Guest guest Posted June 3, 2000 Report Share Posted June 3, 2000 Mike did hit the nail on the head. They are still very controversial, but I am from the old school, and have used them on numerous occasions and seen them work effectively. I had one call where they were used, and upon delivery into an ER, they were promptly removed by a physician who was not trained in thier use. While I was repackaging them for the next call, an ER nurse came to the unit and asked if I could bring them back into the ER and replace them on the patient. I personally would like to see them placed back on the units. The service in my area, which I do work for on a part-time basis (Rural/Metro-MedStar) does not carry them. They are big proponents of the 10 min. scene time on a trauma related call, but most of thier runs they have well trained first responders who could place them on the BB thus reducing the time spent at the scene as well, and they could be inflated enroute. Most of us from the old schools have used them and seen them work, its the doc's we have to prove thier use to, but we won't get them into the field to see it so I don't picture them reappearing anytime soon. Just my $.02 worth too Randy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 3, 2000 Report Share Posted June 3, 2000 Wow, what a hornet's nest. This has been discussed here off and on for a while, but here's my opinion on the subject. We do still carry adult and pedi PASG (the non-military term for MAST), and I'm a proponent of them. While several studies, most notably the HFD EMS study, have shown that MAST is ineffective, I believe otherwise, and here's why. I've seen MAST work. I've HAD the patient that it nto only stabilizes, but brings back to consciousness. I understand the mechanics behind it, and I realize that a lot of the initial information was speculative and oriented in myth. But MAST has a place, especially for those services that have extended transport times and/or patients that you don't want to overload on fluid but need to manage volume loss. MAST works GREAT as an air splint, and MAST does work as a pressure dressing for large peripheral wounds below the hip. If you have them out and ready, it's not a significant increase to on-scene time to put them on as you come onto a backboard, etc., and you can wait to inflate until you're in the truck and enroute to further protect your scene time(s). My $.02. Mike MAST usage Hi Everybody, I'm new to this list and haven't seen much action so I'll throw in a Q. Does anybody here still use the MAST suit? I've heard of it not being to popular in the states these days, we still carrier in our ambulances in Western Australia, although I'm not personally in favour of it. What are other peoples thoughts? Rob Brown Emergency Response & Safety Officer Hamersley Iron Emergency Services phone: 9143 3344 fax: 9143 3478 e-mail: Brown, Lex (HI) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Law Enforcement Professionals: SAVE ON LONG DISTANCE TODAY!!! http://click./1/4170/7/_/4981/_/960065960/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 3, 2000 Report Share Posted June 3, 2000 Good Boy Mike. I agree. Henry Barber " , Mike " wrote: > Wow, what a hornet's nest. This has been discussed here off and on for a > while, but here's my opinion on the subject. > > We do still carry adult and pedi PASG (the non-military term for MAST), and > I'm a proponent of them. While several studies, most notably the HFD EMS > study, have shown that MAST is ineffective, I believe otherwise, and here's > why. > > I've seen MAST work. I've HAD the patient that it nto only stabilizes, but > brings back to consciousness. I understand the mechanics behind it, and I > realize that a lot of the initial information was speculative and oriented > in myth. But MAST has a place, especially for those services that have > extended transport times and/or patients that you don't want to overload on > fluid but need to manage volume loss. MAST works GREAT as an air splint, > and MAST does work as a pressure dressing for large peripheral wounds below > the hip. If you have them out and ready, it's not a significant increase to > on-scene time to put them on as you come onto a backboard, etc., and you can > wait to inflate until you're in the truck and enroute to further protect > your scene time(s). > > My $.02. > > Mike > > MAST usage > > Hi Everybody, > I'm new to this list and haven't seen much action so > I'll > throw in a Q. Does anybody here still use the MAST suit? > I've heard of it not being to popular in the states > these > days, we still carrier in our ambulances in Western Australia, although > I'm > not personally in favour of it. What are other peoples thoughts? > > Rob Brown > Emergency Response & Safety Officer > Hamersley Iron Emergency Services > phone: 9143 3344 > fax: 9143 3478 > e-mail: Brown, Lex (HI) > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Law Enforcement Professionals: SAVE ON LONG DISTANCE TODAY!!! > http://click./1/4170/7/_/4981/_/960065960/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Free @Backup service! Click here for your free trial of @Backup. > @Backup is the