Jump to content
RemedySpot.com
Sign in to follow this  
Guest guest

Re: Important message you all want to read...and share

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

Guest guest

What awesome news! Congrats, . I'm gonna try the vitamin E!

>

> I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member of

> this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> once told us as the first apraxia conference

> " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

>

> Please read the following and share with your child's

> pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

conditions like

> apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as a

group we

> can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> too.... in years.

>

> I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

> her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just' a

> Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and researcher -

> (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

>

> You may see this message more than once - posted it too...but

> I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure all

> receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

>

> Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three cheers

> for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

>

> From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

> "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,

How absolutely amazing that you found another big key to curing your

son! I'm so happy for you, and thank you for sharing with the rest

of us. Coincidentally, I just started learning about the great

benefits of Vit E supplementation for adults, and started taking

about 800 IU per day. I will most definitely start Meg on 400 IU,

and I'll be sure to post if I see big results. I learned that the

RDA for Vitamin E is intended only for prevention of deficiency, and

not as a recommendation for general health. And I was always so

concerned about getting too much!

I often wondered if Vitamin E was part of the reason that fish oils

and Carnaware are so effective. Hopefully we'll get some more

parents trying it and reporting results soon.

Kerri

>

> I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member

of

> this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> once told us as the first apraxia conference

> " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

>

> Please read the following and share with your child's

> pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

conditions like

> apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as

a group we

> can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> too.... in years.

>

> I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

> her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just'

a

> Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

researcher -

> (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

>

> You may see this message more than once - posted it

too...but

> I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure

all

> receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

>

> Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three

cheers

> for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

>

> From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

> "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,, and everyone.

That is VERY interesting, and VERY inspiring to hear about ph.

It makes me want to try Vit. E supplement with my daughter.

I too did a little reading about the signs/symptoms related to vit e

deficiency. It turns out (according to Merck) Abby has had most of

them too. (including ophthalmoplegia) If you recall I once posted how

her eyes made very fast jerky movements. She did this 2x in the

hospital as a newborn, then again shortly after coming home. When I

told her pediatrician, he claimed to examine her, and I quote " there

doesn't seem to be anything wrong "

While reading the signs/symptoms, I continued to look up the Vitamin

E information. One of the pages I read was from the Hopkins

Medicine webpage.

/post?act=reply & messageN\

um=50746

They claim to have done a study on vitamin E supplentation. And their

conclusion is high doses, (Over 400 IU) may have a higher overall

risk of dying. They go on to say most of the people in their study

are over age 60, and not all were in perfect health.

I only bring this up, because it does concern me, that in effort to

help, we " might " inadvertantly hurt our children. With your medical

expertise, maybe you can shed some light on this issue/study.

Please do not take my questions the wrong way. I am certainly not

trying to disprove your claim, nor am I trying to persuade anyone

from NOT trying a new option to help our children. I just want

reassurance.

Thank you..

Dawn in NJ

In , " kiddietalk "

<kiddietalk@...> wrote:

>

> I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member of

> this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> once told us as the first apraxia conference

> " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

>

> Please read the following and share with your child's

> pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

conditions like

> apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as

a group we

> can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> too.... in years.

>

> I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

> her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just' a

> Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

researcher -

> (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

>

> You may see this message more than once - posted it too...but

> I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure all

> receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

>

> Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three cheers

> for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

>

> From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

> "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,

Wonderful news on your detective work. We also had the same here,

ADEK were all in the low normal, when we supplemented those, we also

lost the apraxia/hypotonia/SID within about a months time, although

the levels did not reflect the huge improvements we obtained, you are

fortunate you discovered this at such an early age. We found it at

the age of 5,(my son is now 8, our story is in the archieves) and we

had for who knows how long, fat soluble vitamin deficiencies that

bone growth was affected, mild ricketts/osteoporosis that is now

resolved. You might want to get his D and K levels checked. Although,

levels test low norm, not much attention is ever given to it. When we

supplemented vitamin K, we sustained huge surges cognitively. Here is

an article on Vitamin K and oxidative stress in developing neurons if

you have not seen it yet. L-Carnitine is used extensively in children

with autism and should be with apraxia as well if the testing

justifies it. In my practice nearly all the kids are on A,D,E,K,

carnitine etc. When we supplemented my son appropriately, his

allergies were eliminated completely, same goes for most of the kids

we work with.

J Neurosci. 2003 Jul 2;23(13):5816-26. Links

Novel role of vitamin k in preventing oxidative injury to developing

oligodendrocytes and neurons.

Li J,

Lin JC,

Wang H,

JW,

Furie BC,

Furie B,

Booth SL,

Volpe JJ,

Rosenberg PA.

Department of Neurology, Division of Neuroscience, Children's

Hospital, Boston, MA 02115, USA.

Oxidative stress is believed to be the cause of cell death in

multiple disorders of the brain, including perinatal

hypoxia/ischemia. Glutamate, cystine deprivation, homocysteic acid,

and the glutathione synthesis inhibitor buthionine sulfoximine all

cause oxidative injury to immature neurons and oligodendrocytes by

depleting intracellular glutathione. Although vitamin K is not a

classical antioxidant, we report here the novel finding that vitamin

K1 and K2 (menaquinone-4) potently inhibit glutathione depletion-

mediated oxidative cell death in primary cultures of oligodendrocyte

precursors and immature fetal cortical neurons with EC50 values of

30 nm and 2 nm, respectively. The mechanism by which vitamin K

blocks oxidative injury is independent of its only known biological

function as a cofactor for gamma-glutamylcarboxylase, an enzyme

responsible for posttranslational modification of specific proteins.

Neither oligodendrocytes nor neurons possess significant vitamin K-

dependent carboxylase or epoxidase activity. Furthermore, the

vitamin K antagonists warfarin and dicoumarol and the direct

carboxylase inhibitor 2-chloro-vitamin K1 have no effect on the

protective function of vitamin K against oxidative injury. Vitamin K

does not prevent the depletion of intracellular glutathione caused

by cystine deprivation but completely blocks free radical

accumulation and cell death. The protective and potent efficacy of

this naturally occurring vitamin, with no established clinical side

effects, suggests a potential therapeutic application in preventing

oxidative damage to undifferentiated oligodendrocytes in perinatal

hypoxic/ischemic brain injury.

PMID: 12843286 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE

> >

> > I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member

> of

> > this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> > from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> > incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> > traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> > once told us as the first apraxia conference

> > " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> > http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

> >

> > Please read the following and share with your child's

> > pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> > now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

> conditions like

> > apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps

as

> a group we

> > can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> > studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> > too.... in years.

> >

> > I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just

know

> > her here as , but she is not 'just' , and

not 'just'

> a

> > Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

> researcher -

> > (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

> >

> > You may see this message more than once - posted it

> too...but

> > I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure

> all

> > receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> > didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> > to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

> >

> > Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> > pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three

> cheers

> > for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

> >

> > From: " " <claudiamorris@> A

> > "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Some interesting comments on the Hopkins study you are asking about are

attached below. Some studies can be very misleading, especially depending

upon how the statistics are run. But this is the sort of story that makes

headlines. My crazy experience with the media...I published an asthma study

in 2004 that demonstrated that arginine levels (an amino acid in nuts and

peanutbutter) are low in acute asthma. The newspapers tried to get me to say

that peanutbutter would treat asthma...that WAS NOT my conclusion, nor would

I say that (although I would love it if SKIPPY wants to fund my studies -

but again, what makes news is often far from the truth). The newsclip intro

to the local TV news broadcast was that " Oakland researcher finds a cure for

asthma " , while showing pictures of the local grocery store peanutbutter

isle. OK, I wanted to hide, but had to follow that intro and try to redirect

them. My kids thought it was cool regardless.

Also, ONLY one vitamin E study showed statistically increased risk of death

(as opposed to the other 13 studies demonstrating benefits). It was a

meta-analysis, or a statistical sum of all the studies, so misleading. In

addition, the methods and doses used in each individual study was

different - as were the type of patients involved in each of the 14 studies.

Many patients were on other vitamin supplements, so impossible to tell what

effect was from what, and most of the patients were using synthetic vs.

natural vitamin E. There is a difference between synthetic and natural, and

the synthetic E may deplete or impact natural vit E effects. Also if our

apraxic kids end up having an increased consumption/utilization of vitamin

E, decreased absorption or abnormal metabolism of vitamin E...any mechanism

that may increase the body's need for vitamin E - these kids would be in a

different catagory than the normal person on the street without a

deficiency. Give a bolus of insulin to a non-diabetic, and you may kill

them. However insulin is life saving for those whose body can't make it.

Not to say vitamin E is like insulin, but in a way...I did tell my

pediatrician after one of ph's regressions off fish oil, that I felt

like it was in fact his " insulin " , and without it...his brain just fell

apart.

See below for a commentary written about the Hopkins report. It may clarify

things. Regardless, a dose of 400 IU a day is benign for a child...but it

should be NATURAL, not synthetic. The label should read " alpha-d-tocophorol "

and NOT alpha-dl-tocophorol. Its the " dl " that tells you its synthetic, but

easy to miss this small differentiation. In addition, gamma tocophorol

should be used...and it comes in 200-300 mg gel caps. One alpha and one

gamma a day is a good safe dose...until we know more. But this is why it may

make sense to check vitamin E plasma levels first, since a documented

vitamin E deficiency may suggest the need for even higher doses. To give

you an idea, the recommended dose for vitamin E deficiency related

neuropathy, or nerve/brain damage (???which some of our apraxic kids may

just have???) is 100 mg/kg/day (or 140 IU/kg/d). This is a VERY high dose,

and is indicated for Vit E deficiency syndromes, and something that should

be monitored closely by an MD or nutritionalist. But this dose is indicated

for certain disease states of deficiency, and essential to these particular

patients in order to treat their condition. For apraxia - we don't know if

there is a deficiency that can be identified by a blood test, or if patients

need higher than normal levels to fix neurological symptoms for some other

reason. All I know is that omega 3 worked wonders in helping my son

progress with aggressive ST and OT. Yet Vitamin E is causing/has caused a

resolution of ALL symptoms of global apraxia/hypotonia and SID. My son also

has been identified recently with a severe carnitine deficiency. This is not

routinely checked in apraxia. Maybe is should be. This may be uncommon -

however to have this undiagnosed and untreated can lead to sudden death.

Scary. We are getting all my kids checked for low carnitine, in case it is

some genetic red herring totally unrelated to apraxia. However since it is

commonly reported in children with autism, I suspect this may not be that

rare. One never knows until one really looks. Although Vitamin E is an

unlikely culprit, sometimes the most complicated problems still have a

simple answer.

Unfortunately the sensationalism of headline news may scare people away from

potentially good treatments. Just like the fear of fish oil. I think it is

good to ask questions though, and not take the " unknown " at face value. So I

don't take your question the wrong way. It is actually an excellent

question, since it is so hard to sift through the literature and figure out

what is and isn't valid. It is also possible that what we are experiencing

with my boy is a fluke from some weird genetics specific to my son. But

since he sounds like the posterchild for global apraxia, I don't think this

will be an isolated observation, particularly in kids who respond to omega

supplements. Without my own relentless " why " - my son would still be

severely impaired. -

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------

The real facts about the vitamin E death warning...

Print Report | Add to Favorites

Do you ever feel fed up with all the conflicting health information in

newspapers and magazines?

This week, you'll see a story about the benefits of taking a certain

supplement. A week later, you'll read or hear a report about the dangers of

the very same substance, with warnings by an expert to stay away from it.

A good example comes from the latest " death warning " about vitamin E.

According to recent headlines, people could be " risking their lives " if they

take even moderately high doses of vitamin E [1].

To add to the confusion, researchers from Israel now tell us that some

patients with diabetes can reduce their risk of dying from heart disease by

taking — you guessed it — high doses of vitamin E [2].

This kind of conflicting evidence prompts many frustrated people to throw up

their arms in frustration at the fact that " even the experts can't agree. "

It's easy to become so frustrated and confused that you simply ignore it

all.

Don't throw your vitamin E supplements in the bin just yet. There are

several important aspects of the s Hopkins study that didn't get much

coverage in the news.

Here's a closer look at what they actually did.

The researchers looked at a number of studies carried out between 1993 and

2004. All compared vitamin use against a dummy supplement (placebo).

They found that the risk of death did not differ significantly between

people given vitamin E and those assigned to placebo.

However, the effect of vitamin E differed according to how much was used. In

the low-dose studies, vitamin E was linked with a small reduction in the

death rate.

In the high-dose studies, those who took vitamin E had a 4% increase in the

risk of death. Though this increase was small, it was statistically

significant.

It was this discovery that generated the headlines.

One problem is that the review included studies where vitamin E was taken

with other vitamins and minerals. The increased risk of death found in some

of the studies could have been linked with these other nutrients. It may

have had nothing to do with vitamin E.

What's more, many of the study groups were people with pre-existing chronic

diseases such as cancer, heart disease, Alzheimer's, Parkinson's and kidney

failure.

Even the editors of the ls of Internal Medicine (the journal where the

study was published) write that the findings may not apply to healthy

adults.

Dr. Alan Gaby, an expert in nutritional therapies, also points out that some

of the results were complicated by the fact that the vitamin E and placebo

groups were not comparable.

" In one high-dose vitamin E study (Cambridge Heart Antioxidant Study), the

vitamin E group had higher cholesterol levels and significantly greater

percentages of participants with high blood pressure, diabetes, cigarette

smoking, and severe coronary artery disease, compared with the placebo

group, " says Dr. Gaby.

" Thus, the people taking vitamin E were sicker than those taking the

placebo, a fact that could account for the slight increase in mortality seen

in the vitamin E group. "

Facts about vitamin E

There are also several different forms of vitamin E. Read the label on a

vitamin E supplement, and it will probably say alpha-tocopherol (pronounced

al-fa tocko-ferol).

