Re: A:homeopathic vaccinations

[Guest guest]

Matt,

I used to do homeopathic vaccinations until I studied with Dr. Gueniot.

If a person still wants "vaccinations" (but supposedly a safer type), they really still are of the belief that the germ theory is responsible for illness.

If however one really understands our paradigm, they don't need immunization of any type, they need to follow the healthy lifestyle choices that Loreen mentioned. If one practices preventive medicine, one should expect that the children will acquire their own immunity via exposure to the microbes. This will produce permanent immunity. It is necessary that the parents are welll educated in the purpose of illness, fever etc.

If they still want immunization, then they may as well take their chances with a conventional model-because homeopathic vaccines are against the theory of how homeopathy works. We prescribe a remedy AFTER the person has the condition, not as preventive before the fact. They would better off receiving their miasm or their constitutional remedy (one of the 7).

My $0.02 worth.

Dick Thom

Beaverton, OR

cancer, endocrine, Health of Business

[Guest guest]

Hello Everyone,

I have always answered that question similarly to Dr. Thom and Dr. Dawson however recently I have been thinking that if something like Mucococcinum is able to help prime the immune system to react more effectively to a virus or whathaveyou then why wouldn't a homeopathic vaccine also do the same thing? Any why wouldn't something like that for a parent who chooses to not conventionally vaccinate but work on all the other things that affect immune function as well as use a homeopathic primer be in a good preventative situation?? These are thoughts and having a new baby of course it comes up again and again. I have not recommended this yet but think that there could be a place for it. Of course there are no guarantees and I agree that we don't want to encourage a false sense of security and then have the parents do nothing but for the right patient situation it may be appropriate.

I realize my point of view goes against the drainage norm but I am curious if others have experience with homeopathic vaccines?

Polinsky, ND

Vancouver, B.C.

Family Medicine

RE: R:homeopathic vaccinations

Hi Matt

I am asked this question quite frequently. This is basically what I tell parents.

Even though many people practice and encourage homeopathic vaccination, as far as I know there is no evidence that homeopathic vaccination works (If anyone else has evidence I would really appreciate it.) Homeopathic vaccination goes against the principles of homeopathy. I am worried that it will give parents a false sense of security.

If parents choose not to vaccinate their children, they must ensure all things are in place to help their child be as healthy as possible (diet, sleep, exercise, etc). They have to be prepared for the child to catch some childhood diseases. (I usually also explain I don’t think this is a bad thing, and is probably actually beneficial.)

If parents choose not to vaccinate, I think it is important that they educate themselves in the basics of either homeopathy or herbal medicine, and have some type of first aid kit on hand. This way, if the child suddenly becomes sick they will have things on hand that will help quickly. I tell them that if something is going around the community, or, if they do come down with something, we will treat it aggressively at that time to try to prevent the child from getting sick, or if they do, minimize consequences and sequela. They must under stand that all childhood illnesses carry some (very minor) risks, just like there are risks to vaccines. I usually end up saying that in my experience of seeing both unvaccinated and vaccinated kids in my practice, I would say that the unvaccinated kids are significantly healthier and have much stronger vitality, and are better able to fight off anything that comes along. I tell them I will work with them and their children to teach them how to keep their children healthy.

If they still want to do the homeopathic vaccination, I tell them I don’t do it because I don’t think it is the right thing to do, but I will give them the name of a local homeopath that does it.

Loreen Dawson, ND

Sechelt, BC

Family Medicine

--No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.12.8/162 - Release Date: 11/5/2005

--No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.2.0/275 - Release Date: 3/6/2006

[Guest guest]

Hello all- I don't have personal experience with recommending homeopathic vaccinations but there are some resources out there. There's a book available from the "Whole Health Now" website written by Isaac Golden PhD, ND. He's an Australian homeopath who has done extensive work in this area. The book is called Vaccination and Homeoprophylaxis : A Review of Risks and Alternatives I also have a hard copy of the schedule he was recommending in October of 2003. It may have changed since then. It involves giving several rounds of high dose (200C- 10M) nosodes at prescribed intervals. Too much for me to type at this instant but I'll send it along if anybody really wants it. Also, while I was at NCNM, Dr. had given us some recommendations on how to prevent disruption of the vital force if parents should choose to go the conventional vaccination

route. It involved doing each vaccine individually (no DPT or MMR combos) and preparing the body three days before with a dose of the isode in a 200C potency, then after the final booster, giving ascending doses of the isode on consecutive days. I hope this is helpful. - Picard ND Family Practice N.field, RI "Dr. Polinsky" <drpolinsky@...> wrote: Hello Everyone, I have always answered that question similarly to Dr. Thom and Dr. Dawson however recently

