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hi everyone, my name is Dani and I'm a RN in Northern CA. Have been following these posts for many months and have emailed back and forth with Lorie a few times but never posted myself. I tested positive for Etg once in July of 2004 after 2 1/2 years in Diversion and just now started on probation. I go to my support group every week and recently have seen a rise in positive Etg without drinking in our group and one of the nurses asked me to share her story and see what type of feedback I could get, so here goes. This RN has been in the probation program for 2 years without problem, had gastric bypass surgery mid last year with many complications. Probation decides not to test her because she is in and out of the hospital and did recieve pain medication which they were aware of. She is now doing much better and has lost a significant amount of weight. Has now started being tested again and recently all her Etg's have been

positive without drinking, even her probation monitor does not believe she has been drinking. So she goes to see Dr. Vonsteiff who has seen her, and many other RN's in the program, before. He is the Drug and Alcohol Rehab program director for a major hospital. This doc decides to call the board and is then given a number for the lab who did the test. After several minutes he returns to the exam room very upset and tells this nurse that the lab testing our urines is not certified. He then asks her to wait because he wants to make another call, so she does. After 30 min he comes back and states he called his private attorney who would like to take on the case and requests that all the RN's that have tested positive in our group contact him. So needless to say she is a little overwhelmed and doesn't know what to do. Now, from reading all these posts it is my understanding that only a couple labs do our Etg testing, is

this correct? She did not have the name of the lab when I spoke with her. Also I am assuming that at least a few of you have already checked on these labs and would have already been aware if they were not certified? Also one of the other nurses was wondering if Etg could be fat stored and due to her recent weight loss could have caused her positives?? We are finding it difficult to believe that these labs would not be certified. Any input??? Thanks for reading Dani

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>

> Hi Dani,

> As for the correlation between positive EtGs and gastric bypass,

there have been a few reports here, but I don't know if there's a

statistically significant correlation. Is her name Donna? also

mentioned a nurse in Fresno. I'm just trying to figure out if we're

all talking about the same person or if there are several cases of

this!

> If she's in CA BRN probation, her testing is done by NMS, right?

You can look at all their certifications at

http://www.nmslabs.com/2004/licensure.asp. The only thing that's

missing is SAMHSA certification (see the list at

http://dwp.samhsa.gov/drugtesting/Level_1_Pages/LstClab060206.aspx).

However, since our program is not part of any federal program or

workplace drug testing program, I don't think it is required to be

SAMHSA-certified.

> As for EtG labs, there are 5-6 now--NMS, NWTox, Redwood Toxicology,

TASC, and USDTL.

> I am curious what they are doing with this nurse's license. Sounds

like, for the most part, everyone believes she's telling the truth.

Is her license suspended? I can only tell her that, unless they tell

her that they will not test her for EtG anymore, her problems will

likely continue. I would suggest she attack the test's credibility

and it sounds like she's been given some hope by her doc's personal

attorney. Maybe if he's experienced in this sort of thing, he'd be

willing to issue a " cease and desist " letter to the labs with a

threat of follow-up legal action. I'm not a nurse, but I'd love to

talk to the guy!

> EtG is water soluble and therefore should not be stored in the fat

tissue.

> Lorie

>

> New story

>

>

>

> hi everyone, my name is Dani and I'm a RN in Northern CA. Have

been following these posts for many months and have emailed back and

forth with Lorie a few times but never posted myself. I tested

positive for Etg once in July of 2004 after 2 1/2 years in Diversion

and just now started on probation. I go to my support group every

week and recently have seen a rise in positive Etg without drinking

in our group and one of the nurses asked me to share her story and

see what type of feedback I could get, so here goes.

> This RN has been in the probation program for 2 years without

problem, had gastric bypass surgery mid last year with many

complications. Probation decides not to test her because she is in

and out of the hospital and did recieve pain medication which they

were aware of. She is now doing much better and has lost a

significant amount of weight. Has now started being tested again and

recently all her Etg's have been positive without drinking, even her

probation monitor does not believe she has been drinking. So she

goes to see Dr. Vonsteiff who has seen her, and many other RN's in

the program, before. He is the Drug and Alcohol Rehab program

director for a major hospital. This doc decides to call the board and

is then given a number for the lab who did the test. After several

minutes he returns to the exam room very upset and tells this nurse

that the lab testing our urines is not certified. He then asks her

to wait because he wants to make another call, so she does. After 30

min he comes back and states he called his private attorney who would

like to take on the case and requests that all the RN's that have

tested positive in our group contact him.

