Re: Cold sweats

[Guest guest]

Pam,

Have you considered babesia?

I had the symptoms of cold sweats for years, and didn't know it was

babesia.

I took artemisia and bone set tea, as prescribed by Buhner, and my

symptoms cleared up in a week. I know not everyone has such quick results.

Hope you find a remedy.

ellen

>

> Hi all

>

> I have just had a horrible 2 days being very cold and yet having some

> nasty sweats at the same time with nil energy. This is very unusual

> for me. It followed a good week when I might have overdone things a

> bit on the previous day. I also had a very mild sore, red throat.

>

> I am wondering whether it could have been a herx cos I have been on the

> herbs for a month. Alternatively it could just have been an adrenal

> symptoms cos I have 45 out of 63 of the symptoms of s' disease.

>

> Pam

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Pam:

Isn't it interesting HOW our bodies " talk " to us?

I find little or NO herxing on HERBS. And only some on abx. Herbs, IF we

are taking BUhner's Protocol, are meant to get us to feeling BETTER, not worse.

Very little killing with herbs. THe Spirochetes are still there, but we try to

make them happy. THEN they won't hurt us. They certainly have us outnumbered,

so we need to TRY to be at peace with them.

OVERDOING it is NOT the way. AND that is easier said than done, in my

experience. We feel so good all of a sudden that we can hardly contain

ourselves, and we start kicking up our heels and doing the jitterbug, (or

whatever). ;o)

I felt really good yesterday, until I pushed till about 2 this morning. NOW

today, though my Lyme arthritis is not bad at all today, my brain fog is quite

bad. COurse, I felt so good that I didn't encapsulate any more Devil's Claw,

and THAT is THE HERB of choice for me for brain fog and vision problems. As a

matter of fact I am going right now that I am thinking of it, to make up a

bottle, even though I have a dozen things I would rather be doing.

Take care of yourself, no one else will.

Jim.

###

doggy532001 <doggy532001@...> wrote:

Hi all

I have just had a horrible 2 days being very cold and yet having some

nasty sweats at the same time with nil energy. This is very unusual

for me. It followed a good week when I might have overdone things a

bit on the previous day. I also had a very mild sore, red throat.

I am wondering whether it could have been a herx cos I have been on the

herbs for a month. Alternatively it could just have been an adrenal

symptoms cos I have 45 out of 63 of the symptoms of s' disease.

Pam

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Hi...sounds like Babesia (inappropriate sweating) plus perhaps

Bartonella (sore throat). I would try to se a LLMD who does clinical

diagnosis. All Best Wishes, Muriel

[ ] Cold sweats

Hi all

I have just had a horrible 2 days being very cold and yet having some

nasty sweats at the same time with nil energy. This is very unusual

for me. It followed a good week when I might have overdone things a

bit on the previous day. I also had a very mild sore, red throat.

I am wondering whether it could have been a herx cos I have been on the

herbs for a month. Alternatively it could just have been an adrenal

symptoms cos I have 45 out of 63 of the symptoms of s' disease.

Pam

[Guest guest]

Pam, I've heard somewhere that the spirochetes are on a 28 day cycle; so

your having been on the herbs for a month might be just the time you

would get a herx. It seems to me that the longer I've been on the herbs,

the less 'cycling' I do, or at least they are milder down times.

I disagree with Jim that we dont' kill the spirochetes. Most of the core

protocol herbs have some spirochete killing properties. They also have

other properties, but the keete killing is there too.

jo

[Guest guest]

JO:

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.

You will NEVER KILL all the spirochetes. SO IF you disagree with ME on that

you are disagreeing with Harrod Buhner, also.

LISTEN to his latest CD from his seminar in Massachusetts, last month.

IT is SUPER.

Buhner doesn't even CARE IF he kills the Spirochetes. He is TRYING to make

THEM happy. THEN we can co-exist WITH THEM.

Go to Planet Thrive, also, and see what he says about all this.

I personally don't CARE if you disagree with me. Just so you don't try to

confuse people here, on BUHNER'S PROTOCOLS.

Jim.