I have been thinking that if something like Mucococcinum is able to help prime the immune system to react more effectively to a virus or whathaveyou then why wouldn't a homeopathic vaccine also do the same thing? Any why wouldn't something like that for a parent who chooses to not conventionally vaccinate but work on all the other things that affect immune function as well as use a homeopathic primer be in a good preventative situation?? These are thoughts and having a new baby of course it comes up again and again. I have not recommended this yet but think that there could be a place for it. Of course there are no guarantees and I agree that we don't want to encourage a false sense of security and then have the parents do nothing but for the right patient situation it may be appropriate. I realize my point of view goes against the drainage norm but I am

curious if others have experience with homeopathic vaccines? Polinsky, ND Vancouver, B.C. Family Medicine RE: R:homeopathic

vaccinations Hi Matt I am asked this question quite frequently. This is basically what I tell parents. Even though many people practice and encourage homeopathic vaccination, as far as I know there is no evidence that homeopathic vaccination works (If anyone else has evidence I would really appreciate it.) Homeopathic vaccination goes against the principles of homeopathy. I am

worried that it will give parents a false sense of security. If parents choose not to vaccinate their children, they must ensure all things are in place to help their child be as healthy as possible (diet, sleep, exercise, etc). They have to be prepared for the child to catch some childhood diseases. (I usually also explain I don’t think this is a bad thing, and is probably actually beneficial.) If

parents choose not to vaccinate, I think it is important that they educate themselves in the basics of either homeopathy or herbal medicine, and have some type of first aid kit on hand. This way, if the child suddenly becomes sick they will have things on hand that will help quickly. I tell them that if something is going around the community, or, if they do come down with something, we will treat it aggressively at that time to try to prevent the child from getting sick, or if they do, minimize consequences and sequela. They must under stand that all childhood illnesses carry some (very minor) risks, just like there are risks to vaccines. I usually end up saying that in my experience of seeing both unvaccinated and vaccinated kids in my practice, I would say that the unvaccinated kids are significantly healthier and have much stronger vitality, and are better able to fight off anything that comes along. I tell them I will work with them and

their children to teach them how to keep their children healthy. If they still want to do the homeopathic vaccination, I tell them I don’t do it because I don’t think it is the right thing to do, but I will give them the name of a local homeopath that does it. Loreen Dawson, ND Sechelt, BC Family Medicine --No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.12.8/162 - Release Date: 11/5/2005 --No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.2.0/275 - Release Date: 3/6/2006

[Guest guest]

DT,

Do you no longer use muco as a preventative? If you do

still use it what is your thinking per your comments

below.

always questioning....

take care

Tufenkian

--- Drdwthom@... wrote:

> Matt,

> I used to do homeopathic vaccinations until I

> studied with Dr. Gueniot.

>

> If a person still wants " vaccinations " (but

> supposedly a safer type),

> they really still are of the belief that the germ

> theory is responsible for

> illness.

>

> If however one really understands our paradigm,

> they don't need

> immunization of any type, they need to follow the

> healthy lifestyle choices that

> Loreen mentioned. If one practices preventive

> medicine, one should expect that the

> children will acquire their own immunity via

> exposure to the microbes. This

> will produce permanent immunity. It is necessary

> that the parents are welll

> educated in the purpose of illness, fever etc.

>

> If they still want immunization, then they may

> as well take their

> chances with a conventional model-because

> homeopathic vaccines are against the

> theory of how homeopathy works. We prescribe a

> remedy AFTER the person has the

> condition, not as preventive before the fact. They

> would better off receiving

> their miasm or their constitutional remedy (one of

> the 7).

>

> My $0.02 worth.

>

> Dick Thom

> Beaverton, OR

> cancer, endocrine, Health of Business

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I no longer actively promote it but many patients have used it for years and just pick it up in the office.

In general, most of our patients may get a mild flu (as they should) and then recover without complication.

Dick Thom

Beaverton, Or

DT,

Do you no longer use muco as a preventative? If you do

still use it what is your thinking per your comments

below.

always questioning....

take care

Tufenkian

--- Drdwthom@... wrote:

> Matt,

>      I used to do homeopathic vaccinations until I

> studied with Dr. Gueniot.

>     

>      If a person still wants "vaccinations" (but

> supposedly a safer type),

> they really still are of the belief that the germ

> theory is responsible for

> illness.

>

>      If however one really understands our paradigm,

> they don't need

> immunization of any type, they need to follow the

> healthy lifestyle choices that

> Loreen mentioned. If one practices preventive

> medicine, one should expect that the

> children will acquire their own immunity via

> exposure to the microbes. This

> will produce permanent immunity. It is necessary

> that the parents are welll

> educated in the purpose of illness, fever etc.

