Re: NORMI Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and Remediation Ind.

[Guest guest]

Sharon, It's a competitive world.. You do business with one you can trust. How you develop trust is a function of experience and maturity.. How do you choose a health provider? There is traditional medicine and alternative medicine each shaking their heads at the other. Is medicine a science or is it an art? Can we agree that while science is the basis of medicine the practice of applying that science is more of an art? Life does not allow one to purchase a safe or reliable solution to an IAQ problem as one would go into a shop and buy a newspaper. The membership of this list is doing its best to provide truthful and reliable information to the professionals here. Unfortunately technology is advancing at a faster pace than many can keep up with... I trust all those giving the certifications listed are doing so in good faith each filling their own nitch. Cordially, Gibala =========================== NORMI Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and Remediation Ind.Contact: Kat DonnellDirector of Public Relationswww.kdonnell.com katdonnellhotmailNORMI Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within the Mold and Remediation IndustryComprehensive Products and Services Benefit the Professional as well as the ConsumerThe National Organization of Remediation and Mold Inspectors (NORMI), based in Abita Springs, Louisiana, is the fastest growing organization within the mold and remediation industry. With the growing awareness of the health hazards caused by molds and black water, more contractors and entrepreneurs are opting for remediation and mold certifications to add to their services. Hurricane Katrina brought the issue to the forefront as the world still watches the dangerously high levels of mold contamination unfold. NORMI offers certifications on many levels that include Certified Mold Inspector (CMI), Certified Biocide Applicator (CBA), Certified Environmental Evaluator (CEE), Certified Mold Remediator (CMR), Certified Indoor Environmental Advisor (CIEA), and NORMI Trained Professional (NTP). NORMI is also offering a new program, the First Responders Awareness Program, which is available to all active members. The program, the first of its kind, educates Fire Houses, Police and other first responders, with regard to mold, how it spreads and how to protect themselves and others from the imminent dangers of mold and black water. An additional service now being added is the NORMI Healthier Home Warranty; a THREE-YEAR renewable warranty with an Annual Compliance Review that guarantees the customer a cleaner, healthier, safer indoor environment in regards microbes, mold, bacteria, and other contaminants. NORMI is the first organization in the industry to offer such comprehensive programs and is pioneering the way toward healthier indoor environments. Classes are held in different parts of the United States.In the continued support of its active members, NORMI has partnered with several well known agencies to offer services such as liability and omissions Insurance at affordable rates, health insurance at affordable rates, pre-qualified leads, thermographic and other training from the Thermographic Institute, regularly scheduled continuing education programs, premium websites and other ongoing support systems.As this organization continues to grow, they are positioning themselves to become the world leader in the latest of hot topics and business trends.For more information visit www.NORMI.org or www.besttrainingschool.com or call ### I have a question: As Jane D Homeowner , how am I suppose to know who is REALLY able to determine what needs to be done within my problem home? Do I call a: CMI, CBA, CEE, CMR, CIEA, NTP, IEP, PE, CIEC, CIE, or CIH? Or am I just SOL to get some clear, consistent answers? Sharon

[Guest guest]

I'm wondering if any of you would like to take a stab at explaining what these zillions of various organizations and certifications do or mean. Are there any definitive lists?What do people have to do to become mold remediators? Is there a degree involved, or an organizational certification program, state exam??? How much time is involved? Is there anything like an apprenticeship for those without mycology (???) degrees?

What are the respected certifications and which ones are basically bad jokes on the clients?In case you want to know why, its because it is something I've been looking for and haven't been able to find for a long time. (This list of remediator/IAQ consultant acronyms)

[Guest guest]

Trademark?Is that the proper designation to be using for something that effects public health like this?It doesn't seem appropriate. And the standards really should be PUBLIC documents, otherwise, HOW CAN PEOPLE FOLLOW THEM?

The whole picture doesn't make any sense.I was told for a long time that 'S520' was the best standard for mold remediation, but I haven't been able to get a copy.The reason I want it is to be able to show some public health officials of one of the most progressive cities in the US how mold remediation *should* be done. However, I can't get a copy of this supposedly important spec. They can't get a copy.. (and their budgets are tight - they should not have to pay!)These specs should be downloadable on the web.There is something wrong with this picture!