Most of the studies reviewed in the s Hopkins research were done using

the synthetic (dl-alpha-tocopherol) rather than the natural

(d-alpha-tocopherol) form of alpha-tocopherol.

Natural vitamin E has roughly twice the availability of synthetic vitamin E.

Because of this, you have to take about twice as much of it to get the same

effect [4].

If there is a small negative effect of high-dose vitamin E, it might be due

in part to the use of dl-alpha-tocopherol.

Vitamin E is actually a collective term for eight naturally occurring

compounds, four tocopherols (alpha-, beta-, gamma- and delta-) and four

tocotrienols (alpha-, beta-, gamma- and delta-).

Concentrations of alpha-tocopherol are higher in wheat germ oil, almond and

sunflower oil; gamma-tocopherol is the major form of vitamin E in corn oil

and soybean oil; levels of tocotrienols are high in rice bran, barley, oats

and palm oil.

Although most research has focused on the potential health effects of

alpha-tocopherol, the three other tocopherols and four tocotrienols are also

important.

In fact, supplementing with alpha-tocopherol has been shown to reduce blood

levels of gamma- and delta-tocopherol [3].

Although they're usually more expensive than alpha-tocopherol, mixed

tocopherols are the preferable form of vitamin E, in terms of both safety

and effectiveness.

If you do use a high-dose vitamin E supplement, look for one that contains

mixed tocopherols. Some manufacturers use this term to mean the synthetic

dl-alpha-tocopherol, so you need to read the label closely.

Of course, the fact that some forms of vitamin E are natural doesn't mean it

can be consumed safely in unlimited amounts. Many supplements, including

vitamin C, iron, CLA and CoQ10 — under certain conditions — can have

negative side effects.

Even plain water has the potential to be harmful [6]!

Based on its blood-thinning effects, there are concerns that vitamin E could

cause problems if combined with medications that also thin the blood, such

as aspirin. In theory, the blood could thin too much, causing bleeding

problems.

Vitamin E may also enhance the body's sensitivity to its own insulin in

people with type II diabetes [5]. This could lead to a risk of blood sugar

levels falling too low.

If you're taking medication, it would be a good idea to talk with your

physician before using a high-dose vitamin E supplement.

The bottom line

One of the main goals of a newspaper or magazine is to sell more copies.

They'll achieve this with a sensational headline that reads something like

" vitamin E death warning " rather than one that accurately reflects the

findings of a study.

Personally, I use a multi-vitamin and mineral supplement that contains 150

IU of vitamin E (d-alpha-tocopherol succinate). Most days, I also use a meal

replacement supplement containing 30 IU of vitamin E. That gives me at least

180 IU of vitamin E each day, plus what I get from my diet.

This new research has not convinced me to use less vitamin E.

One study is not really news. Think of it as a single piece of a jigsaw

puzzle. It's only when you put the pieces together by comparing many studies

in a given field that you get an accurate picture of what's really going on.

Do you need help burning the fat from your belly or packing muscle on your

chest, shoulders and arms? This site contains everything you need to know.

It will teach you the best ways to get the lean, strong, healthy body you

deserve. Get more FREE fat-burning and muscle-building tips here »

References

1. , E.R. 3rd, Pastor-Barriuso, R., Dalal, D., Riemersma, R.A., Appel,

L.J., & Guallar, E. (2004). Meta-Analysis: High-Dosage Vitamin E

Supplementation May Increase All-Cause Mortality. ls of Internal

Medicine, 142

2. Levy, A.P., Gerstein, H.C., -Lotan, R., Ratner, R., McQueen, M.,

Lonn, E., & Pogue, J. (2004). The effect of vitamin E supplementation on

cardiovascular risk in diabetic individuals with different haptoglobin

phenotypes. Diabetes Care, 27, 2767

3. Huang, H.Y., & Appel, LJ. (2003). Supplementation of diets with

alpha-tocopherol reduces serum concentrations of gamma- and delta-tocopherol

in humans. Journal of Nutrition, 133, 3137-3140

4. Burton, G.W., Traber, M.G., Acuff, R.V., Walters, D.N., Kayden, H.,

, L., & Ingold, K.U. (1998). Human plasma and tissue alpha-tocopherol

concentrations in response to supplementation with deuterated natural and

synthetic vitamin E. American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, 67, 669-684

5. Manning, P.J., Sutherland, W.H., , R.J., , S.M., De Jong,

S.A., Ryalls, A.R., & Berry, E.A. (2004). Effect of high-dose vitamin E on

insulin resistance and associated parameters in overweight subjects.

Diabetes Care, 27, 2166-2171

6. Noakes, T.D. (2003). Overconsumption of fluids by athletes. British

Medical Journal, 327, 113-114

[ ] Re: Important message you all want to

read...and share

,, and everyone.

That is VERY interesting, and VERY inspiring to hear about ph.

It makes me want to try Vit. E supplement with my daughter.

I too did a little reading about the signs/symptoms related to vit e

deficiency. It turns out (according to Merck) Abby has had most of

them too. (including ophthalmoplegia) If you recall I once posted how

her eyes made very fast jerky movements. She did this 2x in the

hospital as a newborn, then again shortly after coming home. When I

told her pediatrician, he claimed to examine her, and I quote " there

doesn't seem to be anything wrong "

While reading the signs/symptoms, I continued to look up the Vitamin

E information. One of the pages I read was from the Hopkins

Medicine webpage.

/post?act=reply & mess

ageNum=50746

They claim to have done a study on vitamin E supplentation. And their

conclusion is high doses, (Over 400 IU) may have a higher overall

risk of dying. They go on to say most of the people in their study

are over age 60, and not all were in perfect health.

I only bring this up, because it does concern me, that in effort to

help, we " might " inadvertantly hurt our children. With your medical

expertise, maybe you can shed some light on this issue/study.

Please do not take my questions the wrong way. I am certainly not

trying to disprove your claim, nor am I trying to persuade anyone

from NOT trying a new option to help our children. I just want

reassurance.

Thank you..

Dawn in NJ

In , " kiddietalk "

<kiddietalk@...> wrote:

>

> I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member of

> this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> once told us as the first apraxia conference

> " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

>

> Please read the following and share with your child's

> pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

conditions like

> apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as

a group we

> can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> too.... in years.

>

> I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

> her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just' a

> Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

researcher -

> (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

>

> You may see this message more than once - posted it too...but

> I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure all

> receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

>

> Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three cheers

> for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

>

> From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

> "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

This is excellent. Thanks for sending. We are actually getting ADEK checked

with the next blood draw. I am worried about vit K since I suspect we will

find a low level and it is the one potential adverse effect of high dose vit

E - lower K and bleeding. I didn't know Vit K had any effects outside of

bleeding, so this really is good stuff. -

[ ] Re: Important message you all want to

read...and share

,

Wonderful news on your detective work. We also had the same here,

ADEK were all in the low normal, when we supplemented those, we also

lost the apraxia/hypotonia/SID within about a months time, although

the levels did not reflect the huge improvements we obtained, you are

fortunate you discovered this at such an early age. We found it at

the age of 5,(my son is now 8, our story is in the archieves) and we

had for who knows how long, fat soluble vitamin deficiencies that

bone growth was affected, mild ricketts/osteoporosis that is now

resolved. You might want to get his D and K levels checked. Although,

levels test low norm, not much attention is ever given to it. When we

supplemented vitamin K, we sustained huge surges cognitively. Here is

an article on Vitamin K and oxidative stress in developing neurons if

you have not seen it yet. L-Carnitine is used extensively in children

with autism and should be with apraxia as well if the testing

justifies it. In my practice nearly all the kids are on A,D,E,K,

carnitine etc. When we supplemented my son appropriately, his

allergies were eliminated completely, same goes for most of the kids

we work with.

J Neurosci. 2003 Jul 2;23(13):5816-26. Links

Novel role of vitamin k in preventing oxidative injury to developing

oligodendrocytes and neurons.

Li J,

Lin JC,

Wang H,

JW,

Furie BC,

Furie B,

Booth SL,

Volpe JJ,

Rosenberg PA.

Department of Neurology, Division of Neuroscience, Children's

Hospital, Boston, MA 02115, USA.

Oxidative stress is believed to be the cause of cell death in

multiple disorders of the brain, including perinatal

hypoxia/ischemia. Glutamate, cystine deprivation, homocysteic acid,

and the glutathione synthesis inhibitor buthionine sulfoximine all

cause oxidative injury to immature neurons and oligodendrocytes by

depleting intracellular glutathione. Although vitamin K is not a

classical antioxidant, we report here the novel finding that vitamin

K1 and K2 (menaquinone-4) potently inhibit glutathione depletion-

mediated oxidative cell death in primary cultures of oligodendrocyte

precursors and immature fetal cortical neurons with EC50 values of

30 nm and 2 nm, respectively. The mechanism by which vitamin K

blocks oxidative injury is independent of its only known biological

function as a cofactor for gamma-glutamylcarboxylase, an enzyme

responsible for posttranslational modification of specific proteins.

Neither oligodendrocytes nor neurons possess significant vitamin K-

dependent carboxylase or epoxidase activity. Furthermore, the

vitamin K antagonists warfarin and dicoumarol and the direct

carboxylase inhibitor 2-chloro-vitamin K1 have no effect on the

protective function of vitamin K against oxidative injury. Vitamin K

does not prevent the depletion of intracellular glutathione caused

by cystine deprivation but completely blocks free radical

accumulation and cell death. The protective and potent efficacy of

this naturally occurring vitamin, with no established clinical side

effects, suggests a potential therapeutic application in preventing

oxidative damage to undifferentiated oligodendrocytes in perinatal

hypoxic/ischemic brain injury.

PMID: 12843286 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE

> >

> > I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member

> of

> > this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> > from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> > incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> > traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> > once told us as the first apraxia conference

> > " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> > http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

> >

> > Please read the following and share with your child's

> > pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> > now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

> conditions like

> > apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps

as

> a group we

> > can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> > studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> > too.... in years.

> >

> > I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just

know

> > her here as , but she is not 'just' , and

not 'just'

> a

> > Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

> researcher -

> > (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

> >

> > You may see this message more than once - posted it

> too...but

> > I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure

> all

> > receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> > didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> > to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

> >

> > Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> > pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three

> cheers

> > for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

> >

> > From: " " <claudiamorris@> A

> > "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

I don't think anyone should be increasing a dose past this without close

supervision of an MD or nutritionalist, and following levels...until we have

more information. " Do no harm " is key.

I get the alpha " d " tocophorol and gamma from the general health food store.

There is also an on-line soy free " Dr. Ron's ultra pure vitamin E " . I have

to look into this product as it combines alpha and gamma, and is soy free

(but expensiver - more so that the health food store which may be just as

good). I think its a capsule though - which may be more difficult to get the

kids to take. There is also a water soluable vitamin E preparation that the

cystic fibrosis kids take. So still a lot more to learn. Honestly I am no

expert on this - I literally just started reading up on vitamin E, symptoms

of deficiency and types of supplements early July. If I had given my

nutritional courses more attention in med school, maybe I would have

recognized that all the signs of vitamin E deficiency sound like apraxia and

SID. Better late than never.

Re: [ ] Important message you all want to

read...and share

<<<<<We have just been supplementing with alpha and gamma. Gamma comes

typically in a 300 mg gel-cap. One alpha and one gamma a day is a good

start. We saw immediate OMG results within 48 hours. The surge lasted about

3 weeks, then leveled off. I did go to a higher dose after the 4th

week...and we got another surge which has brought us to where we are

now...>>>

,

Ok, answered part of my previous question when I read your post again. So

my question is, what is Alpha and Gamma (where do you get it from?) and how

much did you increase the dose after the 3 weeks when it leveled off?

Thank you..

Jill

Jill <jills2daughters@...> wrote:

Hello ,

I was very interested in what you've been doing with Vitamin E with your

son. Especially so as my 's diagnosis is very simular (Global

Dyspraxia, Hyptonia, sensory issues, etc.). currently takes 4 Nordic

Natural Omega-3.6.9 Junior capsules as well as a multi vitamin. That would

be 30 IU of Vit. E in the fish oil and another 30 IU in the multi-vitamin

for 60 IU total.

What brand and quantity of Vit. E have you been giving your son?

is 6 and will be 7 years old on Dec. 1st.

Thanks,

Jill

kiddietalk <kiddietalk@...> wrote:

I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member of

this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

once told us as the first apraxia conference

" the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

Please read the following and share with your child's

pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted conditions

like

apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as a

group we

can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

too.... in years.

I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just' a

Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and researcher -

(as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

You may see this message more than once - posted it too...but

I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure all

receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three cheers

for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Why were you looking at ADEK in the first place? Why did your son have

fat-soluble vitamin deficiencies? Any history of food allergies?

What doses of ADEK were you giving? And are you still supplementing? Did

your son also have low carnitine and are/were you supplementing that?

Thanks for the info! -

[ ] Re: Important message you all want to

read...and share

,

Wonderful news on your detective work. We also had the same here,

ADEK were all in the low normal, when we supplemented those, we also

lost the apraxia/hypotonia/SID within about a months time, although

the levels did not reflect the huge improvements we obtained, you are

fortunate you discovered this at such an early age. We found it at

the age of 5,(my son is now 8, our story is in the archieves) and we

had for who knows how long, fat soluble vitamin deficiencies that

bone growth was affected, mild ricketts/osteoporosis that is now

resolved. You might want to get his D and K levels checked. Although,

levels test low norm, not much attention is ever given to it. When we

supplemented vitamin K, we sustained huge surges cognitively. Here is

an article on Vitamin K and oxidative stress in developing neurons if

you have not seen it yet. L-Carnitine is used extensively in children

with autism and should be with apraxia as well if the testing

justifies it. In my practice nearly all the kids are on A,D,E,K,

carnitine etc. When we supplemented my son appropriately, his

allergies were eliminated completely, same goes for most of the kids

we work with.