most convenient way to securely protect and access > your files online. Try it now and receive 300 MyPoints. > http://click./1/4935/7/_/4981/_/960073522/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 3, 2000 Report Share Posted June 3, 2000 I agree.....I have seen them work numerous times and in fact have been told by some physicians that if I haven't instigated that particular treatment my patient would have been dead....and I had an average of a 30-45 minute transport time to the nearest trauma facility capable of handling severe MVA trauma patients... Jim EMT-I/91B18D Henry Barber wrote: > Good Boy Mike. > > I agree. > > Henry Barber > > " , Mike " wrote: > > > Wow, what a hornet's nest. This has been discussed here off and on for a > > while, but here's my opinion on the subject. > > > > We do still carry adult and pedi PASG (the non-military term for MAST), and > > I'm a proponent of them. While several studies, most notably the HFD EMS > > study, have shown that MAST is ineffective, I believe otherwise, and here's > > why. > > > > I've seen MAST work. I've HAD the patient that it nto only stabilizes, but > > brings back to consciousness. I understand the mechanics behind it, and I > > realize that a lot of the initial information was speculative and oriented > > in myth. But MAST has a place, especially for those services that have > > extended transport times and/or patients that you don't want to overload on > > fluid but need to manage volume loss. MAST works GREAT as an air splint, > > and MAST does work as a pressure dressing for large peripheral wounds below > > the hip. If you have them out and ready, it's not a significant increase to > > on-scene time to put them on as you come onto a backboard, etc., and you can > > wait to inflate until you're in the truck and enroute to further protect > > your scene time(s). > > > > My $.02. > > > > Mike > > > > MAST usage > > > > Hi Everybody, > > I'm new to this list and haven't seen much action so > > I'll > > throw in a Q. Does anybody here still use the MAST suit? > > I've heard of it not being to popular in the states > > these > > days, we still carrier in our ambulances in Western Australia, although > > I'm > > not personally in favour of it. What are other peoples thoughts? > > > > Rob Brown > > Emergency Response & Safety Officer > > Hamersley Iron Emergency Services > > phone: 9143 3344 > > fax: 9143 3478 > > e-mail: Brown, Lex (HI) > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Law Enforcement Professionals: SAVE ON LONG DISTANCE TODAY!!! > > http://click./1/4170/7/_/4981/_/960065960/ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Free @Backup service! Click here for your free trial of @Backup. > > @Backup is the most convenient way to securely protect and access > > your files online. Try it now and receive 300 MyPoints. > > http://click./1/4935/7/_/4981/_/960073522/ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 4, 2000 Report Share Posted June 4, 2000 I just finished the BTLS course and they want you to use the MAST on pelvic fractures and b/p's under 50. Also I thought that it was a requirement for them to be on the truck according to TDH.... ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 5, 2000 Report Share Posted June 5, 2000 I think MAST, like Cordarone, points up the fact that there are two different survival statistics involved in EMS medicine. These are Survival to ER and Survival to Discharge. In the case of both these treatment modalities, there are studies that clearly indicate MAST and Cordarone improve the chance that a patient will be delivered alive to the hospital (Yes, I am totally aware these treatments are used for completely different types of patients). Many of us have had trauma patients that would likely have died before reaching the ER if we didn't use MAST. I have heard from several ER docs that they see a higher number of circulation-restored cardiac patients arriving at their ERs when Cordarone is part of the resuscitation protocol. However, in neither case so I understand, is there any research to show that use of these treatments improves the chances of Survival to Discharge over patients who didn't get them. I think there has been one such study, the result of which has not been duplicated (or has it), that suggested MAST didn't improve Survival to Discharge. As far as I know, there is no finished study or comprehensive data on Cordarone regarding StD yet. Nevertheless, does not common sense suggest that anything which improves the chances of a patient reaching the ER alive will also improve the statistical chance the patient will walk out of the hospital at some point? I mean, if they croak before arrival at the ER, they are a certain negative statistic for Survival to Discharge, right? If they are still cooking upon arrival, at least the docs have something to work with. Dave MAST usage > > Hi Everybody, > I'm new to this list and haven't seen much action so > I'll > throw in a Q. Does anybody here still use the MAST suit? > I've heard of it not being to popular in the states > these > days, we still carrier in our ambulances in Western Australia, although > I'm > not personally in favour of it. What are other peoples thoughts? > > Rob Brown > Emergency Response & Safety Officer > Hamersley Iron Emergency Services > phone: 9143 3344 > fax: 9143 3478 > e-mail: Brown, Lex (HI) > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Law Enforcement Professionals: SAVE ON LONG DISTANCE TODAY!!! > http://click./1/4170/7/_/4981/_/960065960/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Free @Backup service! Click here for your free trial of @Backup. > @Backup is the most convenient way to securely protect and access > your files online. Try it now and receive 300 MyPoints. > http://click./1/4935/7/_/4981/_/960073522/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 5, 2000 Report Share Posted June 5, 2000 In regards to both Cordarone and Mast. I elect to make it to the E.R. vs funeral home and let the chips fall where they may after my arrival. Henry Dave wrote: > I think MAST, like Cordarone, points up the fact that there are two > different survival statistics involved in EMS medicine. These are Survival > to ER and Survival to Discharge. In the case of both these treatment > modalities, there are studies that clearly indicate MAST and Cordarone > improve the chance that a patient will be delivered alive to the hospital > (Yes, I am totally aware these treatments are used for completely different > types of patients). Many of us have had trauma patients that would likely > have died before reaching the ER if we didn't use MAST. I have heard from > several ER docs that they see a higher number of circulation-restored > cardiac patients arriving at their ERs when Cordarone is part of the > resuscitation protocol. However, in neither case so I understand, is there > any research to show that use of these treatments improves the chances of > Survival to Discharge over patients who didn't get them. I think there has > been one such study, the result of which has not been duplicated (or has > it), that suggested MAST didn't improve Survival to Discharge. As far as I > know, there is no finished study or comprehensive data on Cordarone > regarding StD yet. Nevertheless, does not common sense suggest that anything > which improves the chances of a patient reaching the ER alive will also > improve the statistical chance the patient will walk out of the hospital at > some point? I mean, if they croak before arrival at the ER, they are a > certain negative statistic for Survival to Discharge, right? If they are > still cooking upon arrival, at least the docs have something to work with. > > Dave > MAST usage > > > > Hi Everybody, > > I'm new to this list and haven't seen much action so > > I'll > > throw in a Q. Does anybody here still use the MAST suit? > > I've heard of it not being to popular in the states > > these > > days, we still carrier in our ambulances in Western Australia, although > > I'm > > not personally in favour of it. What are other peoples thoughts? > > > > Rob Brown > > Emergency Response & Safety Officer > > Hamersley Iron Emergency Services > > phone: 9143 3344 > > fax: 9143 3478 > > e-mail: Brown, Lex (HI) > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Law Enforcement Professionals: SAVE ON LONG DISTANCE TODAY!!! > > http://click./1/4170/7/_/4981/_/960065960/ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Free @Backup service! Click here for your free trial of @Backup. > > @Backup is the most convenient way to securely protect and access > > your files online. Try it now and receive 300 MyPoints. > > http://click./1/4935/7/_/4981/_/960073522/ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Failed tests, classes skipped, forgotten locker combinations. > Remember the good 'ol days > http://click./1/4053/7/_/4981/_/960214865/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2000 Report Share Posted June 7, 2000 I'm right thar with ya, big guy! Dave MAST usage > > > > > > Hi Everybody, > > > I'm new to this list and haven't seen much action so > > > I'll > > > throw in a Q. Does anybody here still use the MAST suit? > > > I've heard of it not being to popular in the states > > > these > > > days, we still carrier in our ambulances in Western Australia, although > > > I'm > > > not personally in favour of it. What are other peoples thoughts? > > > > > > Rob Brown > > > Emergency Response & Safety Officer > > > Hamersley Iron Emergency Services > > > phone: 9143 3344 > > > fax: 9143 3478 > > > e-mail: Brown, Lex (HI) > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Law Enforcement Professionals: SAVE ON LONG DISTANCE TODAY!!! > > > http://click./1/4170/7/_/4981/_/960065960/ > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Free @Backup service! Click here for your free trial of @Backup. > > > @Backup is the most convenient way to securely protect and access > > > your files online. Try it now and receive 300 MyPoints. > > > http://click./1/4935/7/_/4981/_/960073522/ > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Failed tests, classes skipped, forgotten locker combinations. > > Remember the good 'ol days > > http://click./1/4053/7/_/4981/_/960214865/ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.