> So needless to say she is a little overwhelmed and doesn't know

what to do. Now, from reading all these posts it is my understanding

that only a couple labs do our Etg testing, is this correct? She did

not have the name of the lab when I spoke with her.

> Also I am assuming that at least a few of you have already

checked on these labs and would have already been aware if they were

not certified?

> Also one of the other nurses was wondering if Etg could be fat

stored and due to her recent weight loss could have caused her

positives??

> We are finding it difficult to believe that these labs would not

be certified.

> Any input???

> Thanks for reading

> Dani

>

I just looked at samhsa list and NH is not on it! any

suggestions?? thank you

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Our group facilitator tries to be as neutral as possible and offers as much support as he can but he is very aware of the limitations of what he can do. He has tried in the past to call the Diversion program and was not well recieved. My take is that he believes us but feels his hands are tied. Whenever he does have contact with the BRN he does make sure to voice his concerns about the Etg testing and does include our concerns in his reports but it hasn't done any good. DaniLorie Garlick <lorieg@...> wrote: I'm just curious....This is a nurse support group you attend....What information/feedback is the facilitator giving you all? Who is she "siding" with, or is each person judged individually? Based on the numbers I'm hearing and the two years of using EtG now in CA, the AG office must be getting overrun with these shoddy cases. Lorie New story hi everyone, my name is Dani and I'm a RN in Northern CA. Have been following these posts for many months and have emailed back and forth with Lorie a few times but never posted myself. I tested positive for Etg once in July of 2004 after 2 1/2 years in Diversion and just now started on probation. I go to my support group every week and recently have seen a rise in positive Etg without drinking in our group and one of the nurses asked me to share her story

and see what type of feedback I could get, so here goes. This RN has been in the probation program for 2 years without problem, had gastric bypass surgery mid last year with many complications. Probation decides not to test her because she is in and out of the hospital and did recieve pain medication which they were aware of. She is now doing much better and has lost a significant amount of weight. Has now started being tested again and recently all her Etg's have been positive without drinking, even her probation monitor does not believe she has been drinking. So she goes to see Dr. Vonsteiff who has seen her, and many other RN's in the program, before. He is the Drug and Alcohol Rehab program director for a major hospital. This doc decides to call the board and is then given a number for the lab who did the test. After several minutes he returns to the exam room very upset and tells this nurse that the lab testing our urines is

not certified. He then asks her to wait because he wants to make another call, so she does. After 30 min he comes back and states he called his private attorney who would like to take on the case and requests that all the RN's that have tested positive in our group contact him. So needless to say she is a little overwhelmed and doesn't know what to do. Now, from reading all these posts it is my understanding that only a couple labs do our Etg testing, is this correct? She did not have the name of the lab when I spoke with her. Also I am assuming that at least a few of you have already checked on these labs and would have already been aware if they were not certified? Also one of the other nurses was wondering if Etg could be fat stored and due to her recent weight loss could have caused her positives?? We are finding it difficult to believe that these labs would not be certified. Any

input??? Thanks for reading Dani

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I was just trying to figure out who is responsible. I've heard the "My hands are tied" before in this mess....From DEC members. Which leaves me wondering....Whose hands are UNTIED and who is calling the shots? The labs and Compassvision/TPAs, I'm convinced.

There are a lot of you CA RN's on this site. They allow public input at board meetings. Why don't you ask for some answers & ask for this issue to be placed on a meeting agenda?

Lorie

New story

hi everyone, my name is Dani and I'm a RN in Northern CA. Have been following these posts for many months and have emailed back and forth with Lorie a few times but never posted myself. I tested positive for Etg once in July of 2004 after 2 1/2 years in Diversion and just now started on probation. I go to my support group every week and recently have seen a rise in positive Etg without drinking in our group and one of the nurses asked me to share her story and see what type of feedback I could get, so here goes.

