Re: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

[Guest guest]

Hi, Connie. About 5 years ago I told my doctor that I was not going to

take any statin, and I did not want to have my lipids checked when we

did blood work. It worked. I have not had a cholesterol test since.

Gene

On 10/7/2011 2:43 PM, cls54721 wrote:

> Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to get you to

a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind is still

driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, I thought to

myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was developing some form

of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only in my early 50's.

>

> When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and memory loss,

I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which I could stop

and not really Alzheimer's.

>

> It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I haven't

even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly around my

tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and are killing me and

neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me that have flared up

again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a while or first thing

when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take this statin (pravastatin)

either.

>

> I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am more

susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

>

> Connie

>

[Guest guest]

Hi, Connie. About 5 years ago I told my doctor that I was not going to

take any statin, and I did not want to have my lipids checked when we

did blood work. It worked. I have not had a cholesterol test since.

Gene

On 10/7/2011 2:43 PM, cls54721 wrote:

> Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to get you to

a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind is still

driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, I thought to

myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was developing some form

of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only in my early 50's.

>

> When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and memory loss,

I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which I could stop

and not really Alzheimer's.

>

> It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I haven't

even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly around my

tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and are killing me and

neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me that have flared up

again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a while or first thing

when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take this statin (pravastatin)

either.

>

> I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am more

susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

>

> Connie

>

[Guest guest]

Statistics indicat that statins and women are not a match, very little if

any benefit within large sample groups. The important thing is you have to

know what is the nominal level of cholesterol is for you, everyone is

different. What you also need to know is that the cholesterol numbers that

doctors like, or should I say big pharma likes are not realistic, but do

make huge profits. In the early days of cholesterol testing the norm was

200-240, this is without any medications, so this is where the body needs

to be for the norm, however individually your number might be closer to 200

or 300 total, especially if you have northern blood.

It should be obvious that your taking statins is not doing you any good and

is reeking havoc with your body.

Statins one benefit that is know is the reduction of inflamation. This is

their only value, but the side effects and cellular damage are too high a

price to pay when there are other things that will do as good or better job

of reducing inflamation.

Mike

Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing

statins

Gene, thanks for sharing this. I told my husband since I started taking the

pravastatin, I feel terrible with aches in many places of my body. And my

husband said to me, " I want to ask you, why did your doctor give you this

drug if he knew you had problems before? " I said that this is a different

statin, but they all work the same way. I told him that since my LDL has

been creeping up, my doc wants to put me on a statin. I told the doc I

would try this one cause I asked for an older drug, but I guess I can't take

any of them without muscle problems.

Years ago, my husband, who is now 61, went for a checkup. He hardly ever

goes to the doctor, anyway. The lab tests ordered did include a lipid panel

and the doc said the results showed total cholesterol around 220, I think.

The doc said to watch his diet, and he lost over 30 lbs. but he never had

the lab tests repeated. I said if he went back and had the tests done

again, and if his levels were still high, the doc would probably suggest he

take a statin, too. He just never goes to the doctor. The only health

problems he has is a slight asthma problem.

Since I am diabetic and have labs done every 4 months, my doc always seems

to check the lipids. I am just going to tell him in January that prastatin

is not for me. And my doc still believes what the drug reps tell him. They

probably say that lower cholesterol levels equals lower heart attack risk.

NOT.

My father-in-law had a few small heart attacks when he was in his lower

70's, and he was probably taking a statin at that time. He passed away from

Alzheimer's dementia. My mother-in-law was taking Zocor or simvastatin of

at least 40 mg for years. She had a massive heart attack at age 92 and had

irreversible damage. She was removed from life support as a result. Both

my in-laws took any medication that was prescribed for them without

question. I doubt the statins my in-laws took protected them, since they

both had heart attacks.

Connie

> > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to get

you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind is

still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, I

thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was

developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only in my

early 50's.

> >

> > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and memory

loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which I

could stop and not really Alzheimer's.

> >

> > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I

haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly

around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and are

killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me that

have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a

while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take

this statin (pravastatin) either.

> >

> > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am more

susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

> >

> > Connie

> >

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Statistics indicat that statins and women are not a match, very little if

any benefit within large sample groups. The important thing is you have to

know what is the nominal level of cholesterol is for you, everyone is

different. What you also need to know is that the cholesterol numbers that

doctors like, or should I say big pharma likes are not realistic, but do

make huge profits. In the early days of cholesterol testing the norm was

200-240, this is without any medications, so this is where the body needs

to be for the norm, however individually your number might be closer to 200

or 300 total, especially if you have northern blood.

It should be obvious that your taking statins is not doing you any good and

is reeking havoc with your body.

Statins one benefit that is know is the reduction of inflamation. This is

their only value, but the side effects and cellular damage are too high a

price to pay when there are other things that will do as good or better job

of reducing inflamation.

Mike

Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing

statins

Gene, thanks for sharing this. I told my husband since I started taking the

pravastatin, I feel terrible with aches in many places of my body. And my

husband said to me, " I want to ask you, why did your doctor give you this

drug if he knew you had problems before? " I said that this is a different

statin, but they all work the same way. I told him that since my LDL has

been creeping up, my doc wants to put me on a statin. I told the doc I

would try this one cause I asked for an older drug, but I guess I can't take

any of them without muscle problems.

Years ago, my husband, who is now 61, went for a checkup. He hardly ever

goes to the doctor, anyway. The lab tests ordered did include a lipid panel

and the doc said the results showed total cholesterol around 220, I think.

The doc said to watch his diet, and he lost over 30 lbs. but he never had

the lab tests repeated. I said if he went back and had the tests done

again, and if his levels were still high, the doc would probably suggest he

take a statin, too. He just never goes to the doctor. The only health

problems he has is a slight asthma problem.

Since I am diabetic and have labs done every 4 months, my doc always seems

to check the lipids. I am just going to tell him in January that prastatin

is not for me. And my doc still believes what the drug reps tell him. They

probably say that lower cholesterol levels equals lower heart attack risk.

NOT.

My father-in-law had a few small heart attacks when he was in his lower

70's, and he was probably taking a statin at that time. He passed away from

Alzheimer's dementia. My mother-in-law was taking Zocor or simvastatin of

at least 40 mg for years. She had a massive heart attack at age 92 and had

irreversible damage. She was removed from life support as a result. Both

my in-laws took any medication that was prescribed for them without

question. I doubt the statins my in-laws took protected them, since they

both had heart attacks.

Connie

> > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to get

you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind is

still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, I

thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was

developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only in my

early 50's.

> >

> > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and memory

loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which I

could stop and not really Alzheimer's.

> >

> > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I

haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly

around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and are

killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me that

have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a

while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take

this statin (pravastatin) either.

