Re: Re: making a town and theme park

[Guest guest]

> Ooooo, great idea! A " Village of Your Own Kind " Did anyone see that

> Twilite Zone about a month ago? It was a remake of an old episode.

> This woman looks different from everyone else, and is considered

> hideously ugly in a society that values conforming above all else. The

> doctors keep trying to change her face to 'normal', but it never works.

> Finally, they tell her that she has to go live in " The Village of Her

> Own Kind " . She is horrified, and doesn't want to go. All I could think

> of was, " I WISH _I_ could go to a village of my own kind.

Actually, that sounds a good deal like what *does* happen to some people

who are different, by default.

I think the difference is between when you're forced to be somewhere

where everyone's like you (or at least shares a set of loose societal

ideas of having something in common with you), and when you go there

yourself. And whether you're allowed to leave or not, and who runs it,

who put it together in the first place, and why.

, who's been in " villages of her own kind " she'd never want to

revisit, despite liking some of the " people of her own kind " she met

there

--

" Nobody achieves sainthood by having an autistic kid. " - A.

Tisoncik

[Guest guest]

> 1) No loud noises allowed, ever.

Some autistic people stim on loud noises, or *make* loud noises.

> 2) No one is allowed to speak Chinese out loud. (I find the sound

> of Chinese unbearable---it makes me feel like my teeth

> are being driven up into my skull)

Many autistic people *are* Chinese.

Also, I personally find certain harmonics in certain people's voices

unbearable, and I'm certain some autistic people have such voices, but I

would think banning them from speaking in an entire town would be

overkill. For that matter, I find the sound of my own voice unbearable

that way much of the time.

> 3) All clothing stores would only carry very soft clothes made only of

> natural fibers.

This would work for people with some kinds of tactile sensitivity

(including me), and not others. Some people have sensitivitiy that

drives their skin nuts around anything soft. (As for myself, cotton

works, but silk it depends entirely on the day.)

> 4) No jazz.

Many autistic people *like* jazz.

> 5) Trucks would not be allowed to make that horrible beeping

> sound when they back up.

This could be replaced with something else, probably, yes.

> 6) No perfume.

> 7) Restaurants would all be gluten/dairy free.

Many autistic people like (or *need*) gluten and/or dairy. I certainly

think everywhere should have that *option*, but simply *being* GF/CF on

everything is too restrictive.

> 8) Every house/apt. would have a small, sound-proof room.

As long as it looked *nothing* like a " quiet room " (and for Pete's sake

didn't get *called* that -- this actually came up on another list I was

on once), or I (and possibly a good segment of the large number of

autistic people who have been institutionalized) would never set foot in

any of the houses.

> 9) Dogs would be allowed everywhere.

Including in people's houses who are allergic to them?

> 10) Children would not be allowed except in special

> 'child' areas.

I would think rather that there should be special *adult* areas, or

adult *times*. Like my local movie theater which won't allow children

under a certain age in after 6:30 pm to anything rated PG-13 and above,

but doesn't have a ban on children or something.

Also, autistic children are " our own kind " too.

, perhaps taking this too literally

--

" We need people to value our lives, and we also must value the lives of

other disabled people and refuse to make assumptions about the quality

of life based on the nature of a particular disability. " -

[Guest guest]

mn m

> >I'm writing up a fictional place for Aspies.

> >Anyone care to contribute?

>

> Ooooo, great idea! A " Village of Your Own Kind " Did anyone see that

> Twilite Zone about a month ago? It was a remake of an old episode.

> This woman looks different from everyone else, and is considered

> hideously ugly in a society that values conforming above all else. The

> doctors keep trying to change her face to 'normal', but it never works.

> Finally, they tell her that she has to go live in " The Village of Her

> Own Kind " . She is horrified, and doesn't want to go. All I could think

> of was, " I WISH _I_ could go to a village of my own kind.

>

> Ok, so what to put (or NOT put) in the village of our own kind?