>

>      If they still want immunization, then they may

> as well take their

> chances with a conventional model-because

> homeopathic vaccines are against the

> theory of how homeopathy works. We prescribe a

> remedy AFTER the person has the

> condition, not as preventive before the fact. They

> would better off receiving

> their miasm or their constitutional remedy (one of

> the 7).

>

>      My $0.02 worth.

>

>      Dick Thom

>      Beaverton, OR

>      cancer, endocrine, Health of Business

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi (and all)—on one of my occ’l emergences—

I would be interested in seeing that

schedule.  Can you send as an attachment?

Thx.

Dr. Penelope B.

Houghton

Acadia Naturopathic

Medical Clinic

53 Church Street

Ellsworth, Maine 04605

Phone 207.664.0780

Fax 207.664.0401

Confidentiality

Notice: This e-mail

message including attachments, if any, is intended only for the person or

entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged

material. Any unauthorized review, use, diclosure or distribution is

prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please

notify me by reply e-mail and promptly destroy the original message.

Thank you.

Re:

A:homeopathic vaccinations

Hello all-

I don't have personal experience with

recommending homeopathic vaccinations but there are some resources out

there. There's a book available from the " Whole Health

Now " website written by Isaac Golden PhD, ND. He's an

Australian homeopath who has done extensive work in this area. The book is

called

Vaccination and

Homeoprophylaxis : A Review of Risks and Alternatives

I also have a hard copy of the schedule he was

recommending in October of 2003. It may have changed since then. It

involves giving several rounds of high dose (200C- 10M) nosodes at

prescribed intervals. Too much for me to type at this instant but I'll

send it along if anybody really wants it.

Also, while I was at NCNM,

Dr. had given us some recommendations on how to prevent disruption of

the vital force if parents should choose to go the conventional vaccination

route. It involved doing each vaccine individually (no DPT or MMR

combos) and preparing the body three days before with a dose of the isode in a

200C potency, then after the final booster, giving ascending doses of the isode

on consecutive days.

I hope this is helpful.

- Picard ND

Family Practice

N.field, RI

" Dr.

Polinsky " <drpolinsky@...> wrote:

Hello Everyone,

I have always answered that question

similarly to Dr. Thom and Dr. Dawson however recently I have been thinking that

if something like Mucococcinum is able to help prime the immune system to react

more effectively to a virus or whathaveyou then why wouldn't a homeopathic

vaccine also do the same thing? Any why wouldn't something like

that for a parent who chooses to not conventionally vaccinate but work on

all the other things that affect immune function as well as use a homeopathic

primer be in a good preventative situation?? These are thoughts and

having a new baby of course it comes up again and again. I have not

recommended this yet but think that there could be a place for it. Of

course there are no guarantees and I agree that we don't want to encourage a

false sense of security and then have the parents do nothing but for the right

patient situation it may be appropriate.

I realize my point of view goes

against the drainage norm but I am curious if others have experience with

homeopathic vaccines?

Polinsky, ND

Vancouver, B.C.

Family Medicine

RE:

R:homeopathic vaccinations

Hi Matt

I am asked this question

quite frequently. This is basically what I tell parents.

Even though many people

practice and encourage homeopathic vaccination, as far as I know there is no

evidence that homeopathic vaccination works (If anyone else has evidence I

would really appreciate it.) Homeopathic vaccination goes against the principles

of homeopathy. I am worried that it will give parents a false sense

of security.

If parents choose not to

vaccinate their children, they must ensure all things are in place to help

their child be as healthy as possible (diet, sleep, exercise, etc). They

have to be prepared for the child to catch some childhood diseases. (I

usually also explain I don’t think this is a bad thing, and is probably

actually beneficial.)

If parents choose not to

vaccinate, I think it is important that they educate themselves in the basics

of either homeopathy or herbal medicine, and have some type of first aid kit on

hand. This way, if the child suddenly becomes sick they will have things

on hand that will help quickly. I tell them that if something is

going around the community, or, if they do come down with something, we will

treat it aggressively at that time to try to prevent the child from getting

sick, or if they do, minimize consequences and sequela. They must

under stand that all childhood illnesses carry some (very minor) risks, just

like there are risks to vaccines. I usually end up saying that in my

experience of seeing both unvaccinated and vaccinated kids in my practice, I

would say that the unvaccinated kids are significantly healthier and have much

stronger vitality, and are better able to fight off anything that comes

along. I tell them I will work with them and their children to teach them

how to keep their children healthy.

If they still want to do

the homeopathic vaccination, I tell them I don’t do it because I

don’t think it is the right thing to do, but I will give them the name of

a local homeopath that does it.