> >

> > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am more

susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

> >

> > Connie

> >

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Re. statins and women's health. Please see this monograph from Health Canada on the evidence why statins are a poor choice for women and for anyone over the age of 50. It is from an authoritative, government source, is well written and contains balanced, objective information on statin use. http://www.whp-apsf.ca/pdf/statinsEvidenceCaution.pdfOn 11-Oct-11, at 11:30 AM, Mike Shea wrote: Statistics indicat that statins and women are not a match, very little if any benefit within large sample groups. The important thing is you have to know what is the nominal level of cholesterol is for you, everyone is different. What you also need to know is that the cholesterol numbers that doctors like, or should I say big pharma likes are not realistic, but do make huge profits. In the early days of cholesterol testing the norm was 200-240, this is without any medications, so this is where the body needs to be for the norm, however individually your number might be closer to 200 or 300 total, especially if you have northern blood. It should be obvious that your taking statins is not doing you any good and is reeking havoc with your body. Statins one benefit that is know is the reduction of inflamation. This is their only value, but the side effects and cellular damage are too high a price to pay when there are other things that will do as good or better job of reducing inflamation. Mike Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins Gene, thanks for sharing this. I told my husband since I started taking the pravastatin, I feel terrible with aches in many places of my body. And my husband said to me, "I want to ask you, why did your doctor give you this drug if he knew you had problems before?" I said that this is a different statin, but they all work the same way. I told him that since my LDL has been creeping up, my doc wants to put me on a statin. I told the doc I would try this one cause I asked for an older drug, but I guess I can't take any of them without muscle problems. Years ago, my husband, who is now 61, went for a checkup. He hardly ever goes to the doctor, anyway. The lab tests ordered did include a lipid panel and the doc said the results showed total cholesterol around 220, I think. The doc said to watch his diet, and he lost over 30 lbs. but he never had the lab tests repeated. I said if he went back and had the tests done again, and if his levels were still high, the doc would probably suggest he take a statin, too. He just never goes to the doctor. The only health problems he has is a slight asthma problem. Since I am diabetic and have labs done every 4 months, my doc always seems to check the lipids. I am just going to tell him in January that prastatin is not for me. And my doc still believes what the drug reps tell him. They probably say that lower cholesterol levels equals lower heart attack risk. NOT. My father-in-law had a few small heart attacks when he was in his lower 70's, and he was probably taking a statin at that time. He passed away from Alzheimer's dementia. My mother-in-law was taking Zocor or simvastatin of at least 40 mg for years. She had a massive heart attack at age 92 and had irreversible damage. She was removed from life support as a result. Both my in-laws took any medication that was prescribed for them without question. I doubt the statins my in-laws took protected them, since they both had heart attacks. Connie > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to get you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind is still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, I thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only in my early 50's. > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and memory loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which I could stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and are killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me that have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am more susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand. > > > > Connie > > > ------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Re. statins and women's health. Please see this monograph from Health Canada on the evidence why statins are a poor choice for women and for anyone over the age of 50. It is from an authoritative, government source, is well written and contains balanced, objective information on statin use. http://www.whp-apsf.ca/pdf/statinsEvidenceCaution.pdfOn 11-Oct-11, at 11:30 AM, Mike Shea wrote: Statistics indicat that statins and women are not a match, very little if any benefit within large sample groups. The important thing is you have to know what is the nominal level of cholesterol is for you, everyone is different. What you also need to know is that the cholesterol numbers that doctors like, or should I say big pharma likes are not realistic, but do make huge profits. In the early days of cholesterol testing the norm was 200-240, this is without any medications, so this is where the body needs to be for the norm, however individually your number might be closer to 200 or 300 total, especially if you have northern blood. It should be obvious that your taking statins is not doing you any good and is reeking havoc with your body. Statins one benefit that is know is the reduction of inflamation. This is their only value, but the side effects and cellular damage are too high a price to pay when there are other things that will do as good or better job of reducing inflamation. Mike Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins Gene, thanks for sharing this. I told my husband since I started taking the pravastatin, I feel terrible with aches in many places of my body. And my husband said to me, "I want to ask you, why did your doctor give you this drug if he knew you had problems before?" I said that this is a different statin, but they all work the same way. I told him that since my LDL has been creeping up, my doc wants to put me on a statin. I told the doc I would try this one cause I asked for an older drug, but I guess I can't take any of them without muscle problems. Years ago, my husband, who is now 61, went for a checkup. He hardly ever goes to the doctor, anyway. The lab tests ordered did include a lipid panel and the doc said the results showed total cholesterol around 220, I think. The doc said to watch his diet, and he lost over 30 lbs. but he never had the lab tests repeated. I said if he went back and had the tests done again, and if his levels were still high, the doc would probably suggest he take a statin, too. He just never goes to the doctor. The only health problems he has is a slight asthma problem. Since I am diabetic and have labs done every 4 months, my doc always seems to check the lipids. I am just going to tell him in January that prastatin is not for me. And my doc still believes what the drug reps tell him. They probably say that lower cholesterol levels equals lower heart attack risk. NOT. My father-in-law had a few small heart attacks when he was in his lower 70's, and he was probably taking a statin at that time. He passed away from Alzheimer's dementia. My mother-in-law was taking Zocor or simvastatin of at least 40 mg for years. She had a massive heart attack at age 92 and had irreversible damage. She was removed from life support as a result. Both my in-laws took any medication that was prescribed for them without question. I doubt the statins my in-laws took protected them, since they both had heart attacks. Connie > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to get you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind is still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, I thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only in my early 50's. > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and memory loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which I could stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and are killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me that have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am more susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand. > > > > Connie > > > ------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

The following is just my personal opinion. Its OK if others disagree, but I personally believe statins offer ZERO benefit for anyone. I believe the 1% absolute risk reduction was manufactured out of corporate greed and doesn't really exist. I do not believe statins have ever offered anyone cardiovascular benefits, has ever prevented heart disease, or prevented heart attacks and strokes, or ever saved anyone's life. This is just the way I view the drugs. Their benefits are manufactured and exist only in the minds of the consumer.Bobby Alternate email: marooned@...Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Plannerwww.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation PackagesPhilippine Destination SpecialistFrom: davidturgeon <davidturgeon@...>Lipitor Cc: davidturgeon <davidturgeon@...>Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 12:20 PMSubject: Re: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

Re. statins and women's health. Please see this monograph from Health Canada on the evidence why statins are a poor choice for women and for anyone over the age of 50. It is from an authoritative, government source, is well written and contains balanced, objective information on statin use. http://www.whp-apsf.ca/pdf/statinsEvidenceCaution.pdfOn 11-Oct-11, at 11:30 AM, Mike Shea wrote: Statistics indicat that statins and women are not a match, very little if any benefit within large sample groups. The important thing is you have to know what is the nominal level of cholesterol is for you, everyone is different. What you also need to know is that the cholesterol numbers that doctors like, or should I say big pharma likes are not

realistic, but do make huge profits. In the early days of cholesterol testing the norm was 200-240, this is without any medications, so this is where the body needs to be for the norm, however individually your number might be closer to 200 or 300 total, especially if you have northern blood. It should be obvious that your taking statins is not doing you any good and is reeking havoc with your body. Statins one benefit that is know is the reduction of inflamation. This is their only value, but the side effects and cellular damage are too high a price to pay when there are other things that will do as good or better job of reducing inflamation. Mike Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins Gene, thanks for sharing this. I told my husband since I started taking the pravastatin, I feel terrible with aches in many places of my body. And my husband said to me, "I want to ask you, why did your doctor give you this drug if he knew you had problems before?" I said that this is a different statin, but they all work the same way. I told him that since my LDL has been creeping up, my

doc wants to put me on a statin. I told the doc I would try this one cause I asked for an older drug, but I guess I can't take any of them without muscle problems. Years ago, my husband, who is now 61, went for a checkup. He hardly ever goes to the doctor, anyway. The lab tests ordered did include a lipid panel and the doc said the results showed total cholesterol around 220, I think. The doc said to watch his diet, and he lost over 30 lbs. but he never had the lab tests repeated. I said if he went back and had the tests done again, and if his levels were still high, the doc would probably suggest he take a statin, too. He just never goes to the doctor. The only health problems he has is a slight asthma problem. Since I am diabetic and have labs done every 4 months, my doc always seems to check the lipids. I am just going to tell him in January that prastatin is not for me. And my

doc still believes what the drug reps tell him. They probably say that lower cholesterol levels equals lower heart attack risk. NOT. My father-in-law had a few small heart attacks when he was in his lower 70's, and he was probably taking a statin at that time. He passed away from Alzheimer's dementia. My mother-in-law was taking Zocor or simvastatin of at least 40 mg for years. She had a massive heart attack at age 92 and had irreversible damage. She was removed from life support as a result. Both my in-laws took any medication that was prescribed for them without question. I doubt the statins my in-laws took protected them, since they both had heart attacks. Connie > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to get you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind is still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, I thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only in my early 50's. > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and memory loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which I could

stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and are killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me that have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am more susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand. > > > > Connie > > > ------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Bobby: I'm with you 100% on this one

Lee...

On 10/11/2011 11:34 AM, Olson wrote:

The following is just my personal opinion. Its OK if

others disagree, but I personally believe statins offer ZERO

benefit for anyone. I believe the 1% absolute risk reduction

was manufactured out of corporate greed and doesn't really

exist.

I do not believe statins have ever offered anyone

cardiovascular benefits, has ever prevented heart disease,

or prevented heart attacks and strokes, or ever saved

anyone's life.

This is just the way I view the drugs. Their benefits

are manufactured and exist only in the minds of the

consumer.

Bobby

Alternate email: marooned@...

Bobby-

Your Caribbean

Travel Planner

www.pinkystravel.com International

Destinations, Resorts, Vacation Packages

Philippine

Destination Specialist

From:

davidturgeon <davidturgeon@...>

To:

Lipitor

Cc:

davidturgeon <davidturgeon@...>

Sent:

Tuesday, October 11, 2011 12:20 PM

Subject:

Re: Re: my latest labs, doc still

pushing statins

Re. statins and women's health. Please see this

monograph from Health Canada on the evidence why

statins are a poor choice for women and for anyone

over the age of 50. It is from an authoritative,

government source, is well written and contains

balanced, objective information on statin use.

http://www.whp-apsf.ca/pdf/statinsEvidenceCaution.pdf

On 11-Oct-11, at 11:30 AM, Mike Shea wrote:

Statistics indicat that statins and women

are not a match, very little if

any benefit within large sample groups. The

important thing is you have to

know what is the nominal level of

cholesterol is for you, everyone is

different. What you also need to know is

that the cholesterol numbers that

doctors like, or should I say big pharma

likes are not realistic, but do

make huge profits. In the early days of

cholesterol testing the norm was

200-240, this is without any medications, so

this is where the body needs

to be for the norm, however individually

your number might be closer to 200

or 300 total, especially if you have

northern blood.

It should be obvious that your taking

statins is not doing you any good and

is reeking havoc with your body.

Statins one benefit that is know is the

reduction of inflamation. This is

their only value, but the side effects and

cellular damage are too high a

price to pay when there are other things

that will do as good or better job

of reducing inflamation.

