Re: Diabetes Insipidus>>low Creatinine...?

[Guest guest]

A Doctors Data heavy metals (6 hour urine collection) test I recently

did showed below-normal Creatinine levels. Could this be due to the

urine being dilute due to DI, or what does it mean? (The metals

levels weren't remarkable...)

> >

> > HI All,

> >

> > I was fortunate to watch the discovery channel tonight, the

series

> > on " Mysterious Diagnosis. " They hightlighted diabetes insipidus.

> This

> > can be controlled with the hormone Vasopressin, which can be

> obtained

> > as a prescription. (Inhaled.)

> >

> > This really hit home with me. I am thisty all day. Any problems

> with

> > this treatment with someone who has CFS???

> >

> > Thank you all in advance,

> >

> > Janet

> >

>

[Guest guest]

" Dr. Amy Yasko

as well as the DAN! project people have done a lot of work in this

area, and the CFS community stands to benefit a great deal from what

they have already done, in my opinion. "

I have a feeling that there work can be applied across other health issues -

what do you think?

Regards

CS

[Guest guest]

Hi, shakerz25.

I agree with Blake about the need to do a full 24-hour urine sample to

check the daily production of creatinine.

If you still find low creatinine in a 24-hour sample, then a major

suspect is a block in your methylation cycle. Seventy percent of the

methylation capacity of SAMe goes into synthesis of creatine, and

creatinine is the breakdown product of creatine. Thus, low 24-hour

creatinine excretion suggests low creatine production, which suggests

low methylation capacity of SAMe, which suggests a block in the

methylation cycle. This is commonly found in autism, where

glutathione depletion is also found, and it appears to be common in

CFS as well. Fortunately there are treatments, also used in autism,

that can compensate for the genetic variations in enzymes that impact

teh sulfur metabolism, including the methylation cycle. Dr. Amy Yasko

as well as the DAN! project people have done a lot of work in this

area, and the CFS community stands to benefit a great deal from what

they have already done, in my opinion.

Rich

>

> A Doctors Data heavy metals (6 hour urine collection) test I

recently

> did showed below-normal Creatinine levels. Could this be due to the

> urine being dilute due to DI, or what does it mean? (The metals

> levels weren't remarkable...)

[Guest guest]

Hi,

6 hour urine creatinine is far from 100% representative. A recent client of mine

had low 6 hour creatinine, and normal 24 hour creatinine. Your levels are likely

low but I would suggest confirming it with a 24 hour creatinine.

Blake

Re: Diabetes Insipidus>>low Creatinine...?

A Doctors Data heavy metals (6 hour urine collection) test I recently

did showed below-normal Creatinine levels. Could this be due to the

urine being dilute due to DI, or what does it mean? (The metals

levels weren't remarkable...)

> >

> > HI All,

> >

> > I was fortunate to watch the discovery channel tonight, the

series

> > on " Mysterious Diagnosis. " They hightlighted diabetes insipidus.

> This

> > can be controlled with the hormone Vasopressin, which can be

> obtained

> > as a prescription. (Inhaled.)

> >

> > This really hit home with me. I am thisty all day. Any problems

> with

> > this treatment with someone who has CFS???

> >

> > Thank you all in advance,

> >

> > Janet

> >

>

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

[Guest guest]

Hi, Les.

Yes, that is an issue. It would be a good idea to look at

creatinine in both the blood serum and in the urine. The other

thing a doctor can do to evaluate kidney function is to look at the

level of BUN in the blood (blood urea nitrogen). That wouldn't be

affected by the methylation problem.

Rich

> >

> > A Doctors Data heavy metals (6 hour urine collection) test I

> recently

> > did showed below-normal Creatinine levels. Could this be due

to the

> > urine being dilute due to DI, or what does it mean? (The

metals

> > levels weren't remarkable...)

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences

with each other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested

in any treatment discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> [Original Message]

> From: shakerz25 <shakerz25@...>

> < >

> Date: 5/5/2006 11:08:52 PM

> Subject: Re: Diabetes Insipidus>>low Creatinine...?

>

> A Doctors Data heavy metals (6 hour urine collection) test I recently

> did showed below-normal Creatinine levels. Could this be due to the

> urine being dilute due to DI, or what does it mean? (The metals

> levels weren't remarkable...)