>

> 1) No loud noises allowed, ever.

Howzabout lots and lots of soundproofing so that those who need quiet

can be quiet and those who need to make noise can do so.

A lot of autistic people are anything but quiet.

> 2) No one is allowed to speak Chinese out loud. (I find the sound

> of Chinese unbearable---it makes me feel like my teeth

> are being driven up into my skull)

Any idea why that sound affects you this way?

Obviously, any such restrictions would be unacceptable to those on the

spectrum who are Chinese,

have Chinese friends, or like Chinese food.

> 3) All clothing stores would only carry very soft clothes

> made only of natural fibers.

Some natural fibers. Cotton good. Silk very good! Wool Yeeech!

> 4) No jazz.

I *like* jazz. You don't have to listen to it if you don't like it.

It's not as if it's playing on every street corner

(unless you live in New Orleans). What is it about jazz that bothers

you?

> 5) Trucks would not be allowed to make that horrible beeping

> sound when they back up.

They could achieve the same safety feature without it being quite so

annoying.

> 6) No perfume.

Some people are actually allergic to perfume.

> 7) Restaurants would all be gluten/dairy free.

If they all were, I'd probably start one that wasn't, for those of us

who *like* those things and have no sensitivity to them.

There should, of course, be lots of restaurants, catering to every

taste and sensitivity, because we are not all the same.

> 8) Every house/apt. would have a small, sound-proof room.

Soundproof all the walls as a matter of course.

> 9) Dogs would be allowed everywhere.

A lot more of us are cat people actually.

> 10) Children would not be allowed except in special

> 'child' areas.

You envisage an adults-only community here, or so it appears.

Ride the Music

AndyTiedye

[Guest guest]

AndyTiedye wrote:

> mn m

>

>

>>>I'm writing up a fictional place for Aspies.

>>>Anyone care to contribute?

>>

>>Ooooo, great idea! A " Village of Your Own Kind " Did anyone see that

>>Twilite Zone about a month ago? It was a remake of an old episode.

>>This woman looks different from everyone else, and is considered

>>hideously ugly in a society that values conforming above all else. The

>>doctors keep trying to change her face to 'normal', but it never works.

>>Finally, they tell her that she has to go live in " The Village of Her

>>Own Kind " . She is horrified, and doesn't want to go. All I could think

>>of was, " I WISH _I_ could go to a village of my own kind.

>>

>>Ok, so what to put (or NOT put) in the village of our own kind?

>>

>>1) No loud noises allowed, ever.

>

>

> Howzabout lots and lots of soundproofing so that those who need quiet

> can be quiet and those who need to make noise can do so.

>

> A lot of autistic people are anything but quiet.

I like loud music depending on my mood.

>>2) No one is allowed to speak Chinese out loud. (I find the sound

>>of Chinese unbearable---it makes me feel like my teeth

>>are being driven up into my skull)

>

>

> Any idea why that sound affects you this way?

>

> Obviously, any such restrictions would be unacceptable to those on the

> spectrum who are Chinese,

> have Chinese friends, or like Chinese food.

I like Chinese food.

>>3) All clothing stores would only carry very soft clothes

>>made only of natural fibers.

>

>

> Some natural fibers. Cotton good. Silk very good! Wool Yeeech!

Most of my clothes contain some polyester. I would go nuts in a town

where the only clothes available were natural fibers.

>>4) No jazz.

>

>

> I *like* jazz. You don't have to listen to it if you don't like it.

> It's not as if it's playing on every street corner

> (unless you live in New Orleans). What is it about jazz that bothers

> you?

I hate jazz myself but I like plenty of music that is not calm and

pleasant to many peoples ears.

>>5) Trucks would not be allowed to make that horrible beeping

>>sound when they back up.

>

>

> They could achieve the same safety feature without it being quite so

> annoying.

>

>

>>6) No perfume.

>

>

> Some people are actually allergic to perfume.

And some people actually like it.