Mike

Re: my

latest labs, doc still pushing

statins

Gene, thanks for sharing this. I told my

husband since I started taking the

pravastatin, I feel terrible with aches in

many places of my body. And my

husband said to me, "I want to ask you, why

did your doctor give you this

drug if he knew you had problems before?" I

said that this is a different

statin, but they all work the same way. I

told him that since my LDL has

been creeping up, my doc wants to put me on

a statin. I told the doc I

would try this one cause I asked for an

older drug, but I guess I can't take

any of them without muscle problems.

Years ago, my husband, who is now 61, went

for a checkup. He hardly ever

goes to the doctor, anyway. The lab tests

ordered did include a lipid panel

and the doc said the results showed total

cholesterol around 220, I think.

The doc said to watch his diet, and he lost

over 30 lbs. but he never had

the lab tests repeated. I said if he went

back and had the tests done

again, and if his levels were still high,

the doc would probably suggest he

take a statin, too. He just never goes to

the doctor. The only health

problems he has is a slight asthma problem.

Since I am diabetic and have labs done every

4 months, my doc always seems

to check the lipids. I am just going to tell

him in January that prastatin

is not for me. And my doc still believes

what the drug reps tell him. They

probably say that lower cholesterol levels

equals lower heart attack risk.

NOT.

My father-in-law had a few small heart

attacks when he was in his lower

70's, and he was probably taking a statin at

that time. He passed away from

Alzheimer's dementia. My mother-in-law was

taking Zocor or simvastatin of

at least 40 mg for years. She had a massive

heart attack at age 92 and had

irreversible damage. She was removed from

life support as a result. Both

my in-laws took any medication that was

prescribed for them without

question. I doubt the statins my in-laws

took protected them, since they

both had heart attacks.

Connie

> > Linden, you mean your cousin was

driving you around for 4 hours to get

you to a place 45 minutes from the airport?

A man in his state of mind is

still driving? When I was at my worst and

having the brain fog moments, I

thought to myself, should I be driving? And,

I was worried that I was

developing some form of early onset

Alzheimer's disease and I was only in my

early 50's.

> >

> > When I found this forum and other

websites that cited statins and memory

loss, I was hoping that my memory problems

were from the statins, which I

could stop and not really Alzheimer's.

> >

> > It has been less than 2 weeks

since I started the pravastatin, and I

haven't even taken it every day, and I have

many areas of pain, mostly

around my tendons. My right hip and lower

right back and left knee and are

killing me and neck pain. These are all

previous problem areas for me that

have flared up again. I seem to get stiff

muscles as soon as I sit for a

while or first thing when I get out of bed.

I have decided I can't take

this statin (pravastatin) either.

> >

> > I wish I could get one of those

genetic tests that prove that I am more

susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my

doctor would understand.

> >

> > Connie

> >

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Bobby, I must say agree with your opinion, based on my many hours of online research and direct experience. If you haven't yet read the monograph I linked below, you may find it interesting. I certainly did. It pretty much summarizes how useless and dangerous these statin drugs really are.Dave.On 11-Oct-11, at 2:34 PM, Olson wrote: The following is just my personal opinion. Its OK if others disagree, but I personally believe statins offer ZERO benefit for anyone. I believe the 1% absolute risk reduction was manufactured out of corporate greed and doesn't really exist. I do not believe statins have ever offered anyone cardiovascular benefits, has ever prevented heart disease, or prevented heart attacks and strokes, or ever saved anyone's life. This is just the way I view the drugs. Their benefits are manufactured and exist only in the minds of the consumer.Bobby Alternate email: marooned@...Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Plannerwww.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation PackagesPhilippine Destination SpecialistFrom: davidturgeon <davidturgeon@...>Lipitor Cc: davidturgeon <davidturgeon@...>Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 12:20 PMSubject: Re: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins Re. statins and women's health. Please see this monograph from Health Canada on the evidence why statins are a poor choice for women and for anyone over the age of 50. It is from an authoritative, government source, is well written and contains balanced, objective information on statin use. http://www.whp-apsf.ca/pdf/statinsEvidenceCaution.pdfOn 11-Oct-11, at 11:30 AM, Mike Shea wrote: Statistics indicat that statins and women are not a match, very little if any benefit within large sample groups. The important thing is you have to know what is the nominal level of cholesterol is for you, everyone is different. What you also need to know is that the cholesterol numbers that doctors like, or should I say big pharma likes are not realistic, but do make huge profits. In the early days of cholesterol testing the norm was 200-240, this is without any medications, so this is where the body needs to be for the norm, however individually your number might be closer to 200 or 300 total, especially if you have northern blood. It should be obvious that your taking statins is not doing you any good and is reeking havoc with your body. Statins one benefit that is know is the reduction of inflamation. This is their only value, but the side effects and cellular damage are too high a price to pay when there are other things that will do as good or better job of reducing inflamation. Mike Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins Gene, thanks for sharing this. I told my husband since I started taking the pravastatin, I feel terrible with aches in many places of my body. And my husband said to me, "I want to ask you, why did your doctor give you this drug if he knew you had problems before?" I said that this is a different statin, but they all work the same way. I told him that since my LDL has been creeping up, my doc wants to put me on a statin. I told the doc I would try this one cause I asked for an older drug, but I guess I can't take any of them without muscle problems. Years ago, my husband, who is now 61, went for a checkup. He hardly ever goes to the doctor, anyway. The lab tests ordered did include a lipid panel and the doc said the results showed total cholesterol around 220, I think. The doc said to watch his diet, and he lost over 30 lbs. but he never had the lab tests repeated. I said if he went back and had the tests done again, and if his levels were still high, the doc would probably suggest he take a statin, too. He just never goes to the doctor. The only health problems he has is a slight asthma problem. Since I am diabetic and have labs done every 4 months, my doc always seems to check the lipids. I am just going to tell him in January that prastatin is not for me. And my doc still believes what the drug reps tell him. They probably say that lower cholesterol levels equals lower heart attack risk. NOT. My father-in-law had a few small heart attacks when he was in his lower 70's, and he was probably taking a statin at that time. He passed away from Alzheimer's dementia. My mother-in-law was taking Zocor or simvastatin of at least 40 mg for years. She had a massive heart attack at age 92 and had irreversible damage. She was removed from life support as a result. Both my in-laws took any medication that was prescribed for them without question. I doubt the statins my in-laws took protected them, since they both had heart attacks. Connie > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to get you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind is still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, I thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only in my early 50's. > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and memory loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which I could stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and are killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me that have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am more susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand. > > > > Connie > > > ------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Hi Connie! I'm 's wife, and when I saw your email, I just had to put in my two cents.I totally understand your frustration with your husband's lack of understanding. However, having lived through this situation with , I also can relate to your husband's reaction. 's side effects, when he was on Lipitor, were so gradual and subtle at the beginning that neither of us knew what was happening. As his mood became worse, I became more upset because I had no idea what was causing it. Had I done something to make him mad? Was it stress at work that was causing the trouble? Was this a mid-life crisis? used to be a very patient, good-natured guy, but he became harshly critical of everything, and his temper was often explosive. Sometimes he didn't or couldn't tell me of his ailments, and because you can't "see" the side effects (like a runny nose or cough or fever), I couldn't understand how crummy he felt.The past few years have been awful, but now that we know what's going on, I'm hoping that life for both of us will improve. In fact, now that has been off the Liptor for several months, he has become a much nicer and happier person. Unfortunately, some of his physical symptoms remain.Show your husband this email because I have a message for him:Yes, you are going to be very frustrated and annoyed with your wife's situation. Connie won't feel up to doing the things she used to do even though she may look the same as always. The side effects of statin use change every day, and it's one thing after another as the statin drug has built up in her system. But, don't let this ruin your relationship. Now that Connie is aware of the dangers of statin drugs, she can pursue alternative treatments from her doctor. Try to support her, but be prepared; it might take a long time for Connie to feel normal again.Good luck to both of you!Regards,JudyOn 12-Oct-11, at 9:53 PM, cls54721 wrote: , thanks for the link on the Canadian report on caution and statin use in women. I am going to ask my husband to please read it and try to understand. But, that might be easier said than done. When I tell him I feel terrible and that I have burning pain in a particular area of my body, he says "you always hurt somewhere." And I proceeded to ask him do you think I am making this stuff up? I have had numerous mri's on my shoulders and my tennis elbow on the right side, I am right handed, and they all show moderate amounts of imflammation or calcium deposits, or partial tears. My physical therapist looked at my elbow films and said, you really have a lot of imflammation. When I would come into the office for my P/T, they would ask what is your pain level today on a scale of 1 to 10. I was never a good judge on that scale, but in the weeks I went there, I never felt better, sometimes worse. They would ask what did you do yesterday and I would tell them of the household chores I did, like lugging laundry up and down stairs, vacuuming, cleaning, etc. They said you probably shouldn't cook Thanksgiving dinner or go grocery shopping, etc. I told them if I don't do it, it won't get done, so I do it. My doctor told me the reason I wasn't getting better is the things I do in everyday life was the reason. Things I was doing with my hands like gripping and lifting were aggrevating my condition. I thought, what am I supposed to do, not take care of myself or do my housework? What kind of life is that if I can't do those things, much less work outside the home. I can't do that anymore because I don't have anything more than a HS education. My jobs all my life have been manual labor type jobs, factory or grocery stores. I quit working at age 50 at the height of my problems. Such is my quality of life. I did get a new kind of CoQ 10 that is 3 times stronger and has better absorption. I hope this brings me back from the pravastatin setback I am in since September. Any other suggestions or remedies I could try? Thanks. Connie > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours > > to get > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of > > mind is > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog > > moments, I > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was > > only in my > > early 50's. > > > > > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins > > and memory > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, > > which I > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, > > and I > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee > > and are > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for > > me that > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit > > for a > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't > > take > > this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I > > am more > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand. > > > > > > > > Connie > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > >

[Guest guest]

Hi Connie. I just had to write again when I read your email about your mom. I had a horrible experience with my mother who was on Crestor. At the time, was not on Lipitor, and we knew nothing about statin drugs or their side effects. Our ignorance and the incompetence of the doctor eventually landed my mother in the hospital. She could no longer walk well and so she decided that, in order to reduce trips to the bathroom, she would not drink anything. This, of course, led to dehydration and her first stay in the hospital. She continued to weaken, but she couldn't explain to us what was wrong. We bought her a walker, but her leg muscles were eventually too weak for her to get around with it. Everyday, all day, she just wanted to lie on her bed. She didn't want to see friends or go for supper as it meant having to get up. Her muscles eventually weakened so much, she could not feed herself as the spoon was too heavy!My mother also became very forgetful and fidgety. One doctor put her on an anti-depressant, even though I didn't think she was depressed, but I saw no improvement in her lethargy. Now I know why. I think that EVERYTHING was due to the side effects brought on by the Crestor.I am absolutely convinced that the Crestor was a contributing factor to her death even though she was no longer on it. The damage was done. Her final stay in the hospital was due to her inability to swallow. Guess what you need to be able to swallow? Muscle strength!How I wish I had the chance to look after my mom again. This time, I would know why she was acting the way she was. I would insist on seeing the blood work results which are to be done on a frequent basis (every three months, I think) to determine whether there is muscle deterioration occurring. (This is particularly important for older people.) I would be more understanding when she forgot things or felt too weak to get up. (I mentioned this to every doctor we saw, but they only thought it was depression and/or old age.) And most important of all, I would have tried to find a doctor to take her safely off Crestor much, much sooner. I urge you to go to your mother's doctor with her as soon as you can make an appointment. It is quite possible that everything you have described is due to the statin drugs, and it is very possible that without them, many of the other drugs may be safely dropped as well. Your mother is probably way over-medicated (many older people are). Also, insist on discussing her latest blood work results with the doctor, and if they are not recent, raise hell! Even the ads for these drugs state that monitoring the patient via blood work is vital.All the best.Judy On 13-Oct-11, at 12:18 PM, cls54721 wrote: Thanks and also Judy, I relate to the personality changes. I forgot to mention that my disposition changed when I was on the statin, but of course I didn't realize what was wrong. At that time I was very short-tempered and after a verbal blowout, I always wondered why I said what I did in such an agressive and sometimes hateful manner. I thought it was just because I felt so lousey and my life and my health seemed to be steadily going downhill. I saw no end to my misery. I was diagnosed by the doc who prescribed the statins with myositis after going to physical therapy for 8 weeks. My CPK level was not elevated however. This was about the time I started paying attention to the Lipitor commercials on TV and decided my muscle pains and weakness were unexplained since I was no longer working outside the home. I then asked the doctor if the statin could be a source of my problems and he said to quit the 10mg of simvastatin I had taken for over 6 years. I was 50 years old and felt like 80. My mom, 78, has been on statins for probably over 20 years. First, Lipitor, 20mg or maybe higher. Then, later she was switched to simvastatin, not sure of the mg. I heard that since Lipitor is so strong, it is like twice the dose of simvastatin. She has had alot of pain in her extremities, arms, feet, shoulders, etc. She always blames her degenerative spine condition, She has had 7 lower back and 2 cervical surgeries. Also, a knee and a hip replacement. She never seems to be much better after the surgeries, and I always tell her the pain is probably soft tissue, muscular pain due to the statins. She also was getting very forgetful and she was very hostile and had insomnia. Her life consists of very little beyond lying in bed and watching TV for most of the day, maybe some grocery and pharmacy pickups. She does very little housework and has very little interaction with others. I try to get her out once or twice a week for lunch. I told her all this lying around is causing her muscles to weaken, she can barely walk anymore. If I laid around all day, I would be stiff and sore by bedtime. I try to keep active through the pain. She takes hydrocodone (Vicodin) every night, she says so she can sleep. She used to take anti-depressants, which caused an inability to sit still, she would fidgit constantly. She also takes Coreg for heart failure and a BP drug, a thyroid drug, a drug for GERD, and 2 diabetes drugs. She is a walking pharmacy. At one point, my mom's CPK enzyme test was elevated, which I read was an indication of muscle damage. She asked to stop her statin, but as her cholesterol levels all climbed and her HDL level sank, she was told she needs to take something. She is afraid that she will have a HA or stroke if she doesn't take the drugs. But, she feels so miserable, she says she doesn't care IF she dies. She doesn't even realize the contradictions in her statements. This is her state of mind and body. So, now she takes a half of a 5mg tablet of Crestor daily. I told her I have read many bad things about Crestor, but she still takes it. Sorry again for the length of this post. As you can see, it seems statins have affected many members of my family. I hope if I share these experiences, someone who is new here might recognize some of the same in their families or themselves. Connie > > > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 > > hours > > > > to get > > > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of > > > > mind is > > > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog > > > > moments, I > > > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that > > I was > > > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was > > > > only in my > > > > early 50's. > > > > > > > > > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins > > > > and memory > > > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, > > > > which I > > > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > > > > > > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, > > > > and I > > > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, > > mostly > > > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee > > > > and are > > > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for > > > > me that > > > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit > > > > for a > > > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't > > > > take > > > > this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > > > > > > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove > > that I > > > > am more > > > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would > > understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > Connie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Sure. You should probably be taking anti-oxidants, and plenty of them, including: astaxanthin; krill oil or fish oil caps; vitamin C. You should also be sun-bathing or using a sun-tanning bed at least three times weekly, so your body can manufacture sufficient levels of vitamin D, which is essential for treating statin damage. Regards,.On 12-Oct-11, at 9:53 PM, cls54721 wrote: , thanks for the link on the Canadian report on caution and statin use in women. I am going to ask my husband to please read it and try to understand. But, that might be easier said than done. When I tell him I feel terrible and that I have burning pain in a particular area of my body, he says "you always hurt somewhere." And I proceeded to ask him do you think I am making this stuff up? I have had numerous mri's on my shoulders and my tennis elbow on the right side, I am right handed, and they all show moderate amounts of imflammation or calcium deposits, or partial tears. My physical therapist looked at my elbow films and said, you really have a lot of imflammation. When I would come into the office for my P/T, they would ask what is your pain level today on a scale of 1 to 10. I was never a good judge on that scale, but in the weeks I went there, I never felt better, sometimes worse. They would ask what did you do yesterday and I would tell them of the household chores I did, like lugging laundry up and down stairs, vacuuming, cleaning, etc. They said you probably shouldn't cook Thanksgiving dinner or go grocery shopping, etc. I told them if I don't do it, it won't get done, so I do it. My doctor told me the reason I wasn't getting better is the things I do in everyday life was the reason. Things I was doing with my hands like gripping and lifting were aggrevating my condition. I thought, what am I supposed to do, not take care of myself or do my housework? What kind of life is that if I can't do those things, much less work outside the home. I can't do that anymore because I don't have anything more than a HS education. My jobs all my life have been manual labor type jobs, factory or grocery stores. I quit working at age 50 at the height of my problems. Such is my quality of life. I did get a new kind of CoQ 10 that is 3 times stronger and has better absorption. I hope this brings me back from the pravastatin setback I am in since September. Any other suggestions or remedies I could try? Thanks. Connie > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours > > to get > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of > > mind is > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog > > moments, I > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was > > only in my > > early 50's. > > > > > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins > > and memory > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, > > which I > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, > > and I > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee > > and are > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for > > me that > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit > > for a > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't > > take > > this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I > > am more > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand. > > > > > > > > Connie > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > >

[Guest guest]

Bobby, I agree with you 100%.From: Olson <flyinresorts@...>"Lipitor " <Lipitor >Sent: Tue, October 11, 2011 1:34:09 PMSubject: Re: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

The following is just my personal opinion. Its OK if others disagree, but I personally believe statins offer ZERO benefit for anyone. I believe the 1% absolute risk reduction was manufactured out of corporate greed and doesn't really exist. I do not believe statins have ever offered anyone cardiovascular benefits, has ever prevented heart disease, or prevented heart attacks and strokes, or ever saved anyone's life. This is just the way I view the drugs. Their benefits are manufactured and exist only in the minds of the consumer.Bobby Alternate email: marooned@...Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Plannerwww.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation PackagesPhilippine Destination SpecialistFrom: davidturgeon <davidturgeon@...>Lipitor Cc: davidturgeon <davidturgeon@...>Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 12:20 PMSubject: Re: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