Loreen Dawson, ND

Sechelt, BC

Family Medicine

--

No virus found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.12.8/162 - Release Date: 11/5/2005

--

No virus found in this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.2.0/275 - Release Date: 3/6/2006

--

No virus found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.2.0/275 - Release Date: 3/6/2006

--

No virus found in this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.2.0/275 - Release Date: 3/6/2006

[Guest guest]

-

I was also thinking about the idea of using homeopathic X-ray preventatively and how that works as prevention, yet I guess there is a definite exposure there. I also do not use hp vaccinations based on the premise of the development of the immune system. If we know that specific immunity is not intact until at least 4 years old, then why would we use anything to stimulate this...homeopathic or not. I also agree with the notion that we treat based on matching the totality of symptoms or the essence of the case to the remedy.

Allie NDSeaside, OR

[Guest guest]

Dear ,

as far as I understand it muccococcinum is not a vaccination; it consists of many different strains of the flu virus, including the most pathogenic ones in past history; it is supposed to work by generally stimulating the immune system and increasing its response to flu type viral infections; this is different than homeopathic occillinum, which is a combo of the current virus strains and is supposed to speficially protect against these, kind of like vaccines. hope this helps,

le Duebendorfer, ND

Sandpoint, ID

Re: A:homeopathic vaccinations

DT,Do you no longer use muco as a preventative? If you dostill use it what is your thinking per your commentsbelow.always questioning....take care Tufenkian--- Drdwthom@... wrote:> Matt,> I used to do homeopathic vaccinations until I> studied with Dr. Gueniot.> > If a person still wants "vaccinations" (but> supposedly a safer type), > they really still are of the belief that the germ> theory is responsible for > illness. > > If however one really understands our paradigm,> they don't need > immunization of any type, they need to follow the> healthy lifestyle choices that > Loreen mentioned. If one practices preventive> medicine, one should expect that the > children will acquire their own immunity via> exposure to the microbes. This > will produce permanent immunity. It is necessary> that the parents are welll > educated in the purpose of illness, fever etc.> > If they still want immunization, then they may> as well take their > chances with a conventional model-because> homeopathic vaccines are against the > theory of how homeopathy works. We prescribe a> remedy AFTER the person has the > condition, not as preventive before the fact. They> would better off receiving > their miasm or their constitutional remedy (one of> the 7).> > My $0.02 worth.> > Dick Thom> Beaverton, OR> cancer, endocrine, Health of Business> __________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hello all-

The question about mucococcinum and vaccines is more that if mucoccoccinum stimulates the immune system as a "primer" for preparation when the person encounters a virus - then why wouldn't homeopathic vaccines act in a similar manner? I don't think homeopathic vaccines would change titre levels or even so much change antibody levels but perhaps prep the body in advance of an encounter to help with optimizing the immune response. This is all theoretical at present and I don't use them and have always thought of them as not relevant etc. However, I think it is worth a discussion and specifically to consider what do we think is happening. I think of information (frequency) being introduced to the body through a homeopathic and so there may be merit in having the information for say, pertussis, before actually encountering a full exposure.

I think the answer may come more completely in homeopathic theory and if there are other opinions on this please let us hear them.

To Laureen, I don't know if your experience was a suppression as in theory the mucoccoccinum should have helped make your illness more efficient - which is what I have mostly seen clinically - but certainly something was in the way of an ideal flu response.

All of these opinions and discussions are (as I see it) important as we all need to occasionally question what we do and how do we think things are working.

Polinsky, ND

Vancouver, BC

Family Medicine

Re: A:homeopathic vaccinations

DT,Do you no longer use muco as a preventative? If you dostill use it what is your thinking per your commentsbelow.always questioning....take care Tufenkian--- Drdwthom@... wrote:> Matt,> I used to do homeopathic vaccinations until I> studied with Dr. Gueniot.> > If a person still wants "vaccinations" (but> supposedly a safer type), > they really still are of the belief that the germ> theory is responsible for > illness. > > If however one really understands our paradigm,> they don't need > immunization of any type, they need to follow the> healthy lifestyle choices that > Loreen mentioned. If one practices preventive> medicine, one should expect that the > children will acquire their own immunity via> exposure to the microbes. This > will produce permanent immunity. It is necessary> that the parents are welll > educated in the purpose of illness, fever etc.> > If they still want immunization, then they may> as well take their > chances with a conventional model-because> homeopathic vaccines are against the > theory of how homeopathy works. We prescribe a> remedy AFTER the person has the > condition, not as preventive before the fact. They> would better off receiving > their miasm or their constitutional remedy (one of> the 7).> > My $0.02 worth.> > Dick Thom> Beaverton, OR> cancer, endocrine, Health of Business> __________________________________________________