>>7) Restaurants would all be gluten/dairy free.

>

>

> If they all were, I'd probably start one that wasn't, for those of us

> who *like* those things and have no sensitivity to them.

>

> There should, of course, be lots of restaurants, catering to every

> taste and sensitivity, because we are not all the same.

I like the diversity of food available in normal society.

>>8) Every house/apt. would have a small, sound-proof room.

>

>

> Soundproof all the walls as a matter of course.

Mine wouldn't. I rely on my hearing a lot to tell me when danger is

around or just to orient myself in my surroundings. Such a room would

disconcert me and have no place in my house.

>>9) Dogs would be allowed everywhere.

>

>

> A lot more of us are cat people actually.

If dogs would be allowed everywhere, I would die during my first 10

minutes in this town. I am very severely allergic to dogs.

>>10) Children would not be allowed except in special

>>'child' areas.

>

>

> You envisage an adults-only community here, or so it appears.

Why should children not be allowed in a community? Children are what

makes the future of a community. They should be treated with respect not

scorned.

I personally think a community of only autistic spectrum people would be

more unbearable than normal society. Even if everybody did have autism

in common the diversity among autistic folk would make the place futile.

CZ

[Guest guest]

--- Antryg Windrose wrote:

>

>

> >>10) Children would not be allowed

> except in special

> >>'child' areas.

> >

> --------Oh gads, not this again.......

> I personally think a community of only autistic

> spectrum people would be

> more unbearable than normal society. Even if

> everybody did have autism

> in common the diversity among autistic folk would

> make the place futile.

>

> CZ

----------I agree, CZ, because who would run the

emergency rooms?? And how would I be able to sue for

discrimination if there weren't any lawyers around?

LOLOLOLOL....

Nanne

=====

" Let's go get drunk on light again---it has the power to console. " --

Seurat

[Guest guest]

--- Antryg Windrose wrote:

The more I get to know " NT " people the more I realise

that none of them

are neurologically typical and none of them are

actually that shallow

or

that interested in celebrities. Well, hardly any.

Maybe it is just

where

I live but almost everyone I have bothered to get to

know has mental

illness in the family, " skeletons in the closet " and

doesn't attach

much

value to infomercials and entertainment junk

television shows. I have

yet to meet anyone " NT " or otherwise who really does

take those things

seriously or set aside time to watch them.

---------I agree here, and at this point of my own

journey I'd like to see 'NT' changed to 'NA', or

Non-Autistic.

Whats' given as a stereotype of 'NT' here takes me

back to my high school days, where the type A

personalities were described as 'Socials'. In my

recent experience of journalling/blogging, I've met

many NA people who are not in that category at all,

and there is nothing 'typical' about them.

Nanne

=====

" Let's go get drunk on light again---it has the power to console. " --

Seurat

[Guest guest]

> ------------So since an autistic village would mean

> autistic kids, why bother going into all this brou ha

> ha about kids in general?

What if a resident gave birth to an NT child. Would that child then be

marginalised and emotionally abused in much the same way as autistic

children are in mainstream society?

CZ

[Guest guest]

--- Antryg Windrose wrote:

>

>

> What if a resident gave birth to an NT child. Would

> that child then be

> marginalised and emotionally abused in much the same

> way as autistic

> children are in mainstream society?

>

> CZ

>

---------From the amount of child-hating crap written

thus far, of course!

Nanne

=====

" Let's go get drunk on light again---it has the power to console. " --

Seurat

[Guest guest]

CZ wrote:

>Why should children not be allowed in a community? Children are what

>makes the future of a community. They should be treated with respect not

>scorned.