This RN has been in the probation program for 2 years without problem, had gastric bypass surgery mid last year with many complications. Probation decides not to test her because she is in and out of the hospital and did recieve pain medication which they were aware of. She is now doing much better and has lost a significant amount of weight. Has now started being tested again and recently all her Etg's have been positive without drinking, even her probation monitor does not believe she has been drinking. So she goes to see Dr. Vonsteiff who has seen her, and many other RN's in the program, before. He is the Drug and Alcohol Rehab program director for a major hospital. This doc decides to call the board and is then given a number for the lab who did the test. After several minutes he returns to the exam room very upset and tells this nurse that the lab testing our urines is not certified. He then asks her to wait because he wants to make another call, so she does. After 30 min he comes back and states he called his private attorney who would like to take on the case and requests that all the RN's that have tested positive in our group contact him.

So needless to say she is a little overwhelmed and doesn't know what to do. Now, from reading all these posts it is my understanding that only a couple labs do our Etg testing, is this correct? She did not have the name of the lab when I spoke with her.

Also I am assuming that at least a few of you have already checked on these labs and would have already been aware if they were not certified?

Also one of the other nurses was wondering if Etg could be fat stored and due to her recent weight loss could have caused her positives??

We are finding it difficult to believe that these labs would not be certified.

Any input???

Thanks for reading

Dani

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Hi all, just started reading the recent posts. I will be out of this nightmare on August 24th, hopefully without anymore false positives. I have luckily not had any negative consequences d/t my false positive, but I feel it is my duty to take part in any action to see this test is discontinued or modified. Lorie, I am grateful you are still leading the charge on this test and putting so much effort and energy into this. Please let me know if I can help. Jamissale Glenn <rndani@...> wrote: Not the same RN, this one is in my Concord group. Her license so far has not been suspended but her case was just turned over to the Attorney Generals office last week. I will be seeing her tonight and will ask her if she minds if I give you the docs phone number. We have had 3 other RN's all test positive in the last month, it seems like every week someone else comes up positive, everyone is scared to death. Thanks for the input, I will share it tonight with her. DaniLorie Garlick <lorieg@...> wrote: Hi Dani, As for the correlation between positive EtGs and gastric bypass, there have been a few reports here, but I don't know if there's a statistically significant correlation. Is her name

Donna? also mentioned a nurse in Fresno. I'm just trying to figure out if we're all talking about the same person or if there are several cases of this! If she's in CA BRN probation, her testing is done by NMS, right? You can look at all their certifications at http://www.nmslabs.com/2004/licensure.asp. The only thing that's missing is SAMHSA certification (see the list at http://dwp.samhsa.gov/drugtesting/Level_1_Pages/LstClab060206.aspx). However, since our program is not part of any federal program or workplace drug testing program, I don't think it is required to be SAMHSA-certified. As for EtG labs, there are 5-6 now--NMS, NWTox, Redwood Toxicology, TASC, and USDTL. I am curious what they are doing with this nurse's license. Sounds like, for the most part, everyone believes she's

telling the truth. Is her license suspended? I can only tell her that, unless they tell her that they will not test her for EtG anymore, her problems will likely continue. I would suggest she attack the test's credibility and it sounds like she's been given some hope by her doc's personal attorney. Maybe if he's experienced in this sort of thing, he'd be willing to issue a "cease and desist" letter to the labs with a threat of follow-up legal action. I'm not a nurse, but I'd love to talk to the guy! EtG is water soluble and therefore should not be stored in the fat tissue. Lorie New story hi everyone, my name is Dani and I'm a RN in Northern CA. Have been following these posts for many months and have emailed back and forth with Lorie a few times but never posted myself. I tested positive for Etg once in July of 2004 after 2 1/2 years in Diversion and just now started on probation. I go to my support group every week and recently have seen a rise in positive Etg without drinking in our group and one of the nurses asked me to share her story and see what type of feedback I could get, so here goes. This RN has been in the probation program for 2 years without problem, had gastric bypass

surgery mid last year with many complications. Probation decides not to test her because she is in and out of the hospital and did recieve pain medication which they were aware of. She is now doing much better and has lost a significant amount of weight. Has now started being tested again and recently all her Etg's have been positive without drinking, even her probation monitor does not believe she has been drinking. So she goes to see Dr. Vonsteiff who has seen her, and many other RN's in the program, before. He is the Drug and Alcohol Rehab program director for a major hospital. This doc decides to call the board and is then given a number for the lab who did the test. After several minutes he returns to the exam room very upset and tells this nurse that the lab testing our urines is not certified. He then asks her to wait because he wants to make another call, so she does. After 30 min he comes back and states he called his