J Neurosci. 2003 Jul 2;23(13):5816-26. Links

Novel role of vitamin k in preventing oxidative injury to developing

oligodendrocytes and neurons.

Li J,

Lin JC,

Wang H,

JW,

Furie BC,

Furie B,

Booth SL,

Volpe JJ,

Rosenberg PA.

Department of Neurology, Division of Neuroscience, Children's

Hospital, Boston, MA 02115, USA.

Oxidative stress is believed to be the cause of cell death in

multiple disorders of the brain, including perinatal

hypoxia/ischemia. Glutamate, cystine deprivation, homocysteic acid,

and the glutathione synthesis inhibitor buthionine sulfoximine all

cause oxidative injury to immature neurons and oligodendrocytes by

depleting intracellular glutathione. Although vitamin K is not a

classical antioxidant, we report here the novel finding that vitamin

K1 and K2 (menaquinone-4) potently inhibit glutathione depletion-

mediated oxidative cell death in primary cultures of oligodendrocyte

precursors and immature fetal cortical neurons with EC50 values of

30 nm and 2 nm, respectively. The mechanism by which vitamin K

blocks oxidative injury is independent of its only known biological

function as a cofactor for gamma-glutamylcarboxylase, an enzyme

responsible for posttranslational modification of specific proteins.

Neither oligodendrocytes nor neurons possess significant vitamin K-

dependent carboxylase or epoxidase activity. Furthermore, the

vitamin K antagonists warfarin and dicoumarol and the direct

carboxylase inhibitor 2-chloro-vitamin K1 have no effect on the

protective function of vitamin K against oxidative injury. Vitamin K

does not prevent the depletion of intracellular glutathione caused

by cystine deprivation but completely blocks free radical

accumulation and cell death. The protective and potent efficacy of

this naturally occurring vitamin, with no established clinical side

effects, suggests a potential therapeutic application in preventing

oxidative damage to undifferentiated oligodendrocytes in perinatal

hypoxic/ischemic brain injury.

PMID: 12843286 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE

> >

> > I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member

> of

> > this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> > from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> > incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> > traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> > once told us as the first apraxia conference

> > " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> > http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

> >

> > Please read the following and share with your child's

> > pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> > now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

> conditions like

> > apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps

as

> a group we

> > can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> > studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> > too.... in years.

> >

> > I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just

know

> > her here as , but she is not 'just' , and

not 'just'

> a

> > Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

> researcher -

> > (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

> >

> > You may see this message more than once - posted it

> too...but

> > I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure

> all

> > receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> > didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> > to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

> >

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

What awesome news! Congrats, . I'm gonna try the vitamin E!

>

> I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member of

> this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> once told us as the first apraxia conference

> " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

>

> Please read the following and share with your child's

> pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

conditions like

> apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as a

group we

> can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> too.... in years.

>

> I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

> her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just' a

> Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and researcher -

> (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

>

> You may see this message more than once - posted it too...but

> I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure all

> receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

>

> Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three cheers

> for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

>

> From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

> "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,

How absolutely amazing that you found another big key to curing your

son! I'm so happy for you, and thank you for sharing with the rest

of us. Coincidentally, I just started learning about the great

benefits of Vit E supplementation for adults, and started taking

about 800 IU per day. I will most definitely start Meg on 400 IU,

and I'll be sure to post if I see big results. I learned that the

RDA for Vitamin E is intended only for prevention of deficiency, and

not as a recommendation for general health. And I was always so

concerned about getting too much!

I often wondered if Vitamin E was part of the reason that fish oils

and Carnaware are so effective. Hopefully we'll get some more

parents trying it and reporting results soon.

Kerri

>

> I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member

of

> this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> once told us as the first apraxia conference

> " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

>

> Please read the following and share with your child's

> pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

conditions like

> apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as

a group we

> can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> too.... in years.

>

> I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

> her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just'

a

> Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

researcher -

> (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

>

> You may see this message more than once - posted it

too...but

> I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure

all

> receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

>

> Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three

cheers

> for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

>

> From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

> "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,

Wonderful news on your detective work. We also had the same here,

ADEK were all in the low normal, when we supplemented those, we also

lost the apraxia/hypotonia/SID within about a months time, although

the levels did not reflect the huge improvements we obtained, you are

fortunate you discovered this at such an early age. We found it at

the age of 5,(my son is now 8, our story is in the archieves) and we

had for who knows how long, fat soluble vitamin deficiencies that

bone growth was affected, mild ricketts/osteoporosis that is now

resolved. You might want to get his D and K levels checked. Although,

levels test low norm, not much attention is ever given to it. When we

supplemented vitamin K, we sustained huge surges cognitively. Here is

an article on Vitamin K and oxidative stress in developing neurons if

you have not seen it yet. L-Carnitine is used extensively in children

with autism and should be with apraxia as well if the testing

justifies it. In my practice nearly all the kids are on A,D,E,K,

carnitine etc. When we supplemented my son appropriately, his

allergies were eliminated completely, same goes for most of the kids

we work with.

J Neurosci. 2003 Jul 2;23(13):5816-26. Links

Novel role of vitamin k in preventing oxidative injury to developing

oligodendrocytes and neurons.

Li J,

Lin JC,

Wang H,

JW,

Furie BC,

Furie B,

Booth SL,

Volpe JJ,

Rosenberg PA.

Department of Neurology, Division of Neuroscience, Children's

Hospital, Boston, MA 02115, USA.

Oxidative stress is believed to be the cause of cell death in

multiple disorders of the brain, including perinatal

hypoxia/ischemia. Glutamate, cystine deprivation, homocysteic acid,

and the glutathione synthesis inhibitor buthionine sulfoximine all

cause oxidative injury to immature neurons and oligodendrocytes by

depleting intracellular glutathione. Although vitamin K is not a

classical antioxidant, we report here the novel finding that vitamin

K1 and K2 (menaquinone-4) potently inhibit glutathione depletion-

mediated oxidative cell death in primary cultures of oligodendrocyte

precursors and immature fetal cortical neurons with EC50 values of

30 nm and 2 nm, respectively. The mechanism by which vitamin K

blocks oxidative injury is independent of its only known biological

function as a cofactor for gamma-glutamylcarboxylase, an enzyme

responsible for posttranslational modification of specific proteins.

Neither oligodendrocytes nor neurons possess significant vitamin K-

dependent carboxylase or epoxidase activity. Furthermore, the

vitamin K antagonists warfarin and dicoumarol and the direct

carboxylase inhibitor 2-chloro-vitamin K1 have no effect on the

protective function of vitamin K against oxidative injury. Vitamin K

does not prevent the depletion of intracellular glutathione caused

by cystine deprivation but completely blocks free radical

accumulation and cell death. The protective and potent efficacy of

this naturally occurring vitamin, with no established clinical side

effects, suggests a potential therapeutic application in preventing

oxidative damage to undifferentiated oligodendrocytes in perinatal

hypoxic/ischemic brain injury.

PMID: 12843286 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE

> >

> > I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member

> of

> > this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> > from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> > incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> > traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> > once told us as the first apraxia conference

> > " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> > http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

> >

> > Please read the following and share with your child's

> > pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> > now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

> conditions like

> > apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps

as

> a group we

> > can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> > studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> > too.... in years.

> >

> > I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just

know

> > her here as , but she is not 'just' , and

not 'just'

> a

> > Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

> researcher -

> > (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

> >

> > You may see this message more than once - posted it

> too...but

> > I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure

> all

> > receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> > didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> > to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

> >

> > Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> > pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three

> cheers

> > for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

> >

> > From: " " <claudiamorris@> A

> > "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,, and everyone.

That is VERY interesting, and VERY inspiring to hear about ph.

It makes me want to try Vit. E supplement with my daughter.

I too did a little reading about the signs/symptoms related to vit e

deficiency. It turns out (according to Merck) Abby has had most of

them too. (including ophthalmoplegia) If you recall I once posted how

her eyes made very fast jerky movements. She did this 2x in the

hospital as a newborn, then again shortly after coming home. When I

told her pediatrician, he claimed to examine her, and I quote " there

doesn't seem to be anything wrong "

While reading the signs/symptoms, I continued to look up the Vitamin

E information. One of the pages I read was from the Hopkins

Medicine webpage.

/post?act=reply & messageN\

um=50746

They claim to have done a study on vitamin E supplentation. And their

conclusion is high doses, (Over 400 IU) may have a higher overall

risk of dying. They go on to say most of the people in their study

are over age 60, and not all were in perfect health.

I only bring this up, because it does concern me, that in effort to

help, we " might " inadvertantly hurt our children. With your medical

expertise, maybe you can shed some light on this issue/study.

Please do not take my questions the wrong way. I am certainly not

trying to disprove your claim, nor am I trying to persuade anyone

from NOT trying a new option to help our children. I just want

reassurance.

Thank you..

Dawn in NJ

In , " kiddietalk "

<kiddietalk@...> wrote:

>

> I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member of

> this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> once told us as the first apraxia conference

> " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

>

> Please read the following and share with your child's

> pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

conditions like

> apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as

a group we

> can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> too.... in years.

>

> I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

> her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just' a

> Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

researcher -

> (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

>

> You may see this message more than once - posted it too...but

> I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure all

> receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

>

> Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three cheers

> for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

>

> From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

> "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Some interesting comments on the Hopkins study you are asking about are

attached below. Some studies can be very misleading, especially depending

upon how the statistics are run. But this is the sort of story that makes

headlines. My crazy experience with the media...I published an asthma study

in 2004 that demonstrated that arginine levels (an amino acid in nuts and

peanutbutter) are low in acute asthma. The newspapers tried to get me to say

that peanutbutter would treat asthma...that WAS NOT my conclusion, nor would

I say that (although I would love it if SKIPPY wants to fund my studies -

but again, what makes news is often far from the truth). The newsclip intro

to the local TV news broadcast was that " Oakland researcher finds a cure for

asthma " , while showing pictures of the local grocery store peanutbutter

isle. OK, I wanted to hide, but had to follow that intro and try to redirect

them. My kids thought it was cool regardless.

Also, ONLY one vitamin E study showed statistically increased risk of death

(as opposed to the other 13 studies demonstrating benefits). It was a

meta-analysis, or a statistical sum of all the studies, so misleading. In

addition, the methods and doses used in each individual study was

different - as were the type of patients involved in each of the 14 studies.

Many patients were on other vitamin supplements, so impossible to tell what

effect was from what, and most of the patients were using synthetic vs.

natural vitamin E. There is a difference between synthetic and natural, and

the synthetic E may deplete or impact natural vit E effects. Also if our

apraxic kids end up having an increased consumption/utilization of vitamin

E, decreased absorption or abnormal metabolism of vitamin E...any mechanism

that may increase the body's need for vitamin E - these kids would be in a

different catagory than the normal person on the street without a

deficiency. Give a bolus of insulin to a non-diabetic, and you may kill

them. However insulin is life saving for those whose body can't make it.

Not to say vitamin E is like insulin, but in a way...I did tell my

pediatrician after one of ph's regressions off fish oil, that I felt

like it was in fact his " insulin " , and without it...his brain just fell

apart.

See below for a commentary written about the Hopkins report. It may clarify

things. Regardless, a dose of 400 IU a day is benign for a child...but it

should be NATURAL, not synthetic. The label should read " alpha-d-tocophorol "

and NOT alpha-dl-tocophorol. Its the " dl " that tells you its synthetic, but

easy to miss this small differentiation. In addition, gamma tocophorol

should be used...and it comes in 200-300 mg gel caps. One alpha and one

gamma a day is a good safe dose...until we know more. But this is why it may

make sense to check vitamin E plasma levels first, since a documented

vitamin E deficiency may suggest the need for even higher doses. To give

you an idea, the recommended dose for vitamin E deficiency related

neuropathy, or nerve/brain damage (???which some of our apraxic kids may

just have???) is 100 mg/kg/day (or 140 IU/kg/d). This is a VERY high dose,

and is indicated for Vit E deficiency syndromes, and something that should

be monitored closely by an MD or nutritionalist. But this dose is indicated

for certain disease states of deficiency, and essential to these particular

patients in order to treat their condition. For apraxia - we don't know if

there is a deficiency that can be identified by a blood test, or if patients

need higher than normal levels to fix neurological symptoms for some other

reason. All I know is that omega 3 worked wonders in helping my son

progress with aggressive ST and OT. Yet Vitamin E is causing/has caused a

resolution of ALL symptoms of global apraxia/hypotonia and SID. My son also

has been identified recently with a severe carnitine deficiency. This is not

routinely checked in apraxia. Maybe is should be. This may be uncommon -

however to have this undiagnosed and untreated can lead to sudden death.

Scary. We are getting all my kids checked for low carnitine, in case it is

some genetic red herring totally unrelated to apraxia. However since it is

commonly reported in children with autism, I suspect this may not be that

rare. One never knows until one really looks. Although Vitamin E is an

unlikely culprit, sometimes the most complicated problems still have a

simple answer.

Unfortunately the sensationalism of headline news may scare people away from

potentially good treatments. Just like the fear of fish oil. I think it is

good to ask questions though, and not take the " unknown " at face value. So I

don't take your question the wrong way. It is actually an excellent

question, since it is so hard to sift through the literature and figure out

what is and isn't valid. It is also possible that what we are experiencing

with my boy is a fluke from some weird genetics specific to my son. But

since he sounds like the posterchild for global apraxia, I don't think this

will be an isolated observation, particularly in kids who respond to omega

supplements. Without my own relentless " why " - my son would still be

severely impaired. -

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------

The real facts about the vitamin E death warning...