Standsrds should be open to be seen by the public, otherwise, how can they use them? Quote them.This is important!Now wonder there are so many different 'certification organizations' - If one organization isn't willing to take a LEADERSHIP role and publish these standards for open viewing and use and debate.. (and THAT would totally legitimate THEIR certifications) then there is a power vaccumn that these fly-by-night organizations sense and they are moving in to EXPLOIT it.

Can't you see the connection?Thank you for publishing this...On 12/8/06, kengib . <

jkg4902@...> wrote:

One of the probable reasons there are so many designations other than PE which is designated by state law is the others are the trade marked property of the certifying body that awards the designation.

When one body has a popular designation they ain't allowin nobody to share the stage.

Re: NORMI Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and Remediation Ind.

I'm wondering if any of you would like to take a stab at explaining what these zillions of various organizations and certifications do or mean. Are there any definitive lists?What do people have to do to become mold remediators? Is there a degree involved, or an organizational certification program, state exam??? How much time is involved? Is there anything like an apprenticeship for those without mycology (???) degrees? What are the respected certifications and which ones are basically bad jokes on the clients?In case you want to know why, its because it is something I've been looking for and haven't been able to find for a long time. (This list of remediator/IAQ consultant acronyms)

[Guest guest]

The various publications … i.e. like

a dictionary you have to pay for. It takes a lot of time and money and if

someone doesn’t get paid or reimbursed for the cost who will offer the

materials…. i.e. medicine. Medicine is for the benefit of those who find

it effective yet (unfortunately) is not available to all who need them.

Just a thought,

Bob/Ma.

From: iequality [mailto:iequality ] On Behalf Of LiveSimply

Sent: Friday, December 08, 2006

3:20 PM

To: iequality ;

jkg4902@...; grimes@...; SNK1955@...

Subject: Re: NORMI

Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and Remediation Ind.

Trademark?

Is that the proper designation to be using for something that effects public

health like this?

It doesn't seem appropriate.

And the standards really should be PUBLIC documents, otherwise, HOW CAN PEOPLE

FOLLOW THEM?

The whole picture doesn't make any sense.

I was told for a long time that 'S520' was the best standard for mold

remediation, but I haven't been able to get a copy.

The reason I want it is to be able to show some public health officials of one

of the most progressive cities in the US how mold remediation *should* be done.

However, I can't get a copy of this supposedly important spec. They can't get a

copy.. (and their budgets are tight - they should not have to pay!)

These specs should be downloadable on the web.

There is something wrong with this picture!

Standsrds should be open to be seen by the public, otherwise, how can they use

them? Quote them.

This is important!

Now wonder there are so many different 'certification organizations' - If one

organization isn't willing to take a LEADERSHIP role and publish these

standards for open viewing and use and debate.. (and THAT would totally

legitimate THEIR certifications) then there is a power vaccumn that these

fly-by-night organizations sense and they are moving in to EXPLOIT it.

Can't you see the connection?

Thank you for publishing this...

On 12/8/06, kengib .

< jkg4902hotmail>

wrote:

One of the probable reasons there are so many

designations other than PE which is designated by state law is the others are

the trade marked property of the certifying body that awards the

designation.

When one body has a popular designation they ain't

allowin nobody to share the stage.

Re:

NORMI Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and

Remediation Ind.

I'm wondering if any of

you would like to take a stab at explaining what these zillions of various

organizations and certifications do or mean. Are there any definitive lists?

What do people have to do to become mold remediators? Is there a degree

involved, or an organizational certification program, state exam??? How much

time is involved? Is there anything like an apprenticeship for those without

mycology (???) degrees?

What are the respected certifications and which ones are basically bad jokes on

the clients?