Re. statins and women's health. Please see this monograph from Health Canada on the evidence why statins are a poor choice for women and for anyone over the age of 50. It is from an authoritative, government source, is well written and contains balanced, objective information on statin use. http://www.whp-apsf.ca/pdf/statinsEvidenceCaution.pdfOn 11-Oct-11, at 11:30 AM, Mike Shea wrote: Statistics indicat that statins and women are not a match, very little if any benefit within large sample groups. The important thing is you have to know what is the nominal level of cholesterol is for you, everyone is different. What you also need to know is

that the cholesterol numbers that doctors like, or should I say big pharma likes are not

realistic, but do make huge profits. In the early days of cholesterol testing the norm was 200-240, this is without any medications, so this is where the body needs to be for the norm, however individually your number might be closer to 200 or 300 total, especially if you have northern blood. It should be obvious that your taking statins is not doing you any good and is reeking havoc with your body. Statins one benefit that is know is the reduction of inflamation. This is their only value, but the side effects and cellular damage are too high a price to pay when there are other things that will do as good or better job of reducing inflamation. Mike Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins Gene, thanks for sharing this. I told my husband since I started taking the pravastatin, I feel terrible with aches in many places of my body. And my husband said to me, "I want to ask you, why did your doctor give you this drug if he knew you had problems before?" I said that this is a different statin, but they all work the same way. I told him that since my LDL has been creeping up, my

doc wants to put me on a statin. I told the doc I would try this one cause I asked for an older drug, but I guess I can't take any of them without muscle problems. Years ago, my husband, who is now 61, went for a checkup. He hardly ever goes to the doctor, anyway. The lab tests ordered did include a lipid panel and the doc said the results showed total cholesterol around 220, I think. The doc said to watch his diet, and he lost over 30 lbs. but he never had the lab tests repeated. I said if he went back and had the tests done again, and if his levels were still high, the doc would probably suggest he take a statin, too. He just never goes to the doctor. The only health problems he has is a slight asthma problem. Since I am diabetic and have labs done every 4 months, my doc always seems to check the lipids. I am just going to tell him in January that prastatin is not for me. And my

doc still believes what the drug reps tell him. They probably say that lower cholesterol levels equals lower heart attack risk. NOT. My father-in-law had a few small heart attacks when he was in his lower 70's, and he was probably taking a statin at that time. He passed away from Alzheimer's dementia. My mother-in-law was taking Zocor or simvastatin of at least 40 mg for years. She had a massive heart attack at age 92 and had irreversible damage. She was removed from life support as a result. Both my in-laws took any medication that was prescribed for them without question. I doubt the statins my in-laws took protected them, since they both had heart attacks. Connie > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to get you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind is still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, I thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only in my early 50's. > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and memory loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which I could

stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and are killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me that have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am more susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand. > > > > Connie > > > ------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

The latest Spacedoc.com quotes studies that indicate that extremely

low-dose statins (under the threshold that would trigger the cholestrol

reduction reaction) can have benefit...

Linden

Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing

statins

Gene, thanks for sharing this. I told my husband since I started taking

the

pravastatin, I feel terrible with aches in many places of my body. And

my

husband said to me, " I want to ask you, why did your doctor give you

this

drug if he knew you had problems before? " I said that this is a

different

statin, but they all work the same way. I told him that since my LDL has

been creeping up, my doc wants to put me on a statin. I told the doc I

would try this one cause I asked for an older drug, but I guess I can't

take

any of them without muscle problems.

Years ago, my husband, who is now 61, went for a checkup. He hardly ever

goes to the doctor, anyway. The lab tests ordered did include a lipid

panel

and the doc said the results showed total cholesterol around 220, I

think.

The doc said to watch his diet, and he lost over 30 lbs. but he never

had

the lab tests repeated. I said if he went back and had the tests done

again, and if his levels were still high, the doc would probably

suggest he

take a statin, too. He just never goes to the doctor. The only health

problems he has is a slight asthma problem.

Since I am diabetic and have labs done every 4 months, my doc always

seems

to check the lipids. I am just going to tell him in January that

prastatin

is not for me. And my doc still believes what the drug reps tell him.

They

probably say that lower cholesterol levels equals lower heart attack

risk.

NOT.

My father-in-law had a few small heart attacks when he was in his lower

70's, and he was probably taking a statin at that time. He passed away

from

Alzheimer's dementia. My mother-in-law was taking Zocor or simvastatin

of

at least 40 mg for years. She had a massive heart attack at age 92 and

had

irreversible damage. She was removed from life support as a result. Both

my in-laws took any medication that was prescribed for them without

question. I doubt the statins my in-laws took protected them, since they

both had heart attacks.

Connie

> > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to

get

you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind

is

still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments,

I

thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was

developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only

in my

early 50's.

> >

> > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and

memory

loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which

I

could stop and not really Alzheimer's.

> >

> > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I

haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly

around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and

are

killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me

that

have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a

while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take

this statin (pravastatin) either.

> >

> > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am

more

susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

> >

> > Connie

> >

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

The article I saw was A Case for Low Dose Statins?from Oct 2011.

There have been mentions for some time that some researchers believe

that the anti-inflammatory effect of statins is what gives what

positive results that there are, and apparently that effect is there

even with very low dosages.

Personally, with the side effects I had from Mevacor, I won't touch

them with a barge-pole, but it is worth watching, especially as it

might hopefully get people off of the heavy dosages and still save face

for the doctors who prescribed them.

Linden

Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing

statins

Linden, I went to the Spacecoc homepage, but I wasn't sure where to

find the article on the studies that you spoke about. Could you provide

a specific link? I saw two articles, one called Low Dose Statins and

the other called A Case for Low Dose Statins. Is either of these the

articles you intented for me to read? Thanks.

Connie

> > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours

to

> get

> you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of

mind

> is

> still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog

moments,

> I

> thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was

> developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was

only

> in my

> early 50's.

> > >

> > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and

> memory

> loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins,

which

> I

> could stop and not really Alzheimer's.

> > >

> > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin,

and I

> haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly

> around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee

and

> are

> killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me

> that

> have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit

for a

> while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't

take

> this statin (pravastatin) either.

> > >

> > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I

am

> more

> susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

> > >

> > > Connie

> > >

> >

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

All of my many toxic effects came from a relatively low dose of 10mg. Lipitor daily. It's not just the daily dose, it's also the length of time it's taken. Several years of a low dose regime can lead to as many toxic effects as a high dose for a shorter period.The anti-inflammatory claims are an attempt to maintain a market for this poison in the face of mounting evidence that the cholesterol (lipid) theory claims are hogwash.Dave T. On 31-Oct-11, at 1:49 AM, Linden wrote: The article I saw was A Case for Low Dose Statins?from Oct 2011. There have been mentions for some time that some researchers believe that the anti-inflammatory effect of statins is what gives what positive results that there are, and apparently that effect is there even with very low dosages. Personally, with the side effects I had from Mevacor, I won't touch them with a barge-pole, but it is worth watching, especially as it might hopefully get people off of the heavy dosages and still save face for the doctors who prescribed them. Linden Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins Linden, I went to the Spacecoc homepage, but I wasn't sure where to find the article on the studies that you spoke about. Could you provide a specific link? I saw two articles, one called Low Dose Statins and the other called A Case for Low Dose Statins. Is either of these the articles you intented for me to read? Thanks. Connie > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to > get > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind > is > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, > I > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only > in my > early 50's. > > > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and > memory > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which > I > could stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, and I > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and > are > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me > that > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take > this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am > more > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand. > > > > > > Connie > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > >

[Guest guest]

"The anti-inflammatory claims are an attempt to maintain a market for this poison in the face of mounting evidence that the cholesterol (lipid) theory claims are hogwash."That has got to be one of the most profound statements of the decade. It bears wisdom and insight. The drug companies are simply trying to hold onto market share as long as they can by creating a new perceived "benefit" as the public slowly but surely gives up on the cholesterol theory.But if inflammation is the cause ( Underscore IF) then there are much cheaper and safer ways to deal with it. Bobby Alternate email: marooned@...Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Plannerwww.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation PackagesPhilippine Destination SpecialistFrom: davidturgeon

<davidturgeon@...>Lipitor Cc: davidturgeon <davidturgeon@...>Sent: Monday, October 31, 2011 8:58 PMSubject: Re: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