Print Report | Add to Favorites

Do you ever feel fed up with all the conflicting health information in

newspapers and magazines?

This week, you'll see a story about the benefits of taking a certain

supplement. A week later, you'll read or hear a report about the dangers of

the very same substance, with warnings by an expert to stay away from it.

A good example comes from the latest " death warning " about vitamin E.

According to recent headlines, people could be " risking their lives " if they

take even moderately high doses of vitamin E [1].

To add to the confusion, researchers from Israel now tell us that some

patients with diabetes can reduce their risk of dying from heart disease by

taking — you guessed it — high doses of vitamin E [2].

This kind of conflicting evidence prompts many frustrated people to throw up

their arms in frustration at the fact that " even the experts can't agree. "

It's easy to become so frustrated and confused that you simply ignore it

all.

Don't throw your vitamin E supplements in the bin just yet. There are

several important aspects of the s Hopkins study that didn't get much

coverage in the news.

Here's a closer look at what they actually did.

The researchers looked at a number of studies carried out between 1993 and

2004. All compared vitamin use against a dummy supplement (placebo).

They found that the risk of death did not differ significantly between

people given vitamin E and those assigned to placebo.

However, the effect of vitamin E differed according to how much was used. In

the low-dose studies, vitamin E was linked with a small reduction in the

death rate.

In the high-dose studies, those who took vitamin E had a 4% increase in the

risk of death. Though this increase was small, it was statistically

significant.

It was this discovery that generated the headlines.

One problem is that the review included studies where vitamin E was taken

with other vitamins and minerals. The increased risk of death found in some

of the studies could have been linked with these other nutrients. It may

have had nothing to do with vitamin E.

What's more, many of the study groups were people with pre-existing chronic

diseases such as cancer, heart disease, Alzheimer's, Parkinson's and kidney

failure.

Even the editors of the ls of Internal Medicine (the journal where the

study was published) write that the findings may not apply to healthy

adults.

Dr. Alan Gaby, an expert in nutritional therapies, also points out that some

of the results were complicated by the fact that the vitamin E and placebo

groups were not comparable.

" In one high-dose vitamin E study (Cambridge Heart Antioxidant Study), the

vitamin E group had higher cholesterol levels and significantly greater

percentages of participants with high blood pressure, diabetes, cigarette

smoking, and severe coronary artery disease, compared with the placebo

group, " says Dr. Gaby.

" Thus, the people taking vitamin E were sicker than those taking the

placebo, a fact that could account for the slight increase in mortality seen

in the vitamin E group. "

Facts about vitamin E

There are also several different forms of vitamin E. Read the label on a

vitamin E supplement, and it will probably say alpha-tocopherol (pronounced

al-fa tocko-ferol).

Most of the studies reviewed in the s Hopkins research were done using

the synthetic (dl-alpha-tocopherol) rather than the natural

(d-alpha-tocopherol) form of alpha-tocopherol.

Natural vitamin E has roughly twice the availability of synthetic vitamin E.

Because of this, you have to take about twice as much of it to get the same

effect [4].

If there is a small negative effect of high-dose vitamin E, it might be due

in part to the use of dl-alpha-tocopherol.

Vitamin E is actually a collective term for eight naturally occurring

compounds, four tocopherols (alpha-, beta-, gamma- and delta-) and four

tocotrienols (alpha-, beta-, gamma- and delta-).

Concentrations of alpha-tocopherol are higher in wheat germ oil, almond and

sunflower oil; gamma-tocopherol is the major form of vitamin E in corn oil

and soybean oil; levels of tocotrienols are high in rice bran, barley, oats

and palm oil.

Although most research has focused on the potential health effects of

alpha-tocopherol, the three other tocopherols and four tocotrienols are also

important.

In fact, supplementing with alpha-tocopherol has been shown to reduce blood

levels of gamma- and delta-tocopherol [3].

Although they're usually more expensive than alpha-tocopherol, mixed

tocopherols are the preferable form of vitamin E, in terms of both safety

and effectiveness.

If you do use a high-dose vitamin E supplement, look for one that contains

mixed tocopherols. Some manufacturers use this term to mean the synthetic

dl-alpha-tocopherol, so you need to read the label closely.

Of course, the fact that some forms of vitamin E are natural doesn't mean it

can be consumed safely in unlimited amounts. Many supplements, including

vitamin C, iron, CLA and CoQ10 — under certain conditions — can have

negative side effects.

Even plain water has the potential to be harmful [6]!

Based on its blood-thinning effects, there are concerns that vitamin E could

cause problems if combined with medications that also thin the blood, such

as aspirin. In theory, the blood could thin too much, causing bleeding

problems.

Vitamin E may also enhance the body's sensitivity to its own insulin in

people with type II diabetes [5]. This could lead to a risk of blood sugar

levels falling too low.

If you're taking medication, it would be a good idea to talk with your

physician before using a high-dose vitamin E supplement.

The bottom line

One of the main goals of a newspaper or magazine is to sell more copies.

They'll achieve this with a sensational headline that reads something like

" vitamin E death warning " rather than one that accurately reflects the

findings of a study.

Personally, I use a multi-vitamin and mineral supplement that contains 150

IU of vitamin E (d-alpha-tocopherol succinate). Most days, I also use a meal

replacement supplement containing 30 IU of vitamin E. That gives me at least

180 IU of vitamin E each day, plus what I get from my diet.

This new research has not convinced me to use less vitamin E.

One study is not really news. Think of it as a single piece of a jigsaw

puzzle. It's only when you put the pieces together by comparing many studies

in a given field that you get an accurate picture of what's really going on.

Do you need help burning the fat from your belly or packing muscle on your

chest, shoulders and arms? This site contains everything you need to know.

It will teach you the best ways to get the lean, strong, healthy body you

deserve. Get more FREE fat-burning and muscle-building tips here »

References

1. , E.R. 3rd, Pastor-Barriuso, R., Dalal, D., Riemersma, R.A., Appel,

L.J., & Guallar, E. (2004). Meta-Analysis: High-Dosage Vitamin E

Supplementation May Increase All-Cause Mortality. ls of Internal

Medicine, 142

2. Levy, A.P., Gerstein, H.C., -Lotan, R., Ratner, R., McQueen, M.,

Lonn, E., & Pogue, J. (2004). The effect of vitamin E supplementation on

cardiovascular risk in diabetic individuals with different haptoglobin

phenotypes. Diabetes Care, 27, 2767

3. Huang, H.Y., & Appel, LJ. (2003). Supplementation of diets with

alpha-tocopherol reduces serum concentrations of gamma- and delta-tocopherol

in humans. Journal of Nutrition, 133, 3137-3140

4. Burton, G.W., Traber, M.G., Acuff, R.V., Walters, D.N., Kayden, H.,

, L., & Ingold, K.U. (1998). Human plasma and tissue alpha-tocopherol

concentrations in response to supplementation with deuterated natural and

synthetic vitamin E. American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, 67, 669-684

5. Manning, P.J., Sutherland, W.H., , R.J., , S.M., De Jong,

S.A., Ryalls, A.R., & Berry, E.A. (2004). Effect of high-dose vitamin E on

insulin resistance and associated parameters in overweight subjects.

Diabetes Care, 27, 2166-2171

6. Noakes, T.D. (2003). Overconsumption of fluids by athletes. British

Medical Journal, 327, 113-114

[ ] Re: Important message you all want to

read...and share

,, and everyone.

That is VERY interesting, and VERY inspiring to hear about ph.

It makes me want to try Vit. E supplement with my daughter.

I too did a little reading about the signs/symptoms related to vit e

deficiency. It turns out (according to Merck) Abby has had most of

them too. (including ophthalmoplegia) If you recall I once posted how

her eyes made very fast jerky movements. She did this 2x in the

hospital as a newborn, then again shortly after coming home. When I

told her pediatrician, he claimed to examine her, and I quote " there

doesn't seem to be anything wrong "

While reading the signs/symptoms, I continued to look up the Vitamin

E information. One of the pages I read was from the Hopkins

Medicine webpage.

/post?act=reply & mess

ageNum=50746

They claim to have done a study on vitamin E supplentation. And their

conclusion is high doses, (Over 400 IU) may have a higher overall

risk of dying. They go on to say most of the people in their study

are over age 60, and not all were in perfect health.

I only bring this up, because it does concern me, that in effort to

help, we " might " inadvertantly hurt our children. With your medical

expertise, maybe you can shed some light on this issue/study.

Please do not take my questions the wrong way. I am certainly not

trying to disprove your claim, nor am I trying to persuade anyone

from NOT trying a new option to help our children. I just want

reassurance.

Thank you..

Dawn in NJ

In , " kiddietalk "

<kiddietalk@...> wrote:

>

> I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member of

> this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> once told us as the first apraxia conference

> " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

>

> Please read the following and share with your child's

> pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

conditions like

> apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as

a group we

> can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> too.... in years.

>

> I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

> her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just' a

> Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

researcher -

> (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

>

> You may see this message more than once - posted it too...but

> I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure all

> receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

>

> Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three cheers

> for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

>

> From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

> "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,

Thank you, Thank you, Thank you. This is exactly what I need to hear

or read rather.

We all have fallen victim to conflicting reports from the media about

medical studies,findings, and their reports.

And to make light on your peanut butter study.. I know my son would

be THRILLED to be told peanut butter " could " cure his excersized

induced asthma. He loves pb so much, he melts a few tablespoons in a

small dish, then pours it over his vanilla icecream! (Actually, its

very yummy.)

Again thank you for clarifing for me. And thank you for your

understanding my position of wanting further info regarding the

hopkins study.

Dawn in NJ

>

> Some interesting comments on the Hopkins study you are asking about

are

> attached below. Some studies can be very misleading, especially

depending

> upon how the statistics are run. But this is the sort of story that

makes

> headlines. My crazy experience with the media...I published an

asthma study

> in 2004 that demonstrated that arginine levels (an amino acid in

nuts and

> peanutbutter) are low in acute asthma. The newspapers tried to get

me to say

> that peanutbutter would treat asthma...that WAS NOT my conclusion,

nor would

> I say that (although I would love it if SKIPPY wants to fund my

studies -

> but again, what makes news is often far from the truth). The

newsclip intro

> to the local TV news broadcast was that " Oakland researcher finds a

cure for

> asthma " , while showing pictures of the local grocery store

peanutbutter

> isle. OK, I wanted to hide, but had to follow that intro and try to

redirect

> them. My kids thought it was cool regardless.

>

> Also, ONLY one vitamin E study showed statistically increased risk

of death

> (as opposed to the other 13 studies demonstrating benefits). It was

a

> meta-analysis, or a statistical sum of all the studies, so

misleading. In

> addition, the methods and doses used in each individual study was

> different - as were the type of patients involved in each of the 14

studies.

> Many patients were on other vitamin supplements, so impossible to

tell what

> effect was from what, and most of the patients were using synthetic

vs.

> natural vitamin E. There is a difference between synthetic and

natural, and

> the synthetic E may deplete or impact natural vit E effects. Also

if our

> apraxic kids end up having an increased consumption/utilization of

vitamin

> E, decreased absorption or abnormal metabolism of vitamin E...any

mechanism

> that may increase the body's need for vitamin E - these kids would

be in a

> different catagory than the normal person on the street without a

> deficiency. Give a bolus of insulin to a non-diabetic, and you may

kill

> them. However insulin is life saving for those whose body can't

make it.

> Not to say vitamin E is like insulin, but in a way...I did tell my

> pediatrician after one of ph's regressions off fish oil, that I

felt

> like it was in fact his " insulin " , and without it...his brain just

fell

> apart.

>

> See below for a commentary written about the Hopkins report. It may

clarify

> things. Regardless, a dose of 400 IU a day is benign for a

child...but it

> should be NATURAL, not synthetic. The label should read " alpha-d-

tocophorol "

> and NOT alpha-dl-tocophorol. Its the " dl " that tells you its

synthetic, but

> easy to miss this small differentiation. In addition, gamma

tocophorol

> should be used...and it comes in 200-300 mg gel caps. One alpha

and one

> gamma a day is a good safe dose...until we know more. But this is

why it may

> make sense to check vitamin E plasma levels first, since a

documented

> vitamin E deficiency may suggest the need for even higher doses.

To give

> you an idea, the recommended dose for vitamin E deficiency related

> neuropathy, or nerve/brain damage (???which some of our apraxic

kids may

> just have???) is 100 mg/kg/day (or 140 IU/kg/d). This is a VERY

high dose,

> and is indicated for Vit E deficiency syndromes, and something that

should

> be monitored closely by an MD or nutritionalist. But this dose is

indicated

> for certain disease states of deficiency, and essential to these

particular

> patients in order to treat their condition. For apraxia - we don't

know if

> there is a deficiency that can be identified by a blood test, or if

patients

> need higher than normal levels to fix neurological symptoms for

some other

> reason. All I know is that omega 3 worked wonders in helping my son

> progress with aggressive ST and OT. Yet Vitamin E is causing/has

caused a

> resolution of ALL symptoms of global apraxia/hypotonia and SID. My

son also

> has been identified recently with a severe carnitine deficiency.

This is not

> routinely checked in apraxia. Maybe is should be. This may be

uncommon -

> however to have this undiagnosed and untreated can lead to sudden

death.

> Scary. We are getting all my kids checked for low carnitine, in

case it is

> some genetic red herring totally unrelated to apraxia. However

since it is

> commonly reported in children with autism, I suspect this may not

be that

> rare. One never knows until one really looks. Although Vitamin E

is an

> unlikely culprit, sometimes the most complicated problems still

have a

> simple answer.