In case you want to know why, its because it is something I've been looking for

and haven't been able to find for a long time. (This list of remediator/IAQ

consultant acronyms)

[Guest guest]

I do agree completely that "copyright" is the correct word.... I was not fully awake when I wrote what I did... On the rest of your remarks please allow me to comment. A public mandate may allow the public library to purchase the building or fire codes but the issuer of the code charges dearly for their services and their products. A municipality may purchase 50 copies of a fire or plumbing code at $75 each so each of their engineers may have a usable copy. When a builder or architect needs a copy he has to then go to the association that maintains and distributes the code and he pays the fee. Ken Re: NORMI Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and Remediation Ind.I'm wondering if any of you would like to take a stab at explaining what these zillions of various organizations and certifications do or mean Are there any definitive lists?What do people have to do to become mold remediators? Is there a degree involved, or an organizational certification program, state exam??? How much time is involved? Is there anything like an apprenticeship for those without mycology (???) degrees? What are the respected certifications and which ones are basically bad jokes on the clients?In case you want to know why, its because it is something I've been looking for and haven't been able to find for a long time. (This list of remediator/IAQ consultant acronyms)

[Guest guest]

LiveSimply,

Not really any different than standards or guidelines from a host of other entities that provide direction to government and industry (e.g., Intl. Building Code, ASHRAE, ASTM, etc.). Hard to imagine a budget so tight that a govt. official couldn't afford a $120 reference if they really thought it was worthwhile. From one health official to another, I'd actually recommend that they first get the 1999 ACGIH Bioaerosols Assessment and Control. But that book isn't free either.

If you want, you can pass my name and e-mail address along to the health officials you are working with.

Curtis Redington, RS

Environmental Quality Specialist

City of Wichita Dept. of Environmental Health

Wichita, KS

credington@...

-----Original Message-----From: iequality [mailto:iequality ]On Behalf Of LiveSimplySent: Friday, December 08, 2006 2:20 PMTo: iequality ; jkg4902@...; grimes@...; SNK1955@...Subject: Re: NORMI Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and Remediation Ind.

Trademark?Is that the proper designation to be using for something that effects public health like this?It doesn't seem appropriate. And the standards really should be PUBLIC documents, otherwise, HOW CAN PEOPLE FOLLOW THEM? The whole picture doesn't make any sense.I was told for a long time that 'S520' was the best standard for mold remediation, but I haven't been able to get a copy.The reason I want it is to be able to show some public health officials of one of the most progressive cities in the US how mold remediation *should* be done. However, I can't get a copy of this supposedly important spec. They can't get a copy.. (and their budgets are tight - they should not have to pay!)These specs should be downloadable on the web.There is something wrong with this picture! Standsrds should be open to be seen by the public, otherwise, how can they use them? Quote them.This is important!Now wonder there are so many different 'certification organizations' - If one organization isn't willing to take a LEADERSHIP role and publish these standards for open viewing and use and debate.. (and THAT would totally legitimate THEIR certifications) then there is a power vaccumn that these fly-by-night organizations sense and they are moving in to EXPLOIT it. Can't you see the connection?Thank you for publishing this...

On 12/8/06, kengib . < jkg4902hotmail> wrote:

One of the probable reasons there are so many designations other than PE which is designated by state law is the others are the trade marked property of the certifying body that awards the designation.

When one body has a popular designation they ain't allowin nobody to share the stage.

Re: NORMI Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and Remediation Ind.

I'm wondering if any of you would like to take a stab at explaining what these zillions of various organizations and certifications do or mean. Are there any definitive lists?What do people have to do to become mold remediators? Is there a degree involved, or an organizational certification program, state exam??? How much time is involved? Is there anything like an apprenticeship for those without mycology (???) degrees? What are the respected certifications and which ones are basically bad jokes on the clients?In case you want to know why, its because it is something I've been looking for and haven't been able to find for a long time. (This list of remediator/IAQ consultant acronyms)

[Guest guest]

What if they had access to some kind of custom web-based software application that could manage the workflow process and structure the document, for free. And then build a CDROM ISO image that could be burned to cdroms very cheaply..

What i am getting at, is that if the actual publication cost (the analogy would be to the current cost of printing) was approaching zero.. what is the other cost.. and how important is it? Is it a significant income stream for the organization? Or are there other reasons why it needs to be so expensive?