I assume (or at least, hope) that in any " intentional

community, " whether autistic or otherwise, the needs

and interests of children would be considered in

planning to a much higher degree that is true where

we live now. To begin with, there should not be an

assumption that all children need to be corralled

together and " kept busy " for most of every day under

the guise of " education. " Education could permeate

the community in various forms and not be segregated

by age so much (more by interest, I would think). If

children were respected and integrated into the

community, I suspect the differences in behavior that

annoy some autistics so much would be less marked. True,

children generally have more energy to expend (and

often higher/louder voices), but I suspect much of

the irritating behavior we are used to is caused by

their reaction to restraints imposed by social norms

that do not take children's needs and selfhood as

seriously as would be done in an " ideal " society.

Which is not to say there couldn't be places set

up specially for children (and those adults with

the inclination) to " act like kids " -- run aouund

and shout, swing wildly -- playgrounds -- and those

who didn't want to be exposed to shouts of glee

could keep away.

No reason why there shouldn't also be places where

anyone who goes there accepts a " quiet, please "

attitude. People who need a restrained atmosphere,

with no shrieking (even gleeful shrieking) and no

sudden, startling moves (e.g., children running out

into the street, as mentioned), could have a

place in which to feel comfortable.

Perhaps in some kinds of pulic spaces it would be a

good idea to use the kind of system I've heard about

being used at Autreat. People can (if they want to)

wear badges that indicate their desired level of

interaction. That way, a person who prefers to have

no interaction would be able to shop in a store with

others and not worry about being seen as unfriendly

simply because s/he does not chat with the cashier

or engage in " polite " body language with others

while negotiating shopping carts around the aisles.

Jane

[Guest guest]

Cerulean wrote:

>

> --- Antryg Windrose wrote:

> >

> >

> > What if a resident gave birth to an NT child. Would

> > that child then be

> > marginalised and emotionally abused in much the same

> > way as autistic

> > children are in mainstream society?

> ---------From the amount of child-hating crap written

> thus far, of course!

I wasn't going to get involved in this, but since you raised the issue

again: I don't like kids, so I'm not going to have any, and am going to

avoid being around them as much as possible. Whether " don't like " =

" hate " is perhaps for more philosophically-minded folks to decide,

though I would say that since I don't wish them any harm (and generally

am in favor of things like good education that will make them worthwhile

citizens), " hate " is far too strong to describe my feelings. Also, I

interpret what posted as saying that he avoids them because they

cause him pain physically and perhaps in other ways. He's just looking

out for himself.

If you feel differently, you can deal with the kids. Chacun a son gout,

as the French say (to each his/her own); we should respect each other's

preferences, and other than that don't have to bother each other.

Doug

[Guest guest]

Doug O'Neal danced around singing:

>I wasn't going to get involved in this, but since you raised the issue

>again: I don't like kids, so I'm not going to have any, and am going to

>avoid being around them as much as possible. Whether " don't like " =

> " hate " is perhaps for more philosophically-minded folks to decide,

>though I would say that since I don't wish them any harm (and generally

>am in favor of things like good education that will make them worthwhile

>citizens), " hate " is far too strong to describe my feelings. Also, I

>interpret what posted as saying that he avoids them because they

>cause him pain physically and perhaps in other ways. He's just looking

>out for himself.

Yes, precisely the same here.

I'm fed up with having ignorant people assume I'm some kind of abuser or

evil because I don't want the same stuff that they do. IMHO, if someone

likes something, by all means, they can go have fun with it, but they need

to quit trying to cram it down everyone else's throat.

Before this becomes any nastier, I'd like to quote the web-site for this group:

" There will be no censorship or moderation, but personal attacks are

off-limits. "

Now I am going to go focus my childfree brain on getting some work done --

I actually have more important things to do with my life than try to force

others to feel the same way I do about everything.

DeGraf ~*~ http://www.sonic.net/mustang/moggy

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but it may be necessary,

from time to time, to give a stupid or misinformed beholder a black eye.

[Guest guest]

Antryg Windrose danced around singing:

>I guess living in a house solves that problem. No kids allowed on my

>premises without my permission.