>

> Unfortunately the sensationalism of headline news may scare people

away from

> potentially good treatments. Just like the fear of fish oil. I

think it is

> good to ask questions though, and not take the " unknown " at face

value. So I

> don't take your question the wrong way. It is actually an excellent

> question, since it is so hard to sift through the literature and

figure out

> what is and isn't valid. It is also possible that what we are

experiencing

> with my boy is a fluke from some weird genetics specific to my son.

But

> since he sounds like the posterchild for global apraxia, I don't

think this

> will be an isolated observation, particularly in kids who respond

to omega

> supplements. Without my own relentless " why " - my son would still

be

> severely impaired. -

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

This is excellent. Thanks for sending. We are actually getting ADEK checked

with the next blood draw. I am worried about vit K since I suspect we will

find a low level and it is the one potential adverse effect of high dose vit

E - lower K and bleeding. I didn't know Vit K had any effects outside of

bleeding, so this really is good stuff. -

[ ] Re: Important message you all want to

read...and share

,

Wonderful news on your detective work. We also had the same here,

ADEK were all in the low normal, when we supplemented those, we also

lost the apraxia/hypotonia/SID within about a months time, although

the levels did not reflect the huge improvements we obtained, you are

fortunate you discovered this at such an early age. We found it at

the age of 5,(my son is now 8, our story is in the archieves) and we

had for who knows how long, fat soluble vitamin deficiencies that

bone growth was affected, mild ricketts/osteoporosis that is now

resolved. You might want to get his D and K levels checked. Although,

levels test low norm, not much attention is ever given to it. When we

supplemented vitamin K, we sustained huge surges cognitively. Here is

an article on Vitamin K and oxidative stress in developing neurons if

you have not seen it yet. L-Carnitine is used extensively in children

with autism and should be with apraxia as well if the testing

justifies it. In my practice nearly all the kids are on A,D,E,K,

carnitine etc. When we supplemented my son appropriately, his

allergies were eliminated completely, same goes for most of the kids

we work with.

J Neurosci. 2003 Jul 2;23(13):5816-26. Links

Novel role of vitamin k in preventing oxidative injury to developing

oligodendrocytes and neurons.

Li J,

Lin JC,

Wang H,

JW,

Furie BC,

Furie B,

Booth SL,

Volpe JJ,

Rosenberg PA.

Department of Neurology, Division of Neuroscience, Children's

Hospital, Boston, MA 02115, USA.

Oxidative stress is believed to be the cause of cell death in

multiple disorders of the brain, including perinatal

hypoxia/ischemia. Glutamate, cystine deprivation, homocysteic acid,

and the glutathione synthesis inhibitor buthionine sulfoximine all

cause oxidative injury to immature neurons and oligodendrocytes by

depleting intracellular glutathione. Although vitamin K is not a

classical antioxidant, we report here the novel finding that vitamin

K1 and K2 (menaquinone-4) potently inhibit glutathione depletion-

mediated oxidative cell death in primary cultures of oligodendrocyte

precursors and immature fetal cortical neurons with EC50 values of

30 nm and 2 nm, respectively. The mechanism by which vitamin K

blocks oxidative injury is independent of its only known biological

function as a cofactor for gamma-glutamylcarboxylase, an enzyme

responsible for posttranslational modification of specific proteins.

Neither oligodendrocytes nor neurons possess significant vitamin K-

dependent carboxylase or epoxidase activity. Furthermore, the

vitamin K antagonists warfarin and dicoumarol and the direct

carboxylase inhibitor 2-chloro-vitamin K1 have no effect on the

protective function of vitamin K against oxidative injury. Vitamin K

does not prevent the depletion of intracellular glutathione caused

by cystine deprivation but completely blocks free radical

accumulation and cell death. The protective and potent efficacy of

this naturally occurring vitamin, with no established clinical side

effects, suggests a potential therapeutic application in preventing

oxidative damage to undifferentiated oligodendrocytes in perinatal

hypoxic/ischemic brain injury.

PMID: 12843286 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE

> >

> > I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member

> of

> > this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> > from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> > incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> > traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> > once told us as the first apraxia conference

> > " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> > http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

> >

> > Please read the following and share with your child's

> > pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> > now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

> conditions like

> > apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps

as

> a group we

> > can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> > studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> > too.... in years.

> >

> > I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just

know

> > her here as , but she is not 'just' , and

not 'just'

> a

> > Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

> researcher -

> > (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

> >

> > You may see this message more than once - posted it

> too...but

> > I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure

> all

> > receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> > didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> > to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

> >

> > Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> > pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three

> cheers

> > for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

> >

> > From: " " <claudiamorris@> A

> > "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,

There are alot of moms I know that have kids with various neuro type

symptoms, that also have the same results with K supplementation. We

use Life Extension brand one every other day. The cognitve cobweb

clearing was huge. I never realized amount of change K would bring,

it balanced out my sons mood, he would get very frustrated right

before meals, sort of resembling a mild hypoglycemia, but never

tested out. But it was exactly what he would be like as a toddler,

more of an issue when he was between 2-3 if too much time went

between meals. When further researching Vit K there is a very big

connection between Vitamin K and pancreatic function, although my

sons pancreatic function is fine, I did find the studies out there in

regards to insulin/glucose loading and vitamin K status. Honestly

this puts a whole new spin on chronic illness such a s diabetes and

vitamin response.

Relationship between acute insulin response and vitamin K intake in

healthy young male volunteers.Sakamoto N, Nishiike T, Iguchi H,

Sakamoto K.

Department of Hygiene, Hyogo College of Medicine, Nisinomiya, Japan.

naomasas@...

To evaluate the effects of vitamin K (VK) on pancreatic function,

especially on acute insulin response, 25 healthy young male

volunteers were given an oral load of 75 g of glucose, and their mean

daily VK intake was estimated by a one-week food check list. After

excluding low (<20) and high (> or =25) body mass index (BMI)

subjects, the remaining 16 participants were divided into three semi-

equal groups according to VK intake. Blood VK status of the low VK

intake group tended to be poorer than that of the high intake group

(median of 5 samples: prothrombin time; 12.5 vs 12.2s and protein-

induced VK absence-factor-II; 23 vs 15 mAU/ml), but fasting plasma

glucose status was not markedly different between both groups:

[plasma glucose (PG); 87 vs 86 mg/dl, immunoreactive insulin (IRI);

6.7 vs 5.3 microU/ml, HbA1c; 4.8 vs 4.9%]. However, at 30 min after

glucose loading, PG of the low VK intake group tended to be higher

than those of the high intake group (160 vs 145 mg/dl) and IRI was

lower (36.1 vs 52.3 microU/ml). Insulinogenic index (incremental

IRI/incremental PG, 0-30 min) of the low VK intake group was

significantly lower than that of the high intake group (0.4 vs 0.9).

These results suggested that VK may play an important role on the

acute insulin response in glucose tolerance

>

> This is excellent. Thanks for sending. We are actually getting ADEK

checked

> with the next blood draw. I am worried about vit K since I suspect

we will

> find a low level and it is the one potential adverse effect of high

dose vit

> E - lower K and bleeding. I didn't know Vit K had any effects

outside of

> bleeding, so this really is good stuff. -

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

I don't think anyone should be increasing a dose past this without close

supervision of an MD or nutritionalist, and following levels...until we have

more information. " Do no harm " is key.

I get the alpha " d " tocophorol and gamma from the general health food store.

There is also an on-line soy free " Dr. Ron's ultra pure vitamin E " . I have

to look into this product as it combines alpha and gamma, and is soy free

(but expensiver - more so that the health food store which may be just as

good). I think its a capsule though - which may be more difficult to get the

kids to take. There is also a water soluable vitamin E preparation that the

cystic fibrosis kids take. So still a lot more to learn. Honestly I am no

expert on this - I literally just started reading up on vitamin E, symptoms

of deficiency and types of supplements early July. If I had given my

nutritional courses more attention in med school, maybe I would have

recognized that all the signs of vitamin E deficiency sound like apraxia and

SID. Better late than never.

Re: [ ] Important message you all want to

read...and share

<<<<<We have just been supplementing with alpha and gamma. Gamma comes

typically in a 300 mg gel-cap. One alpha and one gamma a day is a good

start. We saw immediate OMG results within 48 hours. The surge lasted about

3 weeks, then leveled off. I did go to a higher dose after the 4th

week...and we got another surge which has brought us to where we are

now...>>>

,

Ok, answered part of my previous question when I read your post again. So

my question is, what is Alpha and Gamma (where do you get it from?) and how

much did you increase the dose after the 3 weeks when it leveled off?

Thank you..

Jill

Jill <jills2daughters@...> wrote:

Hello ,

I was very interested in what you've been doing with Vitamin E with your

son. Especially so as my 's diagnosis is very simular (Global

Dyspraxia, Hyptonia, sensory issues, etc.). currently takes 4 Nordic

Natural Omega-3.6.9 Junior capsules as well as a multi vitamin. That would

be 30 IU of Vit. E in the fish oil and another 30 IU in the multi-vitamin

for 60 IU total.

What brand and quantity of Vit. E have you been giving your son?

is 6 and will be 7 years old on Dec. 1st.

Thanks,

Jill

kiddietalk <kiddietalk@...> wrote:

I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member of

this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

once told us as the first apraxia conference

" the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

Please read the following and share with your child's

pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted conditions

like

apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as a

group we

can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

too.... in years.

I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just' a

Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and researcher -

(as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

You may see this message more than once - posted it too...but

I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure all

receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three cheers

for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Why were you looking at ADEK in the first place? Why did your son have

fat-soluble vitamin deficiencies? Any history of food allergies?

What doses of ADEK were you giving? And are you still supplementing? Did

your son also have low carnitine and are/were you supplementing that?

Thanks for the info! -

[ ] Re: Important message you all want to

read...and share

,

Wonderful news on your detective work. We also had the same here,

ADEK were all in the low normal, when we supplemented those, we also

lost the apraxia/hypotonia/SID within about a months time, although

the levels did not reflect the huge improvements we obtained, you are

fortunate you discovered this at such an early age. We found it at

the age of 5,(my son is now 8, our story is in the archieves) and we

had for who knows how long, fat soluble vitamin deficiencies that

bone growth was affected, mild ricketts/osteoporosis that is now

resolved. You might want to get his D and K levels checked. Although,

levels test low norm, not much attention is ever given to it. When we

supplemented vitamin K, we sustained huge surges cognitively. Here is

an article on Vitamin K and oxidative stress in developing neurons if

you have not seen it yet. L-Carnitine is used extensively in children

with autism and should be with apraxia as well if the testing

justifies it. In my practice nearly all the kids are on A,D,E,K,

carnitine etc. When we supplemented my son appropriately, his

allergies were eliminated completely, same goes for most of the kids

we work with.

J Neurosci. 2003 Jul 2;23(13):5816-26. Links

Novel role of vitamin k in preventing oxidative injury to developing

oligodendrocytes and neurons.

Li J,

Lin JC,

Wang H,

JW,

Furie BC,

Furie B,

Booth SL,

Volpe JJ,

Rosenberg PA.

Department of Neurology, Division of Neuroscience, Children's

Hospital, Boston, MA 02115, USA.

Oxidative stress is believed to be the cause of cell death in

multiple disorders of the brain, including perinatal

hypoxia/ischemia. Glutamate, cystine deprivation, homocysteic acid,

and the glutathione synthesis inhibitor buthionine sulfoximine all

cause oxidative injury to immature neurons and oligodendrocytes by

depleting intracellular glutathione. Although vitamin K is not a

classical antioxidant, we report here the novel finding that vitamin

K1 and K2 (menaquinone-4) potently inhibit glutathione depletion-

mediated oxidative cell death in primary cultures of oligodendrocyte

precursors and immature fetal cortical neurons with EC50 values of

30 nm and 2 nm, respectively. The mechanism by which vitamin K

blocks oxidative injury is independent of its only known biological

function as a cofactor for gamma-glutamylcarboxylase, an enzyme

responsible for posttranslational modification of specific proteins.

Neither oligodendrocytes nor neurons possess significant vitamin K-

dependent carboxylase or epoxidase activity. Furthermore, the

vitamin K antagonists warfarin and dicoumarol and the direct

carboxylase inhibitor 2-chloro-vitamin K1 have no effect on the

protective function of vitamin K against oxidative injury. Vitamin K

does not prevent the depletion of intracellular glutathione caused

by cystine deprivation but completely blocks free radical

accumulation and cell death. The protective and potent efficacy of

this naturally occurring vitamin, with no established clinical side

effects, suggests a potential therapeutic application in preventing

oxidative damage to undifferentiated oligodendrocytes in perinatal

hypoxic/ischemic brain injury.

PMID: 12843286 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE

> >

> > I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member

> of

> > this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> > from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> > incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> > traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> > once told us as the first apraxia conference

> > " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> > http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

> >

> > Please read the following and share with your child's

> > pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> > now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

> conditions like

> > apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps

as

> a group we

> > can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> > studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> > too.... in years.

> >

> > I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just

know

> > her here as , but she is not 'just' , and

not 'just'

> a

> > Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

> researcher -

> > (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

> >

> > You may see this message more than once - posted it

> too...but

> > I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure

> all

> > receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> > didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> > to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

> >

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

This is fascinating giving the genetic & clinical association of celiac and

diabetes...given that patients with celiac disease likely have issues around

ALL the fat soluable vitamins because of malabsorption. -

[ ] Re: Important message you all want to

read...and share

,

There are alot of moms I know that have kids with various neuro type

symptoms, that also have the same results with K supplementation. We

use Life Extension brand one every other day. The cognitve cobweb

clearing was huge. I never realized amount of change K would bring,

it balanced out my sons mood, he would get very frustrated right

before meals, sort of resembling a mild hypoglycemia, but never

tested out. But it was exactly what he would be like as a toddler,

more of an issue when he was between 2-3 if too much time went

between meals. When further researching Vit K there is a very big

connection between Vitamin K and pancreatic function, although my

sons pancreatic function is fine, I did find the studies out there in

regards to insulin/glucose loading and vitamin K status. Honestly

this puts a whole new spin on chronic illness such a s diabetes and

vitamin response.