Look, upfront, if I am being too pushy, just let me know. I don't want anyone to do anything they aren't confortable with. I am just trying to make the argument that having this spec available for free would bring SERIOUS and IMPORTANT benefits to your community that FAR outweigh whatever profit (the amount you get over the printing cost and the cost to manage the transactions, etc.)

Think about it.I used to do work like this. (technical publishing) I know what I'm talking about when I say that the publishing of it could be done professionally and very VERY cheaply..

[Guest guest]

To answer your questions please review the

following sites:

http://www.iaqcouncil.org/Professionals/evaluate%20your%20certification.htm

http://www.iaqcouncil.org/Consumers/consumers.htm

Bob/Ma

From: iequality [mailto:iequality ] On Behalf Of LiveSimply

Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2006

6:05 PM

To: iequality

Subject: Re: NORMI

Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and Remediation Ind.

I'm wondering if any of you would like to take a stab

at explaining what these zillions of various organizations and certifications

do or mean. Are there any definitive lists?

What do people have to do to become mold remediators? Is there a degree

involved, or an organizational certification program, state exam??? How much

time is involved? Is there anything like an apprenticeship for those without

mycology (???) degrees?

What are the respected certifications and which ones are basically bad jokes on

the clients?

In case you want to know why, its because it is something I've been looking for

and haven't been able to find for a long time. (This list of remediator/IAQ

consultant acronyms)

[Guest guest]

The various publications … i.e. like

a dictionary you have to pay for. It takes a lot of time and money and if

someone doesn’t get paid or reimbursed for the cost who will offer the

materials…. i.e. medicine. Medicine is for the benefit of those who find

it effective yet (unfortunately) is not available to all who need them.

Just a thought,

Bob/Ma.

From: iequality [mailto:iequality ] On Behalf Of LiveSimply

Sent: Friday, December 08, 2006

3:20 PM

To: iequality ;

jkg4902@...; grimes@...; SNK1955@...

Subject: Re: NORMI

Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and Remediation Ind.

Trademark?

Is that the proper designation to be using for something that effects public

health like this?

It doesn't seem appropriate.

And the standards really should be PUBLIC documents, otherwise, HOW CAN PEOPLE

FOLLOW THEM?

The whole picture doesn't make any sense.

I was told for a long time that 'S520' was the best standard for mold

remediation, but I haven't been able to get a copy.

The reason I want it is to be able to show some public health officials of one

of the most progressive cities in the US how mold remediation *should* be done.

However, I can't get a copy of this supposedly important spec. They can't get a

copy.. (and their budgets are tight - they should not have to pay!)

These specs should be downloadable on the web.

There is something wrong with this picture!

Standsrds should be open to be seen by the public, otherwise, how can they use

them? Quote them.

This is important!

Now wonder there are so many different 'certification organizations' - If one

organization isn't willing to take a LEADERSHIP role and publish these

standards for open viewing and use and debate.. (and THAT would totally

legitimate THEIR certifications) then there is a power vaccumn that these

fly-by-night organizations sense and they are moving in to EXPLOIT it.

Can't you see the connection?

Thank you for publishing this...

On 12/8/06, kengib .

< jkg4902hotmail>

wrote:

One of the probable reasons there are so many

designations other than PE which is designated by state law is the others are

the trade marked property of the certifying body that awards the

designation.

When one body has a popular designation they ain't

allowin nobody to share the stage.

Re:

NORMI Becomes the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and

Remediation Ind.

I'm wondering if any of

you would like to take a stab at explaining what these zillions of various

organizations and certifications do or mean. Are there any definitive lists?

What do people have to do to become mold remediators? Is there a degree

involved, or an organizational certification program, state exam??? How much

time is involved? Is there anything like an apprenticeship for those without

mycology (???) degrees?

What are the respected certifications and which ones are basically bad jokes on

the clients?

In case you want to know why, its because it is something I've been looking for

and haven't been able to find for a long time. (This list of remediator/IAQ

consultant acronyms)

[Guest guest]

The real PROBLEM and the reason why the approach of using the cheapest to one approach is TOO EXPENSIVE for ALL of us is that the EXPENSE often ends up being paid by SOMEONE ELSE.. i.e. expense to people's permanent health so that one IRRESPONSIBLE person can make more money without any real accountability. The person who makes the money, say by ignoring maintenance, is not the person who pays for his actions, the people who have to live or work there PAY.