Not here, it doesn't. I live in a fairly large house with a large

backyard, but because it's in a suburb, there's so many children that if

I'm in the front of the house I can hear the older ones (ages 10 - 18)

being noisy in the street, and if I'm in the back I hear the younger ones

(0 - 10) playing in their backyards.

DeGraf ~*~ http://www.sonic.net/mustang/moggy

" It's not 'being fussy' -- it's knowing what you want. "

[Guest guest]

> I wasn't going to get involved in this, but since

> you raised the issue

> again:

-------the issues was 'raised' earlier; i was just

responding to it....

I don't like kids, so I'm not going to have

> any, and am going to

> avoid being around them as much as possible.

> Whether " don't like " =

> " hate " is perhaps for more philosophically-minded

> folks to decide,

> though I would say that since I don't wish them any

> harm (and generally

> am in favor of things like good education that will

> make them worthwhile

> citizens), " hate " is far too strong to describe my

> feelings. Also, I

> interpret what posted as saying that he avoids

> them because they

> cause him pain physically and perhaps in other ways.

> He's just looking

> out for himself.

--------No problems with any of that at all. It's the

stereotyping of 'all children this and all children

that', which is no different from stereotyping any

other group of people.

>

> If you feel differently, you can deal with the kids.

> Chacun a son gout,

> as the French say (to each his/her own); we should

> respect each other's

> preferences, and other than that don't have to

> bother each other.

>

> Doug

------No problem with any of that; most of my RL

friends have no children. In fact, as I mentioned to

someone else, I've been hounded before with the

'you're so GOOD with kids, you should teach...' but a)

I can't be amidst groups more than 3 of them, and I

can only be around ones I like.

It's just the stereotyping I dislike.

Nanne

=====

" Let's go get drunk on light again---it has the power to console. " --

Seurat

[Guest guest]

Cerulean danced around singing:

>--------No problems with any of that at all. It's the

>stereotyping of 'all children this and all children

>that', which is no different from stereotyping any

>other group of people.

If someone has a sensory sensitivity, then I think that is something they

would know about better than, say, someone that doesn't have it. I

certainly don't think that they should be attacked for having different

sensory preferences, whether it's a dislike of coffee or children.

I personally DO find all children hard on my senses. In order for a kid to

not trigger my hypersensitivity, it would have to move at an unnaturally

slow pace and speak slowly in a deep voice. In order for me to feel

comfortable around one, it would have to have zero interest in anything

that stereotypical children enjoy, and have already internalized extremely

good manners, such as those typically only shown in adults over

25. Speaking on a physical level, none of this is possible, therefore I do

not like being around children of any neurology.

DeGraf ~~ http://www.sonic.net/mustang/moggy

" You're down as expendable. You don't get a weapon. "

-- Wynne (Dark Lord of Derkholm)

[Guest guest]

Lori danced around singing:

>We're talking of 1 small

>village in a world full of billions of NT's who have everything their

>way. Give me a break with the PC propaganda.

Yes, exactly... Plus, why should the *wishes* of those that *choose* to

reproduce be placed ahead of the **needs** of some autistics, just because

we are over 18 years old and have chosen to not have kids? I never have

been able to made sense of that.

DeGraf ~*~ http://www.sonic.net/mustang/moggy

[Guest guest]

>>Including in people's houses who are

>>allergic to them?

>

>

> No, I meant in public. In many parts of Europe, you can take your dog

> with you

> to restaurants, etc.

That would be more unfair on a lot of people than having no places to

eat out where people could eat products containing gluten. It would rule

me out from going on public transport, going into any space where a dog

would approach me and I would certainly not be able to step into the

door of a restaurant.

As for gluten free restaurants, I think that having some gluten free and

some not gluten free would be appropriate. That way everybody could get

their needs met.

CZ

[Guest guest]

Antryg Windrose danced around singing:

>It would rule

>me out from going on public transport, going into any space where a dog

>would approach me and I would certainly not be able to step into the

>door of a restaurant.