Relationship between acute insulin response and vitamin K intake in

healthy young male volunteers.Sakamoto N, Nishiike T, Iguchi H,

Sakamoto K.

Department of Hygiene, Hyogo College of Medicine, Nisinomiya, Japan.

naomasas@...

To evaluate the effects of vitamin K (VK) on pancreatic function,

especially on acute insulin response, 25 healthy young male

volunteers were given an oral load of 75 g of glucose, and their mean

daily VK intake was estimated by a one-week food check list. After

excluding low (<20) and high (> or =25) body mass index (BMI)

subjects, the remaining 16 participants were divided into three semi-

equal groups according to VK intake. Blood VK status of the low VK

intake group tended to be poorer than that of the high intake group

(median of 5 samples: prothrombin time; 12.5 vs 12.2s and protein-

induced VK absence-factor-II; 23 vs 15 mAU/ml), but fasting plasma

glucose status was not markedly different between both groups:

[plasma glucose (PG); 87 vs 86 mg/dl, immunoreactive insulin (IRI);

6.7 vs 5.3 microU/ml, HbA1c; 4.8 vs 4.9%]. However, at 30 min after

glucose loading, PG of the low VK intake group tended to be higher

than those of the high intake group (160 vs 145 mg/dl) and IRI was

lower (36.1 vs 52.3 microU/ml). Insulinogenic index (incremental

IRI/incremental PG, 0-30 min) of the low VK intake group was

significantly lower than that of the high intake group (0.4 vs 0.9).

These results suggested that VK may play an important role on the

acute insulin response in glucose tolerance

>

> This is excellent. Thanks for sending. We are actually getting ADEK

checked

> with the next blood draw. I am worried about vit K since I suspect

we will

> find a low level and it is the one potential adverse effect of high

dose vit

> E - lower K and bleeding. I didn't know Vit K had any effects

outside of

> bleeding, so this really is good stuff. -

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Peanuts and peanutbutter (organic without all the sugar and salt) ARE

actually very healthy (unless you are nut allergic). There was a study a few

years back that showed that peanuts improved diabetic control - and I was

like - yes...its the ARGININE. In fact foods high in arginine may in fact

turn out to be good for asthma...but that was not what my particular study

was investigating. (But the media often does not let the truth get in the

way of a good headline). The number of calls I got after that

broadcast...people hunting me down...wanting to go off all their appropriate

asthma inhalers...ugh. I have really avoided the media since. But brings us

back the the concept of healthy, natural and unprocessed foods are good for

us, and there is definitely more to nutrition and good health than it is

given credit for. (An apple a day...)

[ ] Re: Important message you all want to

read...and share

,

Thank you, Thank you, Thank you. This is exactly what I need to hear

or read rather.

We all have fallen victim to conflicting reports from the media about

medical studies,findings, and their reports.

And to make light on your peanut butter study.. I know my son would

be THRILLED to be told peanut butter " could " cure his excersized

induced asthma. He loves pb so much, he melts a few tablespoons in a

small dish, then pours it over his vanilla icecream! (Actually, its

very yummy.)

Again thank you for clarifing for me. And thank you for your

understanding my position of wanting further info regarding the

hopkins study.

Dawn in NJ

>

> Some interesting comments on the Hopkins study you are asking about

are

> attached below. Some studies can be very misleading, especially

depending

> upon how the statistics are run. But this is the sort of story that

makes

> headlines. My crazy experience with the media...I published an

asthma study

> in 2004 that demonstrated that arginine levels (an amino acid in

nuts and

> peanutbutter) are low in acute asthma. The newspapers tried to get

me to say

> that peanutbutter would treat asthma...that WAS NOT my conclusion,

nor would

> I say that (although I would love it if SKIPPY wants to fund my

studies -

> but again, what makes news is often far from the truth). The

newsclip intro

> to the local TV news broadcast was that " Oakland researcher finds a

cure for

> asthma " , while showing pictures of the local grocery store

peanutbutter

> isle. OK, I wanted to hide, but had to follow that intro and try to

redirect

> them. My kids thought it was cool regardless.

>

> Also, ONLY one vitamin E study showed statistically increased risk

of death

> (as opposed to the other 13 studies demonstrating benefits). It was

a

> meta-analysis, or a statistical sum of all the studies, so

misleading. In

> addition, the methods and doses used in each individual study was

> different - as were the type of patients involved in each of the 14

studies.

> Many patients were on other vitamin supplements, so impossible to

tell what

> effect was from what, and most of the patients were using synthetic

vs.

> natural vitamin E. There is a difference between synthetic and

natural, and

> the synthetic E may deplete or impact natural vit E effects. Also

if our

> apraxic kids end up having an increased consumption/utilization of

vitamin

> E, decreased absorption or abnormal metabolism of vitamin E...any

mechanism

> that may increase the body's need for vitamin E - these kids would

be in a

> different catagory than the normal person on the street without a

> deficiency. Give a bolus of insulin to a non-diabetic, and you may

kill

> them. However insulin is life saving for those whose body can't

make it.

> Not to say vitamin E is like insulin, but in a way...I did tell my

> pediatrician after one of ph's regressions off fish oil, that I

felt

> like it was in fact his " insulin " , and without it...his brain just

fell

> apart.

>

> See below for a commentary written about the Hopkins report. It may

clarify

> things. Regardless, a dose of 400 IU a day is benign for a

child...but it

> should be NATURAL, not synthetic. The label should read " alpha-d-

tocophorol "

> and NOT alpha-dl-tocophorol. Its the " dl " that tells you its

synthetic, but

> easy to miss this small differentiation. In addition, gamma

tocophorol

> should be used...and it comes in 200-300 mg gel caps. One alpha

and one

> gamma a day is a good safe dose...until we know more. But this is

why it may

> make sense to check vitamin E plasma levels first, since a

documented

> vitamin E deficiency may suggest the need for even higher doses.

To give

> you an idea, the recommended dose for vitamin E deficiency related

> neuropathy, or nerve/brain damage (???which some of our apraxic

kids may

> just have???) is 100 mg/kg/day (or 140 IU/kg/d). This is a VERY

high dose,

> and is indicated for Vit E deficiency syndromes, and something that

should

> be monitored closely by an MD or nutritionalist. But this dose is

indicated

> for certain disease states of deficiency, and essential to these

particular

> patients in order to treat their condition. For apraxia - we don't

know if

> there is a deficiency that can be identified by a blood test, or if

patients

> need higher than normal levels to fix neurological symptoms for

some other

> reason. All I know is that omega 3 worked wonders in helping my son

> progress with aggressive ST and OT. Yet Vitamin E is causing/has

caused a

> resolution of ALL symptoms of global apraxia/hypotonia and SID. My

son also

> has been identified recently with a severe carnitine deficiency.

This is not

> routinely checked in apraxia. Maybe is should be. This may be

uncommon -

> however to have this undiagnosed and untreated can lead to sudden

death.

> Scary. We are getting all my kids checked for low carnitine, in

case it is

> some genetic red herring totally unrelated to apraxia. However

since it is

> commonly reported in children with autism, I suspect this may not

be that

> rare. One never knows until one really looks. Although Vitamin E

is an

> unlikely culprit, sometimes the most complicated problems still

have a

> simple answer.

>

> Unfortunately the sensationalism of headline news may scare people

away from

> potentially good treatments. Just like the fear of fish oil. I

think it is

> good to ask questions though, and not take the " unknown " at face

value. So I

> don't take your question the wrong way. It is actually an excellent

> question, since it is so hard to sift through the literature and

figure out

> what is and isn't valid. It is also possible that what we are

experiencing

> with my boy is a fluke from some weird genetics specific to my son.

But

> since he sounds like the posterchild for global apraxia, I don't

think this

> will be an isolated observation, particularly in kids who respond

to omega

> supplements. Without my own relentless " why " - my son would still

be

> severely impaired. -

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,

Thank you for posting about the Vit. E and thank you also for you

wonderful comments about media hype and research reports. I do have

one question for clarification. In the Pro EFA and Pro EPA gel caps

there are 30 i.u. of Vit. E per gel cap. I am doing the high does fish

oils with my daughter so she is getting 9 gel caps per day (thus also

getting 270 I.U. of Vit. E). Are you giving your son 400 I.U. in

addition to the Vit E in his Nordic Naturals or are you just adding

enough Vit. E to get his total daily intake up to 400 I.U.?

Thank you so much for your post and your inquisitive mind. I am

eternally grateful.

Thank you, Thank you, Thank you!

Kris

On Aug 23, 2006, at 10:00 PM, wrote:

> Some interesting comments on the Hopkins study you are asking about are

> attached below. Some studies can be very misleading, especially

> depending

> upon how the statistics are run. But this is the sort of story that

> makes

> headlines. My crazy experience with the media...I published an asthma

> study

> in 2004 that demonstrated that arginine levels (an amino acid in nuts

> and

> peanutbutter) are low in acute asthma. The newspapers tried to get me

> to say

> that peanutbutter would treat asthma...that WAS NOT my conclusion,

> nor would

> I say that (although I would love it if SKIPPY wants to fund my

> studies -

> but again, what makes news is often far from the truth). The newsclip

> intro

> to the local TV news broadcast was that " Oakland researcher finds a

> cure for

> asthma " , while showing pictures of the local grocery store

> peanutbutter

> isle. OK, I wanted to hide, but had to follow that intro and try to

> redirect

> them. My kids thought it was cool regardless.

>

> Also, ONLY one vitamin E study showed statistically increased risk of

> death

> (as opposed to the other 13 studies demonstrating benefits). It was a

> meta-analysis, or a statistical sum of all the studies, so

> misleading. In

> addition, the methods and doses used in each individual study was

> different - as were the type of patients involved in each of the 14

> studies.

> Many patients were on other vitamin supplements, so impossible to

> tell what

> effect was from what, and most of the patients were using synthetic

> vs.

> natural vitamin E. There is a difference between synthetic and

> natural, and

> the synthetic E may deplete or impact natural vit E effects. Also if

> our

> apraxic kids end up having an increased consumption/utilization of

> vitamin

> E, decreased absorption or abnormal metabolism of vitamin E...any

> mechanism

> that may increase the body's need for vitamin E - these kids would be

> in a

> different catagory than the normal person on the street without a

> deficiency. Give a bolus of insulin to a non-diabetic, and you may

> kill

> them. However insulin is life saving for those whose body can't make

> it.

> Not to say vitamin E is like insulin, but in a way...I did tell my

> pediatrician after one of ph's regressions off fish oil, that I

> felt

> like it was in fact his " insulin " , and without it...his brain just

> fell

> apart.

>

> See below for a commentary written about the Hopkins report. It may

> clarify

> things. Regardless, a dose of 400 IU a day is benign for a

> child...but it

> should be NATURAL, not synthetic. The label should read

> " alpha-d-tocophorol "

> and NOT alpha-dl-tocophorol. Its the " dl " that tells you its

> synthetic, but

> easy to miss this small differentiation. In addition, gamma tocophorol

> should be used...and it comes in 200-300 mg gel caps. One alpha and

> one

> gamma a day is a good safe dose...until we know more. But this is why

> it may

> make sense to check vitamin E plasma levels first, since a documented

> vitamin E deficiency may suggest the need for even higher doses. To

> give

> you an idea, the recommended dose for vitamin E deficiency related

> neuropathy, or nerve/brain damage (???which some of our apraxic kids

> may

> just have???) is 100 mg/kg/day (or 140 IU/kg/d). This is a VERY high

> dose,

> and is indicated for Vit E deficiency syndromes, and something that

> should

> be monitored closely by an MD or nutritionalist. But this dose is

> indicated

> for certain disease states of deficiency, and essential to these

> particular

> patients in order to treat their condition. For apraxia - we don't

> know if

> there is a deficiency that can be identified by a blood test, or if

> patients

> need higher than normal levels to fix neurological symptoms for some

> other

> reason. All I know is that omega 3 worked wonders in helping my son

> progress with aggressive ST and OT. Yet Vitamin E is causing/has

> caused a

> resolution of ALL symptoms of global apraxia/hypotonia and SID. My

> son also

> has been identified recently with a severe carnitine deficiency. This

> is not

> routinely checked in apraxia. Maybe is should be. This may be

> uncommon -

> however to have this undiagnosed and untreated can lead to sudden

> death.

> Scary. We are getting all my kids checked for low carnitine, in case

> it is

> some genetic red herring totally unrelated to apraxia. However since

> it is

> commonly reported in children with autism, I suspect this may not be

> that

> rare. One never knows until one really looks. Although Vitamin E is an

> unlikely culprit, sometimes the most complicated problems still have a

> simple answer.

>

> Unfortunately the sensationalism of headline news may scare people

> away from

> potentially good treatments. Just like the fear of fish oil. I think

> it is

> good to ask questions though, and not take the " unknown " at face

> value. So I

> don't take your question the wrong way. It is actually an excellent

> question, since it is so hard to sift through the literature and

> figure out

> what is and isn't valid. It is also possible that what we are

> experiencing

> with my boy is a fluke from some weird genetics specific to my son.

> But

> since he sounds like the posterchild for global apraxia, I don't

> think this

> will be an isolated observation, particularly in kids who respond to

> omega

> supplements. Without my own relentless " why " - my son would still be

> severely impaired. -

>

> ----------------------------------------------------------

> ----------------------------------

>

> The real facts about the vitamin E death warning...