private attorney who would like to take on the case and requests that all the RN's that have tested positive in our group contact him. So needless to say she is a little overwhelmed and doesn't know what to do. Now, from reading all these posts it is my understanding that only a couple labs do our Etg testing, is this correct? She did not have the name of the lab when I spoke with her. Also I am assuming that at least a few of you have already checked on these labs and would have already been aware if they were not certified? Also one of the other nurses was wondering if Etg could be fat stored and due to her recent weight loss could have caused her positives?? We are finding it difficult to believe that these labs would not be certified. Any input??? Thanks for reading Dani

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BRAVO for you, Jamissa! Oh, what I wouldn't do to be in your shoes!

Lorie

New story

hi everyone, my name is Dani and I'm a RN in Northern CA. Have been following these posts for many months and have emailed back and forth with Lorie a few times but never posted myself. I tested positive for Etg once in July of 2004 after 2 1/2 years in Diversion and just now started on probation. I go to my support group every week and recently have seen a rise in positive Etg without drinking in our group and one of the nurses asked me to share her story and see what type of feedback I could get, so here goes.

This RN has been in the probation program for 2 years without problem, had gastric bypass surgery mid last year with many complications. Probation decides not to test her because she is in and out of the hospital and did recieve pain medication which they were aware of. She is now doing much better and has lost a significant amount of weight. Has now started being tested again and recently all her Etg's have been positive without drinking, even her probation monitor does not believe she has been drinking. So she goes to see Dr. Vonsteiff who has seen her, and many other RN's in the program, before. He is the Drug and Alcohol Rehab program director for a major hospital. This doc decides to call the board and is then given a number for the lab who did the test. After several minutes he returns to the exam room very upset and tells this nurse that the lab testing our urines is not certified. He then asks her to wait because he wants to make another call, so she does. After 30 min he comes back and states he called his private attorney who would like to take on the case and requests that all the RN's that have tested positive in our group contact him.

So needless to say she is a little overwhelmed and doesn't know what to do. Now, from reading all these posts it is my understanding that only a couple labs do our Etg testing, is this correct? She did not have the name of the lab when I spoke with her.

Also I am assuming that at least a few of you have already checked on these labs and would have already been aware if they were not certified?

Also one of the other nurses was wondering if Etg could be fat stored and due to her recent weight loss could have caused her positives??

We are finding it difficult to believe that these labs would not be certified.

Any input???

Thanks for reading

Dani

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Hi Dani, There was an interesting article in the WSJ last week about

people picking up different addictions post by-pass surgery. One in

particlular was alcoholism. The article explained how the

metabolism of alcohol was different after the surgery with much

quicker and greater affects. I would think this was the same with

even the small amounts in foods, etc. This might be at least

something to check out. The article can probably be retrieved from

the WSJ web site. I know there is someone else in the group that

had a positive after by-pass surgery....I doubt if it is just a

coincidence! I would suggest all those with false positives join

our group....the stronger in numbers we are, the bigger voice we

have in having the way this test is used changed!

>

> hi everyone, my name is Dani and I'm a RN in Northern CA. Have

been following these posts for many months and have emailed back and

forth with Lorie a few times but never posted myself. I tested

positive for Etg once in July of 2004 after 2 1/2 years in Diversion

and just now started on probation. I go to my support group every

week and recently have seen a rise in positive Etg without drinking

in our group and one of the nurses asked me to share her story and

see what type of feedback I could get, so here goes.

> This RN has been in the probation program for 2 years without

problem, had gastric bypass surgery mid last year with many

complications. Probation decides not to test her because she is in

and out of the hospital and did recieve pain medication which they

were aware of. She is now doing much better and has lost a

significant amount of weight. Has now started being tested again and

recently all her Etg's have been positive without drinking, even her

probation monitor does not believe she has been drinking. So she

goes to see Dr. Vonsteiff who has seen her, and many other RN's in

the program, before. He is the Drug and Alcohol Rehab program

director for a major hospital. This doc decides to call the board

and is then given a number for the lab who did the test. After

several minutes he returns to the exam room very upset and tells

this nurse that the lab testing our urines is not certified. He

then asks her to wait because he wants to make another call, so she

does.