Oh, boy, you'd be in trouble where I live... There's a pretty big disabled

community in Berkeley, so the dogs are absolutely everywhere.

Is it possible, btw, to be allergic to one type of dog and not another? I

used to have a dog when I was a teen and he gave me no problems at

all. When I tried to take care of one in 2001, however, my asthma reacted

so severely that I had to actually give her back, even my allergy meds

couldn't help! Really a shame - she was a beautiful, hyperintelligent

Border Collie, and in that short week dragged me out of a pretty nasty

vacation.

DeGraf ~*~ http://www.sonic.net/mustang/moggy

[Guest guest]

fiestacranberry@... wrote:

>>I can understand wanting a community

>>where kids aren't allowed but it seems

>>very limiting for an autistic spectrum

>>community when there are vast numbers

>>of autistics who have children and vast

>>numbers of autistic children. It seems to

>>me akin to apartheid.

>

>

> Again, I never said that kids weren't allowed, just that they have to

> stay in their own part of the town. It's not anything like apartheid.

Yes it is. Apartheid was about staying in designated areas.

> Apartheid is based on skin color, something a person can't help. Having

> kids is a choice. These days, no one HAS to have a kid if they don't

> want to---not in the west, anyway. If you make the choice, you should

> be prepared to face the consequences. Why should I be subjected to your

> choice?

Children are not the ones who made the choice. Why should children grow

up with people being so rude about them and treating them like they are

worthless because of the PARENTS choice. I think once a child is born

then every effort to raise it well and give it an environment that will

lead to future mental health should be made. Whether the child should be

born in the first place is kind of not an issue anymore once it is.

> I don't understand this fascination for diversity---we're making a place

> here that is supposed to be comfortable for people (autistics), many,

> many of whom have altered sensory perception and uncomfortable reactions

> to certain known foods.

I do myself, but not to gluten. I think in an ideal community a lot of

different types of foods would be readily available so that vegans or

GFCF diet people or whichever preference people might have could be

satisfied. Not completely ban restaurants containing food that GFCF

people can't eat. Is that concept so hard to grasp?

> If you want diversity, stay in the real world.

> The whole point of the village _is_ exclusion: exclusion of boom boxes

> blasting rap, car stereos with the bass turned up so loud the walls

> shake, stinky perfume, poisonous food. We're talking of 1 small

> village in a world full of billions of NT's who have everything their

> way. Give me a break with the PC propaganda.

Diversity exists among autistics. I think this conversation has already

proven that. I am autistic. I find a lot of things unbearable (noisy

children in shopping centres among them). I rely on home help carers so

that I can live independantly. I am so far unable to pass anything in

school because of how my autism affects me. I got into university but it

is very uncertain that I will stay in university because of my autism.

Some clothes cause me to go completely haywire and shake and scream

because of how they hurt my teeth when they touch my skin. So do some of

the fabrics which couches get covered with. Some foods do the same and I

have multiple food sensitivities or allergies. BUT, my sensitivities,

allergies and dislikes are not the same as yours. I am not talking PC

propaganda at all. Gluten is not poisonous to everyone. It makes no

difference to me and I happen to like food that contains it.

Let the people who can't eat it dine at a gluten free restaurant and the

autistics who do like it and can tolerate it dine at a non gluten free

restaurant.

Make pure cotton and wool clothing readily available for those who want

it but also have polyester clothing available for those who want that.

It's not like the swarming NT masses would be created in the town just

because some people happen to want to wear something other than cotton.

CZ

[Guest guest]

DeGraf wrote:

> Antryg Windrose danced around singing:

>

>>It would rule

>>me out from going on public transport, going into any space where a dog

>>would approach me and I would certainly not be able to step into the

>>door of a restaurant.

>

>

> Oh, boy, you'd be in trouble where I live... There's a pretty big disabled

> community in Berkeley, so the dogs are absolutely everywhere.