###

wyomin@... wrote:

Pam, I've heard somewhere that the spirochetes are on a 28 day cycle;

so

your having been on the herbs for a month might be just the time you

would get a herx. It seems to me that the longer I've been on the herbs,

the less 'cycling' I do, or at least they are milder down times.

I disagree with Jim that we dont' kill the spirochetes. Most of the core

protocol herbs have some spirochete killing properties. They also have

other properties, but the keete killing is there too.

jo

[Guest guest]

>

> Pam, I've heard somewhere that the spirochetes are on a 28 day cycle;

so

> your having been on the herbs for a month might be just the time you

> would get a herx. It seems to me that the longer I've been on the

herbs,

> the less 'cycling' I do, or at least they are milder down times.

>

> I disagree with Jim that we dont' kill the spirochetes. Most of the

core

> protocol herbs have some spirochete killing properties. They also have

> other properties, but the keete killing is there too.

>

> jo

>

Hi Jo

Thanks for that information, I feel sure it was either a herx from the

herbs or possibly cos I have been back on Nystatin to kill off the

yeasts, or a combo of both.

I thought I read in Buhner's book that all the Core Protocol herbs had

spirochete-killing properties.

I am hoping to get a MELISSA test for borrelia done this week, I hope

it shows that I do have this problem cos if not it is probable that I

have 's disease and won't ever get any better than how I an now.

BW

Pam

[Guest guest]

Pam, etal:

There are many of the herbs that are Antispirochetal. However THAT is NOT

the main function of the herbs according to Buhner. He has changed his view on

some of the herbs since writing the book, especially at it pertains to us

Lymies.

The main function of the herbs is to " feel " better, and to build our immune

systems to fight what is necessary and live in harmony with the rest, as well as

can be expected.'

You need MORE than just his book also. He has an excellent tape out right

now, from his east coast seminar. In it, he states that ANdrographis IS NOT the

" right " herb for Lyme. He hasn't been able, yet, to find this " right " herb.

Andro was the closest he could come at the time. Stephania may work just as

well for some folks, maybe even better. I take both.

also made the Statement about killing ketes: THat he doesn't even

care. Get the CD, don't take MY word for it.

I stand by my statements, that you will NEVER kill ALL the ketes. We need to

learn HOW to live with them. Soon, almost ALL people will have to. Don't

believe me, just wait.

Jim.

###

Hi Jo

Thanks for that information, I feel sure it was either a herx from the

herbs or possibly cos I have been back on Nystatin to kill off the

yeasts, or a combo of both.

I thought I read in Buhner's book that all the Core Protocol herbs had

spirochete-killing properties.

I am hoping to get a MELISSA test for borrelia done this week, I hope

it shows that I do have this problem cos if not it is probable that I

have 's disease and won't ever get any better than how I an now.

BW

Pam

[Guest guest]

, I have just started taking my Levo at night and I'm now

suffering from insomnia instead of dizzy spells during the day.

>

> Hi Sheila and all, I'm counting on someone to give me some answers, as

> I sure am at the end of my wisdom..... I am Hashimoto's and on

> Levothyroxin (by now 100 mcg/day) since February this year. Some of my

> many hypothyroid symptoms have improved - yet none have vanished. I

> cope. - I am normal weight (60 kg), postmenopausal (or so I am told) a

[Guest guest]

,

You are still under dosed. Do you have test results?

Chuck

>

> I'm counting on someone to give me some answers, as I sure am at the end

> of my wisdom.....

>

> I am Hashimoto's and on Levothyroxin (by now 100 mcg/day) since February

> this year. Some of my many hypothyroid symptoms have improved - yet none

> have vanished. I cope. - I am normal weight (60 kg), postmenopausal (or

> so I am told) and have been suffering extremely badly from hot flushes

> for the past 10 years. Those hot flushes have now reduced drastically

> (although I still get them), but now cold sweats have taken their place.

> I used to wake up several times during the night, having a hot flush

> - now I'm increasingly waking up nearly every hour, dripping wet, from

> cold sweats - not sure which was preferable.