All of my many toxic effects came from a relatively low dose of 10mg. Lipitor daily. It's not just the daily dose, it's also the length of time it's taken. Several years of a low dose regime can lead to as many toxic effects as a high dose for a shorter period.The anti-inflammatory claims are an attempt to maintain a market for this poison in the face of mounting evidence that the cholesterol (lipid) theory claims are hogwash.Dave T. On 31-Oct-11, at 1:49 AM, Linden wrote: The article I saw was A Case for Low Dose Statins?from Oct 2011. There have been mentions for some time that some researchers believe that the anti-inflammatory effect of statins is what gives what positive results that there are, and apparently

that effect is there even with very low dosages. Personally, with the side effects I had from Mevacor, I won't touch them with a barge-pole, but it is worth watching, especially as it might hopefully get people off of the heavy dosages and still save face for the doctors who prescribed them. Linden Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins Linden, I went to the Spacecoc homepage, but I wasn't sure where to find the

article on the studies that you spoke about. Could you provide a specific link? I saw two articles, one called Low Dose Statins and the other called A Case for Low Dose Statins. Is either of these the articles you intented for me to read? Thanks. Connie > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours to > get > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of mind > is > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog moments, > I > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I was > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was only > in my > early 50's. > > > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins and > memory > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, which > I > could stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks

since I started the pravastatin, and I > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, mostly > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee and > are > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas for me > that > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit for a > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't take > this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I am > more > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand. > > > > > > Connie > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > >

[Guest guest]

Quoting Connie:"I would rather take an antioxidant type of supplement to ease inflammation. I asked my doc years ago why my mother, who always had low blood pressure now had to take hypertension drugs. He said that as we age, the vessels of the body lose their elasticity and do not dialate well and are prone to small cracks, like an aging rubber tire.I would think that something like Vitamin E or Co Q10 would help in this regard. Anybody have any thoughts on

this? Are the supplements that are advertised for heart health just snake oil or are they of any benefit?..."Connie, L- arginine is an amino acid, which is a precursor to Nitric Oxide, which relaxes blood vessels. I call them my "happy pills" and if you read up on L-arginine, you will understand.Raw garlic is another thats supossed to be god for artery health.Bobby Alternate email: marooned@...Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Plannerwww.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation PackagesPhilippine Destination SpecialistFrom: cls54721

<cls54721@...>Lipitor Sent: Tuesday, November 1, 2011 1:20 PMSubject: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

Thanks for your replies, Linden and and others. It's been a couple weeks since I stopped taking the couple weeks' worth of Pravastatin. I am starting to feel better, but I did not call my doc to tell him I quit.

The articles about low doses decreasing inflammtion is not enough reason for me to take even the 20mg of Pravastatin. I found this link from eMed tv site on the dosing of Pravastatin.

http://drugs.emedtv.com/pravastatin/dosing-with-pravastatin.html

It seems that my dose was lower than the recommeded dose of 40mg for adults. 20mg is the recommended dose for children 8 to 13, 40mg for ages 14 to 18. I can't imagine how this could affect a child's future, it's just ridiculous.

I would rather take an antioxidant type of supplement to ease inflammation. I asked my doc years ago why my mother, who always had low blood pressure now had to take hypertension drugs. He said that as we age, the vessels of the body lose their elasticity and do not dialate well and are prone to small cracks, like an aging rubber tire.

I would think that something like Vitamin E or Co Q10 would help in this regard. Anybody have any thoughts on this? Are the supplements that are advertised for heart health just snake oil or are they of any benefit? Has anyone tried something that helped with the damage or lowered their LDL without statins? , I do remember reading an article from the Linus ing Foundation that said a Vitamin C defiency is related to CVD.

I am of the belief now that my cholesterol numbers are not that bad

(Total--221, Ratio 3.9, (range < or = 5.0) Trigs--113, HDL--56, LDL--142)

but if I could lower the LDL level to close to 100, I could get my doctor off my back and have him stop pushing the statins. My husband does want me to find another doctor.

Connie

> > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours

> > to

> > > get

> > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of

> > mind

> > > is

> > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog

> > moments,

> > > I

> > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I

> > was

> > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was

> > only

> > > in my

> > > early 50's.

> > > > >

> > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins

> > and

> > > memory

> > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins,

> > which

> > > I

> > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's.

> > > > >

> > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin,

> > and I

> > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain,

> > mostly

> > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee

> > and

> > > are

> > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas

> > for me

> > > that

> > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit

> > for a

> > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't

> > take

> > > this statin (pravastatin) either.

> > > > >

> > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I

> > am

> > > more

> > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

> > > > >

> > > > > Connie

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Connie,Would you be interested in having the same LDL cholesterol as a population in the world that has the least amount of heart disease? If so, you will need to increase your LDL to 170.Its very difficult to shake the idea of 'Bad" cholesterol with all the marketing and sales that is tossed our way, But I would encourage you to think about it. Bobby Alternate email: marooned@...Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Plannerwww.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation PackagesPhilippine Destination SpecialistFrom: cls54721 <cls54721@...>Lipitor Sent: Tuesday, November 1, 2011 1:20 PMSubject: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

Thanks for your replies, Linden and and others. It's been a couple weeks since I stopped taking the couple weeks' worth of Pravastatin. I am starting to feel better, but I did not call my doc to tell him I quit.

The articles about low doses decreasing inflammtion is not enough reason for me to take even the 20mg of Pravastatin. I found this link from eMed tv site on the dosing of Pravastatin.

http://drugs.emedtv.com/pravastatin/dosing-with-pravastatin.html

It seems that my dose was lower than the recommeded dose of 40mg for adults. 20mg is the recommended dose for children 8 to 13, 40mg for ages 14 to 18. I can't imagine how this could affect a child's future, it's just ridiculous.

I would rather take an antioxidant type of supplement to ease inflammation. I asked my doc years ago why my mother, who always had low blood pressure now had to take hypertension drugs. He said that as we age, the vessels of the body lose their elasticity and do not dialate well and are prone to small cracks, like an aging rubber tire.

I would think that something like Vitamin E or Co Q10 would help in this regard. Anybody have any thoughts on this? Are the supplements that are advertised for heart health just snake oil or are they of any benefit? Has anyone tried something that helped with the damage or lowered their LDL without statins? , I do remember reading an article from the Linus ing Foundation that said a Vitamin C defiency is related to CVD.

I am of the belief now that my cholesterol numbers are not that bad

(Total--221, Ratio 3.9, (range < or = 5.0) Trigs--113, HDL--56, LDL--142)

but if I could lower the LDL level to close to 100, I could get my doctor off my back and have him stop pushing the statins. My husband does want me to find another doctor.

Connie

> > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours

> > to

> > > get

> > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of

> > mind

> > > is

> > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog

> > moments,

> > > I

> > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I

> > was

> > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was

> > only

> > > in my

> > > early 50's.

> > > > >

> > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins

> > and

> > > memory

> > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins,

> > which

> > > I

> > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's.

> > > > >

> > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin,

> > and I

> > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain,

> > mostly

> > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee

> > and

> > > are

> > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas

> > for me

> > > that

> > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit

> > for a

> > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't

> > take

> > > this statin (pravastatin) either.

> > > > >

> > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I

> > am

> > > more

> > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

> > > > >

> > > > > Connie

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

IMHO, virtually the entire medical community is in denial about the long term toxic effects of statin drugs. The possibility of experiencing any one of those toxic effects far outweighs the possibility of any real benefits from lower cholesterol. Its pretty clear the more we age the more we require the benefits of cholesterol. Artificially lowering the levels of a substance our bodies require in plentiful measure seems crazy to me. But then I don't own any shares in the drug companies that are making billions pushing this poison.Dave Turgeon.On 1-Nov-11, at 2:20 PM, cls54721 wrote: Thanks for your replies, Linden and and others. It's been a couple weeks since I stopped taking the couple weeks' worth of Pravastatin. I am starting to feel better, but I did not call my doc to tell him I quit. The articles about low doses decreasing inflammtion is not enough reason for me to take even the 20mg of Pravastatin. I found this link from eMed tv site on the dosing of Pravastatin. http://drugs.emedtv.com/pravastatin/dosing-with-pravastatin.html It seems that my dose was lower than the recommeded dose of 40mg for adults. 20mg is the recommended dose for children 8 to 13, 40mg for ages 14 to 18. I can't imagine how this could affect a child's future, it's just ridiculous. I would rather take an antioxidant type of supplement to ease inflammation. I asked my doc years ago why my mother, who always had low blood pressure now had to take hypertension drugs. He said that as we age, the vessels of the body lose their elasticity and do not dialate well and are prone to small cracks, like an aging rubber tire. I would think that something like Vitamin E or Co Q10 would help in this regard. Anybody have any thoughts on this? Are the supplements that are advertised for heart health just snake oil or are they of any benefit? Has anyone tried something that helped with the damage or lowered their LDL without statins? , I do remember reading an article from the Linus ing Foundation that said a Vitamin C defiency is related to CVD. I am of the belief now that my cholesterol numbers are not that bad (Total--221, Ratio 3.9, (range < or = 5.0) Trigs--113, HDL--56, LDL--142) but if I could lower the LDL level to close to 100, I could get my doctor off my back and have him stop pushing the statins. My husband does want me to find another doctor. Connie > > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours > > to > > > get > > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of > > mind > > > is > > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog > > moments, > > > I > > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I > > was > > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was > > only > > > in my > > > early 50's. > > > > > > > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins > > and > > > memory > > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins, > > which > > > I > > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's. > > > > > > > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin, > > and I > > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, > > mostly > > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee > > and > > > are > > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas > > for me > > > that > > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit > > for a > > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't > > take > > > this statin (pravastatin) either. > > > > > > > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I > > am > > > more > > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand. > > > > > > > > > > Connie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Connie, do you have any known cardiovascular disease? If so. the L-arginine may not be a good idea. But if you have NOT suffered a heart attack and don't have any problems with any existing plaque build up, L- arginine will help keep the arteries smooth and flexible. I pay $4 for L-arginine at Walmart. Your doctor is trained to lower LDL. Its part of his living, and what goes on backstage would shock us all. Think of it this way: The local roofing company would love to sell us a new roof for our house, even if the homeowner doesn't need a new roof, they may convince some elderly widow lady she has roof damage, and buying a new roof now will save her home from water damage in the near future. In reality, there is nothing wrong with the