>

> Is it possible, btw, to be allergic to one type of dog and not another? I

> used to have a dog when I was a teen and he gave me no problems at

> all. When I tried to take care of one in 2001, however, my asthma reacted

> so severely that I had to actually give her back, even my allergy meds

> couldn't help! Really a shame - she was a beautiful, hyperintelligent

> Border Collie, and in that short week dragged me out of a pretty nasty

> vacation.

I'm not sure about that. I know poodles are supposed to be

non-allergenic and I think bichon frisse might be also but I am allergic

to those too. They might have wool (and I am allergic to sheep wool)

instead of fur but they still have dander and it is the dander that

causes my allergy. I am allergic to any furry animal.

I love border collies. They are beautiful intelligent dogs. I would have

to say they are my favourite breed. At the Royal Show each year I love

to watch the sheepdog trials. I rarely get through a day at the Royal

Show without an asthma attack though because there is so much hay and

animals and other allergens (and a lot of screaming children and

perfumes too and I invariably go home from there with a bad migraine). I

choose to go to the show once a year because I like some of the exhibits

but I would not want to be there more often than once a year. I doubt I

will go this coming year.

CZ

[Guest guest]

Antryg Windrose danced around singing:

>I love border collies. They are beautiful intelligent dogs. I would have

>to say they are my favourite breed.

Yes, the same here! It was a fulfillment of a longtime wish when a friend

of mine said that I could *have* her BC, especially because the dog

instantly became very attached to me. I was very upset when I had to give

her back -- I spent a week almost constantly on my nebulizer and drugging

myself unconscious with antihistamines in hopes that I could acclimate, but

even though I was only near " Chey " for a few hours each day (I didn't keep

her in my room) it was still clearly more than my body could handle. :^(

> At the Royal Show each year I love

>to watch the sheepdog trials. I rarely get through a day at the Royal

>Show without an asthma attack though because there is so much hay and

>animals and other allergens (and a lot of screaming children and

>perfumes too and I invariably go home from there with a bad migraine).

I enjoy watching them on television each year, along with the various

equestrian events I enjoy. Would it be possible for you to either get them

on a television channel, perhaps buy DVD copies of it, or maybe even have a

friend in an area that gets satellite video feeds tape it for you? I know

it's not as good as being there, but it's easier on our bodies... That is

how I handle the animal sports I miss out on each year -- I find a small

supplier of video reproductions on the web, and order a copy. There are a

lot of them on the web that do an excellent job, I would be happy to check

with them to see if they carry the Royal Show if you'd like.

[Guest guest]

>> At the Royal Show each year I love

>>to watch the sheepdog trials. I rarely get through a day at the Royal

>>Show without an asthma attack though because there is so much hay and

>>animals and other allergens (and a lot of screaming children and

>>perfumes too and I invariably go home from there with a bad migraine).

>

>

> I enjoy watching them on television each year, along with the various

> equestrian events I enjoy. Would it be possible for you to either get them

> on a television channel, perhaps buy DVD copies of it, or maybe even have a

> friend in an area that gets satellite video feeds tape it for you?

I don't really have any friends. I have acquaintances at church but I

would not class them as friends and none of them that I am aware of have

anything other than free to air tv. The only friends I have are online

and not in my state. Also, I can't afford any way to play DVDs. They are

a luxury that an increasing amount of other people have but that I will

probably not have in the foreseeable future.

> I know

> it's not as good as being there, but it's easier on our bodies... That is

> how I handle the animal sports I miss out on each year -- I find a small

> supplier of video reproductions on the web, and order a copy.

I wouldn't be able to afford that. I've had to give up my ambulance

insurance because my yearly budget couldn't make room for it. I'm on a

restricted amount of phonecalls per day to keep within my means and my

tv watching is limited to half an hour on weekdays with an extra hour on

tuesdays, none on saturdays and one hour on sundays. This is the only

way that I can afford to buy food and pay the mortgage and bills.

> There are a

> lot of them on the web that do an excellent job, I would be happy to check

> with them to see if they carry the Royal Show if you'd like.