>

>

> > >

> > > HI All,

> > >

> > > I was fortunate to watch the discovery channel tonight, the

> series

> > > on " Mysterious Diagnosis. " They hightlighted diabetes insipidus.

> > This

> > > can be controlled with the hormone Vasopressin, which can be

> > obtained

> > > as a prescription. (Inhaled.)

> > >

> > > This really hit home with me. I am thisty all day. Any problems

> > with

> > > this treatment with someone who has CFS???

> > >

> > > Thank you all in advance,

> > >

> > > Janet

> > >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with

each other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any

treatment discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

[Guest guest]

hi i had a test done with metametrix lab for metals and nutrients and my

creatine appearted much higher than it normally would be..i was told for my

spe ific test they use the creatiniene to normalize test results... and u

had to limit your volumeof fluid prior to the test so i guess the higher

number reflected the reduced volumen. ..dont understand the tecnincal part

but they need the creatiine to use in fgureing out the other results..if a

person is overhy7draated prior to the test than the results maybe faulty

from a talk i had with someone... tealk

> [Original Message]

> From: shakerz25 <shakerz25@...>

> < >

> Date: 5/5/2006 11:08:52 PM

> Subject: Re: Diabetes Insipidus>>low Creatinine...?

>

> A Doctors Data heavy metals (6 hour urine collection) test I recently

> did showed below-normal Creatinine levels. Could this be due to the

> urine being dilute due to DI, or what does it mean? (The metals

> levels weren't remarkable...)

>

>

> > >

> > > HI All,

> > >

> > > I was fortunate to watch the discovery channel tonight, the

> series

> > > on " Mysterious Diagnosis. " They hightlighted diabetes insipidus.

> > This

> > > can be controlled with the hormone Vasopressin, which can be

> > obtained

> > > as a prescription. (Inhaled.)

> > >

> > > This really hit home with me. I am thisty all day. Any problems

> > with

> > > this treatment with someone who has CFS???

> > >

> > > Thank you all in advance,

> > >

> > > Janet

> > >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with

each other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any

treatment discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi, tealk.

In determining whether you have normal methylation capacity, it is

necessary to look at the total amount of creatinine excreted in 24

hours. If you are only looking at a first morning spot urine

sample, the amount of creatinine in that sample is not appropriate

for determining methylation capacity. You're right, it is useful

for normalizing the amounts of other substances found in that test.

It corrects for the fact that there may be more or less water

diluting these substances. But you need to know the total amount of

creatinine excreted in 24 hours to determine whether your

methylation capacity is low.

Rich

>

> hi i had a test done with metametrix lab for metals and nutrients

and my

> creatine appearted much higher than it normally would be..i was

told for my

> spe ific test they use the creatiniene to normalize test

results... and u

> had to limit your volumeof fluid prior to the test so i guess the

higher

> number reflected the reduced volumen. ..dont understand the

tecnincal part

> but they need the creatiine to use in fgureing out the other

results..if a

> person is overhy7draated prior to the test than the results maybe

faulty

> from a talk i had with someone... tealk

[Guest guest]

Dear shakerz25,

You can't reach a conclusion about the creatinine in a 6-hour urine

collection. You need to do a 24-hour collection. If the total urine

volume is more that 2.5 liters in 24 hours, that suggests diabetes of

one sort or another (mellitus or insipidus). If in addition you don't

have excessive blood glucose or glucose in your urine, then you can

narrow it down to diabetes insipidus. There are two general types of

diabetes insipidus. In CFS, the central type is common.

If the total creatinine excreted in the urine over 24 hours is low

relative to the normal range, and you have reasonable muscle mass,

then it suggests low methylation capacity. If on the other hand, you

are very emaciated, the low creatinine could be due to low muscle

mass. In CFS, though, it looks as though it usually means low

methylation capacity.

Rich

> > [Original Message]

> > From: shakerz25 <shakerz25@...>

> > < >

> > Date: 5/5/2006 11:08:52 PM

> > Subject: Re: Diabetes Insipidus>>low

Creatinine...?

> >

> > A Doctors Data heavy metals (6 hour urine collection) test I

recently

> > did showed below-normal Creatinine levels. Could this be due to

the

> > urine being dilute due to DI, or what does it mean? (The metals

> > levels weren't remarkable...)