existing roof. But by convincing the customer there is a problem, a sale is made. The sales person gets a bonus for reaching a numbers goal. Likewise, there is a lot of money to be made telling people they are sick, when in reality there is nothing wrong.If I were in your shoes at the doctor, I would just politely say "No thank-you. I appreciate your concern, but I'm not interested." Bobby Alternate email: marooned@...Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Plannerwww.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation PackagesPhilippine Destination SpecialistFrom: cls54721 <cls54721@...>Lipitor Sent: Tuesday, November 1, 2011 8:03 PMSubject: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

Bobby, I know what you're saying, I just thought if I lowered my LDL my doc would quit bugging me. I will try to find the L-arginine at the local pharmacy. Don't think I could tolerate raw garlic, though.

I have been in communication with Barbara and she said I probably shouldn't take any statins with my history. She recommended a diet similar to the Mediterranean diet, and to cut out all meat except heart healthy fish and low fat meats. I already eat a diet fairly low in carbs because I am a type 2 diabetic. I eat mostly whole grains and few fruits and starchy vegetables. I do still eat lean beef and pork tenderloin, the leanest cut of pork.

Thanks again,

Connie

> > > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours

> > > to

> > > > get

> > > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of

> > > mind

> > > > is

> > > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog

> > > moments,

> > > > I

> > > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I

> > > was

> > > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was

> > > only

> > > > in my

> > > > early 50's.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins

> > > and

> > > > memory

> > > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins,

> > > which

> > > > I

> > > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin,

> > > and I

> > > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain,

> > > mostly

> > > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee

> > > and

> > > > are

> > > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas

> > > for me

> > > > that

> > > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit

> > > for a

> > > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't

> > > take

> > > > this statin (pravastatin) either.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I

> > > am

> > > > more

> > > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Connie

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > ------------------------------------

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Hi Bobby,

I take Vitamin E, (Unique E - mixed tocopherols and separate tocotrienols) and Co Q 10, I had a neck artery scan earlier this year, all clear, the person doing the scan was surprised and no one said anything to me about that scan, it was effectively ignored

Now, I don't know if the fact that I take these supplements has anything to do with it of course, but I'm sure as hell not going to give up taking them!

Best,

e

From: Olson <flyinresorts@...>Subject: Re: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins"Lipitor " <Lipitor >Date: Tuesday, November 1, 2011, 8:38 PM

Quoting Connie:

"I would rather take an antioxidant type of supplement to ease inflammation. I asked my doc years ago why my mother, who always had low blood pressure now had to take hypertension drugs. He said that as we age, the vessels of the body lose their elasticity and do not dialate well and are prone to small cracks, like an aging rubber tire.I would think that something like Vitamin E or Co Q10 would help in this regard. Anybody have any thoughts on this? Are the supplements that are advertised for heart health just snake oil or are they of any benefit?..."

Connie, L- arginine is an amino acid, which is a precursor to Nitric Oxide, which relaxes blood vessels. I call them my "happy pills" and if you read up on L-arginine, you will understand.

Raw garlic is another thats supossed to be god for artery health.

Bobby

Alternate email: marooned@...

Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Planner

www.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation Packages

Philippine Destination Specialist

From: cls54721 <cls54721@...>Lipitor Sent: Tuesday, November 1, 2011 1:20 PMSubject: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

Thanks for your replies, Linden and and others. It's been a couple weeks since I stopped taking the couple weeks' worth of Pravastatin. I am starting to feel better, but I did not call my doc to tell him I quit.The articles about low doses decreasing inflammtion is not enough reason for me to take even the 20mg of Pravastatin. I found this link from eMed tv site on the dosing of Pravastatin.http://drugs.emedtv.com/pravastatin/dosing-with-pravastatin.htmlIt seems that my dose was lower than the recommeded dose of 40mg for adults. 20mg is the recommended dose for children 8 to 13, 40mg for ages 14 to 18. I can't imagine how this could affect a child's future, it's just ridiculous.I would rather take an antioxidant type of supplement to ease inflammation. I asked my doc years ago why my mother, who

always had low blood pressure now had to take hypertension drugs. He said that as we age, the vessels of the body lose their elasticity and do not dialate well and are prone to small cracks, like an aging rubber tire.I would think that something like Vitamin E or Co Q10 would help in this regard. Anybody have any thoughts on this? Are the supplements that are advertised for heart health just snake oil or are they of any benefit? Has anyone tried something that helped with the damage or lowered their LDL without statins? , I do remember reading an article from the Linus ing Foundation that said a Vitamin C defiency is related to CVD.I am of the belief now that my cholesterol numbers are not that bad(Total--221, Ratio 3.9, (range < or = 5.0) Trigs--113, HDL--56, LDL--142) but if I could lower the LDL level to close to 100, I could get my doctor off my back and have him stop pushing the statins. My husband does want me

to find another doctor.Connie> > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was

driving you around for 4 hours> > to> > > get> > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of> > mind> > > is> > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog> > moments,> > > I> > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I > > was> > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was> > only> > > in my> > > early 50's.> > > > >> > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins > > and> > > memory> > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins,> > which> > > I> > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's.> > > > >> > > >

> It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin,> > and I> > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, > > mostly> > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee> > and> > > are> > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas > > for me> > > that> > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit> > for a> > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't> > take> > > this statin (pravastatin) either.> > > > >> > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I> > am> > > more> > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.> > > >

>> > > > > Connie> > > > >> > > >> > >> > > ------------------------------------> > >> > >

[Guest guest]

Congratulations e on the clear arteries. Sometimes its hard to say exactly why and where the credit goes. I myself am considered high risk with a strong family history, high tryglicerides, low HDL, hypothyroidism, yet ultrasound shows my neck arteries and heart valves in excellent condition at age 54. WHY?Is it the fish oil I take? Is it the L- arginine? Is it my coffee addiction? Who knows? Bobby Alternate email: marooned@...Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Plannerwww.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation PackagesPhilippine Destination

SpecialistFrom: kristine franklin-ross <krisross50@...>Lipitor Sent: Wednesday, November 2, 2011 10:47 AMSubject: Re: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

Hi Bobby,

I take Vitamin E, (Unique E - mixed tocopherols and separate tocotrienols) and Co Q 10, I had a neck artery scan earlier this year, all clear, the person doing the scan was surprised and no one said anything to me about that scan, it was effectively ignored

Now, I don't know if the fact that I take these supplements has anything to do with it of course, but I'm sure as hell not going to give up taking them!

Best,

e

From: Olson <flyinresorts@...>Subject: Re: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins"Lipitor " <Lipitor >Date: Tuesday, November 1, 2011, 8:38 PM

Quoting Connie:

"I would rather take an antioxidant type of supplement to ease inflammation. I asked my doc years ago why my mother, who always had low blood pressure now had to take hypertension drugs. He said that as we age, the vessels of the body lose their elasticity and do not dialate well and are prone to small cracks, like an aging rubber tire.I would think that something like Vitamin E or Co Q10 would help in this regard. Anybody have any thoughts on this? Are the supplements that are advertised for heart health just snake oil or are they of any benefit?..."

Connie, L- arginine is an amino acid, which is a precursor to Nitric Oxide, which relaxes blood vessels. I call them my "happy pills" and if you read up on L-arginine, you will understand.

Raw garlic is another thats supossed to be god for artery health.

Bobby

Alternate email: marooned@...

Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Planner

www.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation Packages

Philippine Destination Specialist

From: cls54721 <cls54721@...>Lipitor Sent: Tuesday, November 1, 2011 1:20 PMSubject: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

Thanks for your replies, Linden and and others. It's been a couple weeks since I stopped taking the couple weeks' worth of Pravastatin. I am starting to feel better, but I did not call my doc to tell him I quit.The articles about low doses decreasing inflammtion is not enough reason for me to take even the 20mg of Pravastatin. I found this link from eMed tv site on the dosing of Pravastatin.http://drugs.emedtv.com/pravastatin/dosing-with-pravastatin.htmlIt seems that my dose was lower than the recommeded dose of 40mg for adults. 20mg is the recommended dose for children 8 to 13, 40mg for ages 14 to 18. I can't imagine how this could affect a child's future, it's just ridiculous.I would rather take an antioxidant type of supplement to ease inflammation. I asked my doc years ago why my mother, who

always had low blood pressure now had to take hypertension drugs. He said that as we age, the vessels of the body lose their elasticity and do not dialate well and are prone to small cracks, like an aging rubber tire.I would think that something like Vitamin E or Co Q10 would help in this regard. Anybody have any thoughts on this? Are the supplements that are advertised for heart health just snake oil or are they of any benefit? Has anyone tried something that helped with the damage or lowered their LDL without statins? , I do remember reading an article from the Linus ing Foundation that said a Vitamin C defiency is related to CVD.I am of the belief now that my cholesterol numbers are not that bad(Total--221, Ratio 3.9, (range < or = 5.0) Trigs--113, HDL--56, LDL--142) but if I could lower the LDL level to close to 100, I could get my doctor off my back and have him stop pushing the statins. My husband does want me

to find another doctor.Connie> > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was

driving you around for 4 hours> > to> > > get> > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of> > mind> > > is> > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog> > moments,> > > I> > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I > > was> > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was> > only> > > in my> > > early 50's.> > > > >> > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins > > and> > > memory> > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins,> > which> > > I> > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's.> > > > >> > > >

> It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin,> > and I> > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain, > > mostly> > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee> > and> > > are> > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas > > for me> > > that> > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit> > for a> > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't> > take> > > this statin (pravastatin) either.> > > > >> > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I> > am> > > more> > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.> > > >

>> > > > > Connie> > > > >> > > >> > >> > > ------------------------------------> > >> > >

[Guest guest]

Connie, sounds like you could take the L-Arginine without any problems based upon your description, but the best way to determine if you have clogged arteries (without subjecting yourself to high doses of radiation) is ultrasound of the neck arteries, and your heart. The ultrasound is not able to look at the main arteries branching off the heart. To see those areas requires imaging of the chest which is high doses of radiation.The reason I stated my concern if you already have heart disease is a study showed increase in heart attacks in heart patients who took L- arginine. But these people had already developed plaque that could break off and induce a heart attack.However for the person who

doesn't have heart disease, L- arginine will boost levels of nitric oxide, which keeps arteries smooth, flexible, and more open, thus lowering blood pressure. The ability of L- Arginine to increase blood flow has its advantages for a man's love life. That's why I call them my "happy pills"But there can be side effects to arginene supplementation. So far I have not experienced any side effects. You may want to research it before making a decision. Nothing is risk free. I have no clue if being diabetic and taking arginine is a problem or not. Bobby. Alternate email: marooned@...Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Plannerwww.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation PackagesPhilippine Destination

SpecialistFrom: cls54721 <cls54721@...>Lipitor Sent: Wednesday, November 2, 2011 4:49 PMSubject: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

Bobby,

As a type 2 diabetic, as soon as my total cholesterol climbed past 200 (I was never told what the LDL was at that time in 1999) I was told I have to lower it. When diet changes did not lower it enough, that's when the Zocor was prescribed. At that time I had no idea about the side effects. I was on the Zocor or simvastatin until 2004 when I made the connection of muscle destruction and statins by listening to those wonderful Lipitor commercials.

I know now that the levels recommended are beyond what most people can achieve and that low levels are not necessary. When my total was 167, I felt the worst. I also had protein in my urine back then which I believe was probably caused by the muscle breakdown. I've never had a heart attack.

Because I had taken Avandia (which now is almost off the market entirely because it increased heart attacks), I had to have a stress test to check for heart damage. My gastro doc wouldn't do my screening colonoscopy without a cardiologist's clearance. I was told the test was normal. I assume that means I don't have CVD. I never had any ultrasound tests for blockages. My doc always listens to my carotid artery in my neck and says it is fine and he checks the pulses in my legs. I also had a test for PAD which was negative for PAD. So I assume I do not have any heart disease, just the added risk factor of diabetes. It seemed like my doc was trying to scare me into taking the statins because of the diabetes.

So, does it sound like I could take the L-arginine with no problems?

Thanks,

Connie

> > > > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours

> > > > to

> > > > > get

> > > > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of

> > > > mind

> > > > > is

> > > > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog

> > > > moments,

> > > > > I

> > > > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I

> > > > was

> > > > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was

> > > > only

> > > > > in my

> > > > > early 50's.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins

> > > > and

> > > > > memory

> > > > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins,

> > > > which

> > > > > I

> > > > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin,

> > > > and I

> > > > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain,

> > > > mostly

> > > > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee

> > > > and

> > > > > are

> > > > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas

> > > > for me

> > > > > that

> > > > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit

> > > > for a

> > > > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't

> > > > take

> > > > > this statin (pravastatin) either.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I

> > > > am

> > > > > more

> > > > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Connie

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

Connie, sounds like you could take the L-Arginine without any problems based upon your description, but the best way to determine if you have clogged arteries (without subjecting yourself to high doses of radiation) is ultrasound of the neck arteries, and your heart. The ultrasound is not able to look at the main arteries branching off the heart. To see those areas requires imaging of the chest which is high doses of radiation.The reason I stated my concern if you already have heart disease is a study showed increase in heart attacks in heart patients who took L- arginine. But these people had already developed plaque that could break off and induce a heart attack.However for the person who

doesn't have heart disease, L- arginine will boost levels of nitric oxide, which keeps arteries smooth, flexible, and more open, thus lowering blood pressure. The ability of L- Arginine to increase blood flow has its advantages for a man's love life. That's why I call them my "happy pills"But there can be side effects to arginene supplementation. So far I have not experienced any side effects. You may want to research it before making a decision. Nothing is risk free. I have no clue if being diabetic and taking arginine is a problem or not. Bobby. Alternate email: marooned@...Bobby- Your Caribbean Travel Plannerwww.pinkystravel.com International Destinations, Resorts, Vacation PackagesPhilippine Destination

SpecialistFrom: cls54721 <cls54721@...>Lipitor Sent: Wednesday, November 2, 2011 4:49 PMSubject: Re: my latest labs, doc still pushing statins

Bobby,

As a type 2 diabetic, as soon as my total cholesterol climbed past 200 (I was never told what the LDL was at that time in 1999) I was told I have to lower it. When diet changes did not lower it enough, that's when the Zocor was prescribed. At that time I had no idea about the side effects. I was on the Zocor or simvastatin until 2004 when I made the connection of muscle destruction and statins by listening to those wonderful Lipitor commercials.

I know now that the levels recommended are beyond what most people can achieve and that low levels are not necessary. When my total was 167, I felt the worst. I also had protein in my urine back then which I believe was probably caused by the muscle breakdown. I've never had a heart attack.

Because I had taken Avandia (which now is almost off the market entirely because it increased heart attacks), I had to have a stress test to check for heart damage. My gastro doc wouldn't do my screening colonoscopy without a cardiologist's clearance. I was told the test was normal. I assume that means I don't have CVD. I never had any ultrasound tests for blockages. My doc always listens to my carotid artery in my neck and says it is fine and he checks the pulses in my legs. I also had a test for PAD which was negative for PAD. So I assume I do not have any heart disease, just the added risk factor of diabetes. It seemed like my doc was trying to scare me into taking the statins because of the diabetes.

So, does it sound like I could take the L-arginine with no problems?

Thanks,

Connie

> > > > > > > Linden, you mean your cousin was driving you around for 4 hours

> > > > to

> > > > > get

> > > > > you to a place 45 minutes from the airport? A man in his state of

> > > > mind

> > > > > is

> > > > > still driving? When I was at my worst and having the brain fog

> > > > moments,

> > > > > I

> > > > > thought to myself, should I be driving? And, I was worried that I

> > > > was

> > > > > developing some form of early onset Alzheimer's disease and I was

> > > > only

> > > > > in my

> > > > > early 50's.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > When I found this forum and other websites that cited statins

> > > > and

> > > > > memory

> > > > > loss, I was hoping that my memory problems were from the statins,

> > > > which

> > > > > I

> > > > > could stop and not really Alzheimer's.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > It has been less than 2 weeks since I started the pravastatin,

> > > > and I

> > > > > haven't even taken it every day, and I have many areas of pain,

> > > > mostly

> > > > > around my tendons. My right hip and lower right back and left knee

> > > > and

> > > > > are

> > > > > killing me and neck pain. These are all previous problem areas

> > > > for me

> > > > > that

> > > > > have flared up again. I seem to get stiff muscles as soon as I sit

> > > > for a

> > > > > while or first thing when I get out of bed. I have decided I can't

> > > > take

> > > > > this statin (pravastatin) either.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I wish I could get one of those genetic tests that prove that I

> > > > am

> > > > > more

> > > > > susceptible to statin damage. Maybe then my doctor would understand.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Connie

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > >

> > > > >