> Print Report | Add to Favorites

>

> Do you ever feel fed up with all the conflicting health information in

> newspapers and magazines?

>

> This week, you'll see a story about the benefits of taking a certain

> supplement. A week later, you'll read or hear a report about the

> dangers of

> the very same substance, with warnings by an expert to stay away from

> it.

>

> A good example comes from the latest " death warning " about vitamin E.

> According to recent headlines, people could be " risking their lives "

> if they

> take even moderately high doses of vitamin E [1].

>

> To add to the confusion, researchers from Israel now tell us that some

> patients with diabetes can reduce their risk of dying from heart

> disease by

> taking — you guessed it — high doses of vitamin E [2].

>

> This kind of conflicting evidence prompts many frustrated people to

> throw up

> their arms in frustration at the fact that " even the experts can't

> agree. "

> It's easy to become so frustrated and confused that you simply ignore

> it

> all.

>

> Don't throw your vitamin E supplements in the bin just yet. There are

> several important aspects of the s Hopkins study that didn't get

> much

> coverage in the news.

>

> Here's a closer look at what they actually did.

>

> The researchers looked at a number of studies carried out between

> 1993 and

> 2004. All compared vitamin use against a dummy supplement (placebo).

>

> They found that the risk of death did not differ significantly between

> people given vitamin E and those assigned to placebo.

>

> However, the effect of vitamin E differed according to how much was

> used. In

> the low-dose studies, vitamin E was linked with a small reduction in

> the

> death rate.

>

> In the high-dose studies, those who took vitamin E had a 4% increase

> in the

> risk of death. Though this increase was small, it was statistically

> significant.

>

> It was this discovery that generated the headlines.

>

> One problem is that the review included studies where vitamin E was

> taken

> with other vitamins and minerals. The increased risk of death found

> in some

> of the studies could have been linked with these other nutrients. It

> may

> have had nothing to do with vitamin E.

>

> What's more, many of the study groups were people with pre-existing

> chronic

> diseases such as cancer, heart disease, Alzheimer's, Parkinson's and

> kidney

> failure.

>

> Even the editors of the ls of Internal Medicine (the journal

> where the

> study was published) write that the findings may not apply to healthy

> adults.

>

> Dr. Alan Gaby, an expert in nutritional therapies, also points out

> that some

> of the results were complicated by the fact that the vitamin E and

> placebo

> groups were not comparable.

>

> " In one high-dose vitamin E study (Cambridge Heart Antioxidant

> Study), the

> vitamin E group had higher cholesterol levels and significantly

> greater

> percentages of participants with high blood pressure, diabetes,

> cigarette

> smoking, and severe coronary artery disease, compared with the placebo

> group, " says Dr. Gaby.

>

> " Thus, the people taking vitamin E were sicker than those taking the

> placebo, a fact that could account for the slight increase in

> mortality seen

> in the vitamin E group. "

>

> Facts about vitamin E

> There are also several different forms of vitamin E. Read the label

> on a

> vitamin E supplement, and it will probably say alpha-tocopherol

> (pronounced

> al-fa tocko-ferol).

>

> Most of the studies reviewed in the s Hopkins research were done

> using

> the synthetic (dl-alpha-tocopherol) rather than the natural

> (d-alpha-tocopherol) form of alpha-tocopherol.

>

> Natural vitamin E has roughly twice the availability of synthetic

> vitamin E.

> Because of this, you have to take about twice as much of it to get

> the same

> effect [4].

>

> If there is a small negative effect of high-dose vitamin E, it might

> be due

> in part to the use of dl-alpha-tocopherol.

>

> Vitamin E is actually a collective term for eight naturally occurring

> compounds, four tocopherols (alpha-, beta-, gamma- and delta-) and

> four

> tocotrienols (alpha-, beta-, gamma- and delta-).

>

> Concentrations of alpha-tocopherol are higher in wheat germ oil,

> almond and

> sunflower oil; gamma-tocopherol is the major form of vitamin E in

> corn oil

> and soybean oil; levels of tocotrienols are high in rice bran,

> barley, oats

> and palm oil.

>

> Although most research has focused on the potential health effects of

> alpha-tocopherol, the three other tocopherols and four tocotrienols

> are also

> important.

>

> In fact, supplementing with alpha-tocopherol has been shown to reduce

> blood

> levels of gamma- and delta-tocopherol [3].

>

> Although they're usually more expensive than alpha-tocopherol, mixed

> tocopherols are the preferable form of vitamin E, in terms of both

> safety

> and effectiveness.

>

> If you do use a high-dose vitamin E supplement, look for one that

> contains

> mixed tocopherols. Some manufacturers use this term to mean the

> synthetic

> dl-alpha-tocopherol, so you need to read the label closely.

>

> Of course, the fact that some forms of vitamin E are natural doesn't

> mean it

> can be consumed safely in unlimited amounts. Many supplements,

> including

> vitamin C, iron, CLA and CoQ10 — under certain conditions — can have

> negative side effects.

>

> Even plain water has the potential to be harmful [6]!

>

> Based on its blood-thinning effects, there are concerns that vitamin

> E could

> cause problems if combined with medications that also thin the blood,

> such

> as aspirin. In theory, the blood could thin too much, causing bleeding

> problems.

>

> Vitamin E may also enhance the body's sensitivity to its own insulin

> in

> people with type II diabetes [5]. This could lead to a risk of blood

> sugar

> levels falling too low.

>

> If you're taking medication, it would be a good idea to talk with your

> physician before using a high-dose vitamin E supplement.

>

> The bottom line

> One of the main goals of a newspaper or magazine is to sell more

> copies.

> They'll achieve this with a sensational headline that reads something

> like

> " vitamin E death warning " rather than one that accurately reflects the

> findings of a study.

>

> Personally, I use a multi-vitamin and mineral supplement that

> contains 150

> IU of vitamin E (d-alpha-tocopherol succinate). Most days, I also use

> a meal

> replacement supplement containing 30 IU of vitamin E. That gives me

> at least

> 180 IU of vitamin E each day, plus what I get from my diet.

>

> This new research has not convinced me to use less vitamin E.

>

> One study is not really news. Think of it as a single piece of a

> jigsaw

> puzzle. It's only when you put the pieces together by comparing many

> studies

> in a given field that you get an accurate picture of what's really

> going on.

>

> Do you need help burning the fat from your belly or packing muscle on

> your

> chest, shoulders and arms? This site contains everything you need to

> know.

> It will teach you the best ways to get the lean, strong, healthy body

> you

> deserve. Get more FREE fat-burning and muscle-building tips here »

>

> References

> 1. , E.R. 3rd, Pastor-Barriuso, R., Dalal, D., Riemersma, R.A.,

> Appel,

> L.J., & Guallar, E. (2004). Meta-Analysis: High-Dosage Vitamin E

> Supplementation May Increase All-Cause Mortality. ls of Internal

> Medicine, 142

> 2. Levy, A.P., Gerstein, H.C., -Lotan, R., Ratner, R., McQueen,

> M.,

> Lonn, E., & Pogue, J. (2004). The effect of vitamin E supplementation

> on

> cardiovascular risk in diabetic individuals with different haptoglobin

> phenotypes. Diabetes Care, 27, 2767

> 3. Huang, H.Y., & Appel, LJ. (2003). Supplementation of diets with

> alpha-tocopherol reduces serum concentrations of gamma- and

> delta-tocopherol

> in humans. Journal of Nutrition, 133, 3137-3140

> 4. Burton, G.W., Traber, M.G., Acuff, R.V., Walters, D.N., Kayden, H.,

> , L., & Ingold, K.U. (1998). Human plasma and tissue

> alpha-tocopherol

> concentrations in response to supplementation with deuterated natural

> and

> synthetic vitamin E. American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, 67,

> 669-684

> 5. Manning, P.J., Sutherland, W.H., , R.J., , S.M., De

> Jong,

> S.A., Ryalls, A.R., & Berry, E.A. (2004). Effect of high-dose vitamin

> E on

> insulin resistance and associated parameters in overweight subjects.

> Diabetes Care, 27, 2166-2171

> 6. Noakes, T.D. (2003). Overconsumption of fluids by athletes. British

> Medical Journal, 327, 113-114

>

> [ ] Re: Important message you all want to

> read...and share

>

> ,, and everyone.

> That is VERY interesting, and VERY inspiring to hear about ph.

> It makes me want to try Vit. E supplement with my daughter.

>

> I too did a little reading about the signs/symptoms related to vit e

> deficiency. It turns out (according to Merck) Abby has had most of

> them too. (including ophthalmoplegia) If you recall I once posted how

> her eyes made very fast jerky movements. She did this 2x in the

> hospital as a newborn, then again shortly after coming home. When I

> told her pediatrician, he claimed to examine her, and I quote " there

> doesn't seem to be anything wrong "

>

> While reading the signs/symptoms, I continued to look up the Vitamin

> E information. One of the pages I read was from the Hopkins

> Medicine webpage.

> /post?

> act=reply & mess

> ageNum=50746

>

> They claim to have done a study on vitamin E supplentation. And their

> conclusion is high doses, (Over 400 IU) may have a higher overall

> risk of dying. They go on to say most of the people in their study

> are over age 60, and not all were in perfect health.

>

> I only bring this up, because it does concern me, that in effort to

> help, we " might " inadvertantly hurt our children. With your medical

> expertise, maybe you can shed some light on this issue/study.

>

> Please do not take my questions the wrong way. I am certainly not

> trying to disprove your claim, nor am I trying to persuade anyone

> from NOT trying a new option to help our children. I just want

> reassurance.

>

> Thank you..

> Dawn in NJ

>

> In , " kiddietalk "

> <kiddietalk@...> wrote:

> >

> > I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member of

> > this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> > from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> > incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> > traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> > once told us as the first apraxia conference

> > " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> > http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

> >

> > Please read the following and share with your child's

> > pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> > now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

> conditions like

> > apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps as

> a group we

> > can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> > studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> > too.... in years.

> >

> > I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just know

> > her here as , but she is not 'just' , and not 'just' a

> > Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

> researcher -

> > (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

> >

> > You may see this message more than once - posted it too...but

> > I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure all

> > receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> > didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> > to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

> >

> > Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> > pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three cheers

> > for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

> >

> > From: " " <claudiamorris@...> A

> > "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Ok, you lost me a bit. Do you test for vitamins A, E, D and K through

a standard lab like CPL or Quest? Or is this through a specialized

lab? How much vit E and vit K are you giving? Where do you get Vitamin

K - I've never seen it at Whole Foods or any of my online vitamin

stores. I would love to hear more about this. My kids have both been

on carnitine for long periods of time, and it alone has never helped

their hypotonia.

Wow, I would be amazed if that small bit if vit E in carnaware played

a major part in my daughter's recovery from apraxia!

Please point me to more info about vitamin K and learning disorders.

Thanks!

> > >

> > > I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing member

> > of

> > > this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid recovery

> > > from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> > > incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> > > traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise neuroMD

> > > once told us as the first apraxia conference

> > > " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> > > http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

> > >

> > > Please read the following and share with your child's

> > > pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your child

> > > now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

> > conditions like

> > > apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps

> as

> > a group we

> > > can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for the

> > > studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them here

> > > too.... in years.

> > >

> > > I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just

> know

> > > her here as , but she is not 'just' , and

> not 'just'

> > a

> > > Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

> > researcher -

> > > (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

> > >

> > > You may see this message more than once - posted it

> > too...but

> > > I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure

> > all

> > > receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> > > didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may need

> > > to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

> > >

> > > Thank you for sharing -ironically, words can't express my

> > > pride and happiness for ph and all those like him! Three

> > cheers

> > > for you too Dr. -you put the " Dr. Mom " in Dr. Mom!

> > >

> > > From: " " <claudiamorris@> A

> > > "

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,

Took me awhile to write this up as it has been an evolvement of sorts

to where we are right now, my son has just turned 8, so we have been

at this for best part of 3.5-4 years, so it didn't happen overnight.

Where he is now, is not even what he was at when we started

supplementation specifically for him in 2004. He is starting regular

3rd grade now, no academic/speech issues at all, and in todays

educational environment for boys especially he is way beyond the

other kids in class, even the girls. The past year his physical

ability has finally caught up to his potential. Like I said you

catching this early is so very important, less deficits to make up.

Why were we looking at ADEK? Good question. If I remember correctly

it was about end of 2003, my son was on Proefa and had the typical

positive response most kids get from use. With my background, (thats

the benefit of nursing school/NP over medical school, more emphasis

is on nutritional side of health :) and nutritioanl deficiencies are

shoved down your throat ALL THE TIME. With his response to oil

supplementation,not unlike you, piqued my interest as to the why,

what was behind it as their had to be a cause that one pill, could

change so much. We got the speech improvements but not the physical

strength, we had left side weakness, my son is left handed, at the

time, no true dominance was there because of the deficit. He had no

diagnosed syndrome, nothing beyond speechissue/SID/hypotonia/low

energy. We did a complete workup, checked for guanidinoacetate

methyltransferase deficiency and various aminoacidurias, full

metabolic workup and part of that workup was vitamin levels. Vitamin

A was low 20's reference range of 20-43. Vitamin D levels were also

low norm, but further testing was done when we saw abnormalitiies on

a hand x ray for growth, he was low grotwh since the age of 3, to

see if it was a parathyroid issue which it wasn't. Vit E levels were

a bit better than A but not a whole lot, K was also low normal.

