findings came along Elaine was interested and open to them if they

were

> proven just as we are constantly asked for more scientific prooof

of

> the effacy of SCD. Elaine never stopped researching! And we have

all

> heard the cautions about fish.

>

> It may seem to outsiders that SCD is either a cult or a

dictatorship,

> but Elaine was determined to keep her diet intact. I am determined

to

> protect her legacy.

>

> The FAQs of the Pecanbread list ask us not to discuss other diets

and

> practices. The official moderators are very lenient about this

because

> they know the stresses and desperation autism families suffer.

>

> I am not an official moderator and express my own POV when it

comes to

> things

> Elaine opposed ; some of Dr. Mercola's advice qualifies.

>

> I am not harsh, not nasty... maybe just not so tactful ... an SCD

> purist who has had the good fortune to meet or correspond with

people

> whose lives have been saved by SCD.

>

> The SCD diet was originated by Dr. S.V. Haas and further rearched

and

> illuminated by

> Elaine. She was clear on her opinions and equally clear if she was

> uncertain about

> something.

>

> Every now and then I get so upset with extraneous suggestions that

are

> brought

> to SCD support lists IN GOOD FAITH that I need to take a leave of

> absence before I'm told I don't belong.

> (It does not trouble me to become unpopular if a person's health

can be

> saved as a result.) This list is supposed to be about Mutual

Support,

> not " Ask Jeeves. "

>

>

> I urge people to learn SCD, give it a fair trial to the best of

their

> ability..as it is written

> without complicating it. Read the book and study the two web sites

> before jumping in.

> Learn how to look for answers that are in the book and on the SCD

> Internet sites.. Correspond with companies to determine if store

bought

> food is legal instead of expecting the moderators to do it all.

These

> women are unpaid, give of their time freely and have families and

other

> responsibilities just like members and it is a miracle that they

can

> keep their cool when I do not..

>

> I realize that autism is complex, multi faceted with a multitude of

> suspected causes

> and proposed treatments and parents pursue many paths in search

of a

> cure.

>

> Being an adult on the diet is different. An adult can report on how

it

> feels to be sick and what makes things feel better. I offer my

> experience of six years on the adult and original version of the

diet.

> The autism version co-exists with it side by side. The integrity

of

> both versions has to be maintained.

>

> SCD is not about the beliefs of Donna Gates, Jordan Rubin, Sally

> Fallon, Joe Mercola or the other diets that appear to have

similarities

> to SCD. Everyone eats food and so food on one diet is bound to

appear

> on another but not ALL foods.It is about the use of specific

> carbohydrates and the elimination of starch, sugar and gluten to

> promote healing the gut and improving brain function.

>

> For everything else there is Mastercard :-)

>

> Carol F.

>

>

>

>

>

>

> For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the

book _Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the

following websites:

> http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

> and

> http://www.pecanbread.com

>

>

>

>

>

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