In order for our BROKEN tort system to actually work, people who are injured HAVE to sue, in fact, they should be ENCOURAGED as their civic duty to sue, otherwise, there is no sanction against that 10 or 15% of people who don't have a functioning conscience - those narcissistic people we all know cause so many problems - doing things that have a HUGE cost to society - in the final analysis. * Because they are not like the rest of us in that they don't empathize like normal human beings do.* Because they know they can get away with it.Because of the built-in obstacles we have in our society to people suing, we USED to acknowledge that the amount injured people sued for, should be substantially larger than the amount which the injurer had actually caused to them, punitive damages. To make up 'for the ones that got away'.

That was because at best only one in ten or one in one hundred ever were able to sue. (We used to admit that.. now we pretend that all injured parties get justice, which is so untrue that it is an obscenity to say.)

But NOW, that margin we may have used to have has been whittled down SO much and also the percentage of people who sue has been whittled down.. so the 'self-policing' approach has really broken and its a rare case that even goes so far as a lawsuit being filed.. Meanwhile social safety nets have been dismantled and medical costs have skyrocketed. And jobs for the people most likely to be injured (the poor and often, un-degreed) are disappearing, at least in the US.

So, tens or hundreds of thousands or millions of lives are ruined... and a really evil situation is ignored more and more..On 12/11/06, Geyer

wrote:

Bob/Ma

I like it!! ³My attorney once told me: ³The cheapest is also the most

expensive (in the end) and the most expensive is also the cheapest (in the

end)!² Very good. My favorite is: Pay peanuts, get monkeys!

>

>

>

>

> You stated Š. If people CAN'T KNOW WHAT THE DIFFERENCE

> IS, why hire a real pro when any fool can claim that they are a pro..

>

> Its no different than a roofer, builder, or any other trade. Buyer be ware.

> The owners (like commercial or business owners) must do their home work!!! We

> cant blame others for what we do not take the time and learn. For years the

> public has been hiring the CHEAPEST contractor and in the end they get burnt

> and then the blame the industry. Blame transference!! Its never the clients

> fault. The contractor made them hire them or was the carrot too tempting. Most

> of the time when I get called in, the client has done its homework. This also

> makes my job easier. I think the media is also working on putting a spot light

> on this trade as well. Please consider, we can only help those who call us.

> They hold the calling end of the phone.

>

>

>

> Bob/Ma.

>

[Guest guest]

,

I like that one too… pay peanuts get

monkeys…. I will remember that one.

Bob/Ma.

From: iequality [mailto:iequality ] On Behalf Of Geyer

Sent: Monday, December 11, 2006

1:12 AM

To: iequality

Subject: NORMI Becomes

the Fastest Growing Organization within Mold and Remediation Ind.

Bob/Ma

I like it!! ³My attorney once told me: ³The cheapest is also the most

expensive (in the end) and the most expensive is also the cheapest (in the

end)!² Very good. My favorite is: Pay peanuts, get monkeys!

On 12/8/06 3:14 PM, " Bob " <BobEnvironmentalAirTechs>

wrote:

>

>

>

>

> You stated Ð. If people CAN'T KNOW WHAT THE DIFFERENCE

> IS, why hire a real pro when any fool can claim that they are a pro..

>

> Its no different than a roofer, builder, or any other trade. Buyer be

ware.

> The owners (like commercial or business owners) must do their home work!!!

We

> cant blame others for what we do not take the time and learn. For years

the

> public has been hiring the CHEAPEST contractor and in the end they get

burnt

> and then the blame the industry. Blame transference!! Its never the

clients

> fault. The contractor made them hire them or was the carrot too tempting.

Most

> of the time when I get called in, the client has done its homework. This

also

> makes my job easier. I think the media is also working on putting a spot light

> on this trade as well. Please consider, we can only help those who call

us.

> They hold the calling end of the phone.

>

>

>

> Bob/Ma.

>