> After 30 min he comes back and states he called his private

attorney who would like to take on the case and requests that all

the RN's that have tested positive in our group contact him.

> So needless to say she is a little overwhelmed and doesn't know

what to do. Now, from reading all these posts it is my

understanding that only a couple labs do our Etg testing, is this

correct? She did not have the name of the lab when I spoke with her.

> Also I am assuming that at least a few of you have already

checked on these labs and would have already been aware if they were

not certified?

> Also one of the other nurses was wondering if Etg could be fat

stored and due to her recent weight loss could have caused her

positives??

> We are finding it difficult to believe that these labs would not

be certified.

> Any input???

> Thanks for reading

> Dani

>

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> >

> > hi everyone, my name is Dani and I'm a RN in Northern CA. Have

> been following these posts for many months and have emailed back

and

> forth with Lorie a few times but never posted myself. I tested

> positive for Etg once in July of 2004 after 2 1/2 years in

Diversion

> and just now started on probation. I go to my support group every

> week and recently have seen a rise in positive Etg without drinking

> in our group and one of the nurses asked me to share her story and

> see what type of feedback I could get, so here goes.

> > This RN has been in the probation program for 2 years without

> problem, had gastric bypass surgery mid last year with many

> complications. Probation decides not to test her because she is in

> and out of the hospital and did recieve pain medication which they

> were aware of. She is now doing much better and has lost a

> significant amount of weight. Has now started being tested again

and

> recently all her Etg's have been positive without drinking, even

her

> probation monitor does not believe she has been drinking. So she

> goes to see Dr. Vonsteiff who has seen her, and many other RN's in

> the program, before. He is the Drug and Alcohol Rehab program

> director for a major hospital. This doc decides to call the board

> and is then given a number for the lab who did the test. After

> several minutes he returns to the exam room very upset and tells

> this nurse that the lab testing our urines is not certified. He

> then asks her to wait because he wants to make another call, so she

> does.

> > After 30 min he comes back and states he called his private

> attorney who would like to take on the case and requests that all

> the RN's that have tested positive in our group contact him.

> > So needless to say she is a little overwhelmed and doesn't know

> what to do. Now, from reading all these posts it is my

> understanding that only a couple labs do our Etg testing, is this

> correct? She did not have the name of the lab when I spoke with

her.

> > Also I am assuming that at least a few of you have already

> checked on these labs and would have already been aware if they

were

> not certified?

> > Also one of the other nurses was wondering if Etg could be fat

> stored and due to her recent weight loss could have caused her

> positives??

> > We are finding it difficult to believe that these labs would

not

> be certified.

> > Any input???

> > Thanks for reading

> > Dani

> >

>There was also a talk show on and it escapes which one it was that

discussed it the other day as far as gastric bypass issues went with

alcohol;..Ill aso add at one of my aa womans group there are 3 women

that also were expressing alcohol but I do not beleive that the were

in a position to be subjected to ETG..Ill go next week and see what I

can garner.There is also a woman that is a nurse that was forced to

go ..Ill check on her as well.and will give her info..we do need to

expand our base here i feel ..we could post at the law forums too..I

want to get out of my head with this and share .Lorie thank you again

for your continued participation her..and you have alot to offer.

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Well I went to my nurses group last evening and this poor nurse has had another positive Etg without drinking, this makes five in a row, needless to say she is not doing well. We all discussed this at length and thought that if maybe she went into a controlled environment for 2 weeks with 24 hr supervision and no access to the outside she could get some proof. She could have urine testing done twice a day with a blood alcohol level every day. She would also be supervised taking antabuse every day. I also mentioned the test to determine if she is a hyperproducer and she would really like to do that but I'm not familiar with the test and neither is her doc, how can she get this done??? I am sending her info on this site so she can get better info and more feedback. Lorie I will email you directly with this docs name and number, I think he would be very receptive to speaking with you. Also she did have a 40 min

conversation with the docs attorney who feels this would be very lengthy and to costly to pursue. DaniLorie Garlick <lorieg@...> wrote: I was just trying to figure out who is responsible. I've heard the "My hands are tied" before in this mess....From DEC members. Which leaves me wondering....Whose hands are UNTIED and who is calling the shots? The labs and Compassvision/TPAs, I'm convinced. There are a lot of you CA RN's on this site. They allow public input at board