I seriously doubt it. Perth is a small little place and the Royal Show

is nothing big. Sheepdog trials are just a minor part of it. Most of it

these days is sideshows and candy floss and noisy kids. It originally

was an agricultural show and it still does have a fair bit of animal

stuff but that seems to be declining. Whenever I do flick on the tv (not

much lately for financial reasons) and see sheepdog trials I will sit

and watch it.

CZ

[Guest guest]

>

> As another instance, there are times when watching

> people moving in

> certain ways makes me motion-sick and visually

> overloaded. It would not

> be reasonable for me to require all people who move

> in those ways to

> stay in certain areas, nor would it be reasonable

> for me to have to stay

> in my house during those times. Some kind of more

> complicated

> arrangement would have to be reached.

>

>

>

-------Unfortunately for me, the only ideal autistic

village would be my own house, where the only member

is me.

Nanne

=====

" Let's go get drunk on light again---it has the power to console. " --

Seurat

[Guest guest]

> Some kind of more complicated

> arrangement would have to be reached.

How about everybody live in their own little virtual reality world

CZ

[Guest guest]

> this fascination for diversity---we're making a place

> here that is supposed to be comfortable for people (autistics), many,

> many of whom have altered sensory perception and uncomfortable reactions

> to certain known foods. If you want diversity, stay in the real world.

There *is* a lot of diversity in the autistic world.

> poisonous food.

Only *some* autistic people find certain foods truly poisonous.

Others (possibly most) don't at all.

Still others (unknown quantity, but I'm not the only one that it's

happened to) are drawn into scams about food saying that food was

poisonous for us that *wasn't*, and getting very sick from nutrient

deficiencies that came from not eating the food we were told not to eat.

A few years ago, I would have said (because I'd been told so by a

doctor, and previously had it drummed into me never to question doctors)

that certain foods were poisonous to me. Now I realize I'm far

healthier eating them. (Look up " orthorexia " on a search engine for

more on this phenomenon -- I think the targeting of autistics for this

kind of food faddism causes autistics who *don't* have those

sensitivities to become convinced they do.) This isn't of course true

of *all* autistics who are told this, but I think there are autistics

out there who have been led to believe they have intolerances and

allergies they don't. (I know that's a sticky subject. But there are

enough that it *is* a real group.)

> We're talking of 1 small

> village in a world full of billions of NT's who have everything their

> way. Give me a break with the PC propaganda.

The point is you can't avoid diversity among autistic people, PC

propaganda or no PC propaganda. It's a fact.independent of propaganda.

As one instance, a hyposensitive person could find an environment

designed for hypersensitive people absolutely torturous. And locking

all the hyposensitive people in their houses so they won't bother the

hypersensitive people just isn't an option (in fact being told to go

into a soundproof room to stim is horrifyingly reminiscent of what I've

seen happen in other environments that could never be construed as

havens).

As another instance, there are times when watching people moving in

certain ways makes me motion-sick and visually overloaded. It would not

be reasonable for me to require all people who move in those ways to

stay in certain areas, nor would it be reasonable for me to have to stay

in my house during those times. Some kind of more complicated

arrangement would have to be reached.

--

Some people have cats and go on to lead normal lives.

[Guest guest]

> I do myself, but not to gluten. I think in an ideal community a lot of

> different types of foods would be readily available so that vegans or

> GFCF diet people or whichever preference people might have could be

> satisfied. Not completely ban restaurants containing food that GFCF

> people can't eat. Is that concept so hard to grasp?

Yes! Exactly!

Restaurants in such a place would be places where people could order

various kinds of food, and also have their orders specially made without

offending foods, etc.

I can't stand bell peppers and celery -- to the point where I don't even

consider them food -- but I can't imagine banning them for all people

just because I didn't like them

--

The world takes my disability too seriously, and frankly I'm not going

to stand for it. -wheelchair joke #43 (the Nth Degree)