So that was the start of it. Although celiacs was ruled out, the

doctor still he said although celiacs negative, those substances

cause alot of inflammation even in non allergic people, so to lower

overall inflammation suggested GF/CF soy free,Feingold type diet for

him along with the vitamin replacements, he was reactive to sulfites

((corn syrup/high fructose corn syrup more than any other food

products) going GF/CF etc., cleared the playing field so to speak,

clean diet we had changes within days. He had environmental allergies

to trees/pollen/dust mites/mold, he did not have " typical " allerigc

response, his response to these substances were more neurological

symptoms/ inflammation. WE did serial end point sensitization which

eliminated that within 2 pollen seasons. I think it is in the

archieves, but my son who was low tone/low energy literally I think

it was the first full week of the supplementation(at the time he was

in 3 x a week PT,OT/ST) wheelbarrow walked from one end of the center

to the other about 30 feet. The week before, he would go about 5-10

feet and collapse on his forearms did not have any strength. I was

speechless as was the therapists working with him, as he had been

going to them for 5 solid months and working on just this skill

alone. A few days later, he ran the high school track w/o stopping

(1/4 a mile, before this, he would run down our path 100 feet and

that was it totally zapped, no energy at all.

As to why, we still do not know why, he had flavorings of a whole

host of childhood syndromes, but nothing clear cut, for instance

lactate/pyruvate ratio was off, not in the range of mito, but, the

ratio was still not smack normal either. He had what a celiac child

would have as far as diagnostic criteria/differential, but did not

have celiacs. So as of this moment it was classified as malabsorption

so, guess that is a new normal for these kids, as they all have

malabsorption IMO.

We tested immune function, that too, not grossly abnormal, yet not

normal either, low NK cells, low activity, but still within range.He

had a T2 shift to his immune system. He did also have mild metabolic

acidosis on initial testing, to me it was, again,not right in the

middle normal(negative for RTA).(I tend to overalnalyze lab values,

but it has gotten us this far, and I haven't been too far off or

wrong.

What I used as far as supplementation goes for the ADEK at that time

and since up till several months ago:

Dr. Rons Blue Ice CLO for A and D 1/2 teaspoon daily

X factor Gold butter oil(used this to balance the 3/6/9)about a 1/4

teaspoon

Vitamin E I have used different products Life extension Vitamin E

succinate when succinate levels were low, no longer low, so I don't

use that form now.

I have used this brand like all their products

http://www.yasoo.com/index.htm

http://www.yasoo.com/aqua-e.htm

My sons levels are fine now, and no need to do extra, beyond a

particular brand multi vitamin I use that is specifically based on

his needs right now.

Vit E is RDA amount right now

Vitamin D I use now 1000 IU of D3 in the winter, less in the summer

months, due to outdoor sun exposure. Still use this and vitamin K

separartely due to the past bone issuess

We also had low carnitine, thiamine levels, we did supplement those,

Alongside the carnitine at that time we used CoQ10/NADH/Idebenone

gave about 1/2 dose of each rotating a different one everyday.I still

give these at lower doses.

http://www.smart-drugs.net/info-idebenone.htm

(niacin/nicotinamide levels were low too) we used NADH as niacin is

tricky to get righ, and NADH helps reduce glutathione oxidation.So

a mini mito cocktail, as mito cocktail supplementation is WAY higher,

so like I said earlier, he was a sprinkling of different things. That

is how I attacked this, one piece at a time, because it was pieces of

a whole that was not working right.

I want to make sure anyone reading this understand this was

particular to my child, his deficiencies, and would not suggest

anyone just start supplementing things without doing the follow up

with a nutritionist/or md that specializes in these types of things.

You supplement one thing, and you can very easily throw off something

else. As long as you understand ADEK are synsergistic vitamins, and

really need to be in a balance. Too much A long term can be dangerous

and detrimental to bone development, and as mentioned too

much E can impede Vitamin K and blood clotting. As long as you keep

in mind what RDA amounts are, and you do not go to far above and

beyond that. More isn't alwasys better as far as this is concerned.

Right now we are at point of further growth, I found another piece of

information in regards to his methylation pathways that has garnered

us further positive aspects of overall growth. He has physically

shot up from a mere 5% height and weight at the age of 3-7.5, to the

50% range, this was about the last hurdle we had to get over, as from

birth to 3 he was @ 75% in height and weight, took a slow decline

around months 18-36, whatever occured then. He has grown 2.5 inches

since March of this year. That is whole years growth in 5 months

time, so I know things are finally in order.

I do depend more on foods as his source of vitamins like more

antioxidants, He has done so well with what we did, and honestly it

was mostly on our own, with alot of detective work.

I attended many conferences/alternative medicine/just to broaden my

views and help me forge a plan of attack, believe me a TON of

fluff/misinformation out there, so it wasn't easy. Now, I view

health/illness in a totally different view than how I was trained.

Sorry to have gotten SO long winded, but that's the story. Perhaps

you can gain some info from our journey.

Colleen

> > >

> > > I am posting this for Dr. who is an amazing

member

> > of

> > > this group, who has news to share of her own son's rapid

recovery

> > > from apraxia. As Marina just stated the following methods -as

> > > incredible as they are -are combined with appropriate and

> > > traditional speech and occupational therapies. As a wise

neuroMD

> > > once told us as the first apraxia conference

> > > " the brain responds to multiple stimuli "

> > > http://www.cherab.org/news/scientific.html

> > >

> > > Please read the following and share with your child's

> > > pediatrician...this is cutting edge information to help your

child

> > > now. Nobody knows where these previously rare multifaceted

> > conditions like

> > > apraxia are coming from in alarming rising numbers -but perhaps

> as

> > a group we

> > > can learn how to help our children today. Or you can wait for

the

> > > studies that are planned. You'll be able to read about them

here

> > > too.... in years.

> > >

> > > I know that " " doesn't always share who she is -we just

> know

> > > her here as , but she is not 'just' , and

> not 'just'

> > a

> > > Mom, is also a highly respected pediatrician and

> > researcher -

> > > (as well as being a parent of a child with apraxia)

> > >

> > > You may see this message more than once - posted it

> > too...but

> > > I wanted to send this out as a special announcement to make sure

> > all

> > > receive this information. Nobody here will be able to say " why

> > > didn't you tell me?!! " Please share this with others who may

need

> > > to know too. And please share here what you find -like .

> > >

>

>

>

>

>

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,

Thank you, Thank you, Thank you. This is exactly what I need to hear

or read rather.

We all have fallen victim to conflicting reports from the media about

medical studies,findings, and their reports.

And to make light on your peanut butter study.. I know my son would

be THRILLED to be told peanut butter " could " cure his excersized

induced asthma. He loves pb so much, he melts a few tablespoons in a

small dish, then pours it over his vanilla icecream! (Actually, its

very yummy.)

Again thank you for clarifing for me. And thank you for your

understanding my position of wanting further info regarding the

hopkins study.

Dawn in NJ

>

> Some interesting comments on the Hopkins study you are asking about

are

> attached below. Some studies can be very misleading, especially

depending

> upon how the statistics are run. But this is the sort of story that

makes

> headlines. My crazy experience with the media...I published an

asthma study

> in 2004 that demonstrated that arginine levels (an amino acid in

nuts and

> peanutbutter) are low in acute asthma. The newspapers tried to get

me to say

> that peanutbutter would treat asthma...that WAS NOT my conclusion,

nor would

> I say that (although I would love it if SKIPPY wants to fund my

studies -

> but again, what makes news is often far from the truth). The

newsclip intro

> to the local TV news broadcast was that " Oakland researcher finds a

cure for

> asthma " , while showing pictures of the local grocery store

peanutbutter

> isle. OK, I wanted to hide, but had to follow that intro and try to

redirect

> them. My kids thought it was cool regardless.

>

> Also, ONLY one vitamin E study showed statistically increased risk

of death

> (as opposed to the other 13 studies demonstrating benefits). It was

a

> meta-analysis, or a statistical sum of all the studies, so

misleading. In

> addition, the methods and doses used in each individual study was

> different - as were the type of patients involved in each of the 14

studies.

> Many patients were on other vitamin supplements, so impossible to

tell what

> effect was from what, and most of the patients were using synthetic

vs.

> natural vitamin E. There is a difference between synthetic and

natural, and

> the synthetic E may deplete or impact natural vit E effects. Also

if our

> apraxic kids end up having an increased consumption/utilization of

vitamin

> E, decreased absorption or abnormal metabolism of vitamin E...any

mechanism

> that may increase the body's need for vitamin E - these kids would

be in a

> different catagory than the normal person on the street without a

> deficiency. Give a bolus of insulin to a non-diabetic, and you may

kill

> them. However insulin is life saving for those whose body can't

make it.

> Not to say vitamin E is like insulin, but in a way...I did tell my

> pediatrician after one of ph's regressions off fish oil, that I

felt

> like it was in fact his " insulin " , and without it...his brain just

fell

> apart.

>

> See below for a commentary written about the Hopkins report. It may

clarify

> things. Regardless, a dose of 400 IU a day is benign for a

child...but it

> should be NATURAL, not synthetic. The label should read " alpha-d-

tocophorol "

> and NOT alpha-dl-tocophorol. Its the " dl " that tells you its

synthetic, but

> easy to miss this small differentiation. In addition, gamma

tocophorol

> should be used...and it comes in 200-300 mg gel caps. One alpha

and one

> gamma a day is a good safe dose...until we know more. But this is

why it may

> make sense to check vitamin E plasma levels first, since a

documented

> vitamin E deficiency may suggest the need for even higher doses.

To give

> you an idea, the recommended dose for vitamin E deficiency related

> neuropathy, or nerve/brain damage (???which some of our apraxic

kids may

> just have???) is 100 mg/kg/day (or 140 IU/kg/d). This is a VERY

high dose,

> and is indicated for Vit E deficiency syndromes, and something that

should

> be monitored closely by an MD or nutritionalist. But this dose is

indicated

> for certain disease states of deficiency, and essential to these

particular

> patients in order to treat their condition. For apraxia - we don't

know if

> there is a deficiency that can be identified by a blood test, or if

patients

> need higher than normal levels to fix neurological symptoms for

some other

> reason. All I know is that omega 3 worked wonders in helping my son

> progress with aggressive ST and OT. Yet Vitamin E is causing/has

caused a

> resolution of ALL symptoms of global apraxia/hypotonia and SID. My

son also

> has been identified recently with a severe carnitine deficiency.

This is not

> routinely checked in apraxia. Maybe is should be. This may be

uncommon -

> however to have this undiagnosed and untreated can lead to sudden

death.

> Scary. We are getting all my kids checked for low carnitine, in

case it is

> some genetic red herring totally unrelated to apraxia. However

since it is

> commonly reported in children with autism, I suspect this may not

be that

> rare. One never knows until one really looks. Although Vitamin E

is an

> unlikely culprit, sometimes the most complicated problems still

have a

> simple answer.

>

> Unfortunately the sensationalism of headline news may scare people

away from

> potentially good treatments. Just like the fear of fish oil. I

think it is

> good to ask questions though, and not take the " unknown " at face

value. So I

> don't take your question the wrong way. It is actually an excellent

> question, since it is so hard to sift through the literature and

figure out

> what is and isn't valid. It is also possible that what we are

experiencing

> with my boy is a fluke from some weird genetics specific to my son.

But

> since he sounds like the posterchild for global apraxia, I don't

think this

> will be an isolated observation, particularly in kids who respond

to omega

> supplements. Without my own relentless " why " - my son would still

be

> severely impaired. -

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

,

There are alot of moms I know that have kids with various neuro type

symptoms, that also have the same results with K supplementation. We

use Life Extension brand one every other day. The cognitve cobweb

clearing was huge. I never realized amount of change K would bring,

it balanced out my sons mood, he would get very frustrated right

before meals, sort of resembling a mild hypoglycemia, but never

tested out. But it was exactly what he would be like as a toddler,

more of an issue when he was between 2-3 if too much time went

between meals. When further researching Vit K there is a very big

connection between Vitamin K and pancreatic function, although my

sons pancreatic function is fine, I did find the studies out there in

regards to insulin/glucose loading and vitamin K status. Honestly

this puts a whole new spin on chronic illness such a s diabetes and

vitamin response.

Relationship between acute insulin response and vitamin K intake in

healthy young male volunteers.Sakamoto N, Nishiike T, Iguchi H,

Sakamoto K.

Department of Hygiene, Hyogo College of Medicine, Nisinomiya, Japan.

naomasas@...

To evaluate the effects of vitamin K (VK) on pancreatic function,

especially on acute insulin response, 25 healthy young male

volunteers were given an oral load of 75 g of glucose, and their mean

daily VK intake was estimated by a one-week food check list. After

excluding low (<20) and high (> or =25) body mass index (BMI)

subjects, the remaining 16 participants were divided into three semi-

equal groups according to VK intake. Blood VK status of the low VK

intake group tended to be poorer than that of the high intake group

(median of 5 samples: prothrombin time; 12.5 vs 12.2s and protein-

induced VK absence-factor-II; 23 vs 15 mAU/ml), but fasting plasma

glucose status was not markedly different between both groups:

[plasma glucose (PG); 87 vs 86 mg/dl, immunoreactive insulin (IRI);

6.7 vs 5.3 microU/ml, HbA1c; 4.8 vs 4.9%]. However, at 30 min after

glucose loading, PG of the low VK intake group tended to be higher

than those of the high intake group (160 vs 145 mg/dl) and IRI was

lower (36.1 vs 52.3 microU/ml). Insulinogenic index (incremental

IRI/incremental PG, 0-30 min) of the low VK intake group was

significantly lower than that of the high intake group (0.4 vs 0.9).

These results suggested that VK may play an important role on the

acute insulin response in glucose tolerance

>

> This is excellent. Thanks for sending. We are actually getting ADEK

checked

> with the next blood draw. I am worried about vit K since I suspect

we will

> find a low level and it is the one potential adverse effect of high

dose vit

> E - lower K and bleeding. I didn't know Vit K had any effects

outside of

> bleeding, so this really is good stuff. -

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...