meetings. Why don't you ask for some answers & ask for this issue to be placed on a meeting agenda? Lorie New story hi everyone, my name is Dani and I'm a RN in Northern CA. Have been following these posts for many months and have emailed back and forth with Lorie a few times but never posted myself. I tested positive for Etg once in July of 2004 after 2 1/2 years in Diversion and just now started on probation. I go to my support group every week and recently have seen a rise in positive Etg without drinking in our group and one of the nurses asked me to share her story and see what type of feedback I could get, so here goes. This RN has been in the probation program for 2 years without problem, had gastric bypass surgery mid last year with many complications. Probation decides not to test her because she is in and out of the hospital and did recieve pain medication which they were aware of. She is now doing much better and has lost a

significant amount of weight. Has now started being tested again and recently all her Etg's have been positive without drinking, even her probation monitor does not believe she has been drinking. So she goes to see Dr. Vonsteiff who has seen her, and many other RN's in the program, before. He is the Drug and Alcohol Rehab program director for a major hospital. This doc decides to call the board and is then given a number for the lab who did the test. After several minutes he returns to the exam room very upset and tells this nurse that the lab testing our urines is not certified. He then asks her to wait because he wants to make another call, so she does. After 30 min he comes back and states he called his private attorney who would like to take on the case and requests that all the RN's that have tested positive in our group contact him. So needless to say she is a little overwhelmed and doesn't know what to do. Now,

from reading all these posts it is my understanding that only a couple labs do our Etg testing, is this correct? She did not have the name of the lab when I spoke with her. Also I am assuming that at least a few of you have already checked on these labs and would have already been aware if they were not certified? Also one of the other nurses was wondering if Etg could be fat stored and due to her recent weight loss could have caused her positives?? We are finding it difficult to believe that these labs would not be certified. Any input??? Thanks for reading Dani

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The controlled environment sounds good. I can only say that I've done it twice now, I've tested positive both times, and my case still lies in the hands of the AG office, pending a revocation hearing. License suspended in the meantime, as my positive EtGs have me labeled a danger to the public.

If she's going to do the rehab thing, I can give her some info on setting up the testing. Also, she needs to document everything where she goes, or she'll be subject to repeating it, as I was. Here's a link to Dr. Skipper's 'hyperproducer protocol': http://ethylglucuronide.homestead.com/Ididntdrink.pdf. She might also consider contacting him (via his website) to see what his thoughts are about her case. Hope she joins our little group here!

Lorie

New story

hi everyone, my name is Dani and I'm a RN in Northern CA. Have been following these posts for many months and have emailed back and forth with Lorie a few times but never posted myself. I tested positive for Etg once in July of 2004 after 2 1/2 years in Diversion and just now started on probation. I go to my support group every week and recently have seen a rise in positive Etg without drinking in our group and one of the nurses asked me to share her story and see what type of feedback I could get, so here goes.

This RN has been in the probation program for 2 years without problem, had gastric bypass surgery mid last year with many complications. Probation decides not to test her because she is in and out of the hospital and did recieve pain medication which they were aware of. She is now doing much better and has lost a significant amount of weight. Has now started being tested again and recently all her Etg's have been positive without drinking, even her probation monitor does not believe she has been drinking. So she goes to see Dr. Vonsteiff who has seen her, and many other RN's in the program, before. He is the Drug and Alcohol Rehab program director for a major hospital. This doc decides to call the board and is then given a number for the lab who did the test. After several minutes he returns to the exam room very upset and tells this nurse that the lab testing our urines is not certified. He then asks her to wait because he wants to make another call, so she does. After 30 min he comes back and states he called his private attorney who would like to take on the case and requests that all the RN's that have tested positive in our group contact him.

So needless to say she is a little overwhelmed and doesn't know what to do. Now, from reading all these posts it is my understanding that only a couple labs do our Etg testing, is this correct? She did not have the name of the lab when I spoke with her.

Also I am assuming that at least a few of you have already checked on these labs and would have already been aware if they were not certified?

Also one of the other nurses was wondering if Etg could be fat stored and due to her recent weight loss could have caused her positives??

We are finding it difficult to believe that these labs would not be certified.

Any input???

Thanks for reading

Dani

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