>

> My brain works slowly ... so after several months I began to notice

> something... every morning, after taking my thyroxine at 5.30 am (I set

> the alarm, coz my dog gets his thyroid pill at that time) I sank into a

> blissful " dry " sleep for the next few hours....

> I started to experiment. About a week ago I decided to take my thyroxine

> at bedtime (around 11pm-ish) instead of 5am .... and I now sleep like a

> baby ! No lying awake, staring at the ceiling, no sweats .... just

> blissful *dry* refreshing sleep. Great, I thought - this is the answer

> .... but like most things in life, nothing is straight forward -

> now I get those blooming cold sweats during the day !! :-s I feel

> totally fine one moment, and the next I start perspiring (and that is

> putting it mildly). I watch with growing frustration as my face, arms,

> legs - my whole body - gets covered in cold sweat and am mopping myself

> dry for the next 5 minutes. This happens several times during the day -

> perhaps every 2 hours or so..... *Please, somebody, tell me WHY ? *

>

> a very frustrated

> (- ...oh, and my adrenals appear well supported with Dr.

> 's Adrenal Dynamite - have tried NAE for over a year, but did not

> work for me.

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

>

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5:18 PM

>

[Guest guest]

***Do you have test results?

Hello Chuck,

Yes, I do... but the last ones were taken in May, when I was still on 75 mcg L-thyroxine. I've been on 100 mcg since June.

I was diagnosed hypoT last Feb. - hope the table comes out readable.....

Feb. 08 (b4 thyroxine) May 08 (on 75mcg)

TSH (0.3 - 5.0) 7.3 2.5

FT4 (9.0-24.0) 13.6 15.9

FT3 (3.5-6.5) 5.2 4.2

TPO (0-100) 196 278

TgAA not measured

- all other autoantibodies negative (AMA,ANA,GPC,LMA,SMA,IFA,TTG)

Ferritin (?) 248 -

Vit B12 (220 - 900) 582 ng/L 712

Cortisol 9 am (no norm given) 353

Prolactin (<700) 150

FSH (no norm given) 102

LH (no norm given) 36

I too believe that I am underdosed. I have tried 125 mcg off my own butt for a couple of weeks - feels not much different. I have reduced again for now, because I am about to see my GP soon, and he will do new blood tests .... and I wanted a "true" reading.

I am aware that my prolactin is way too low - but have been told my the endo that this is "normal" for postmenopausal women. When I asked about the flushes, he told me that this "happens" during menopause.... When I asked "which is it? -menopausal or postmenopausal"? , I got no answer....

I am suspecting that my T3's are skewed because I have positive TPO ???

I know that for optimal health both FT3 and FT4 should be near the upper norm - so yes, you are correct, I am still undermedicated - but will more synthetic T4 be the answer, or do I need T3? I would love to switch to Armour, but my GP threw his arms up in horror, and my GP won't hear of it. I asked for T3, but my endo declined - apparently, I am converting, he says .... Hmmmmm

Any suggestions? ;o) - I could really do with some convincing arguments.... - maybe I should also mention that I have (and have had for years) a fast heartbeat - usually 80-100....

[Guest guest]

,

You wrote:

>

> Feb. 08 (b4 thyroxine) May 08

(on 75mcg)

> TSH (0.3 - 5.0) 7.3 2.5

> FT4 (9.0-24.0) 13.6 15.9

> FT3 (3.5-6.5) 5.2 4.2

>

The antibodies show you have Hashi's and your thyroid output will be

changing, although you must be near the end of that dance. And, yes, as

you said, active antibodies will also drive T3 down. I would suggest

more T4 for the moment, rather than start a fight with your providers.

Get the TSH below 2.0 or maybe even lower. Then, if you still have

symptoms, you have a good argument for adding T3 to the mix.

If the T4 is going to work, you should be close. Relief, at least from

the hypoT may be just around the corner. If not, you may have to battle

your docs. You may still have some sweats/flashes, but they should

reduce when you are euthyroid.

Best,

Chuck

[Guest guest]

Hi

As your cold sweats have been bothering you for so long I would definitely talk about this to your doctor. You should not be having these for no reason. A cold sweat can be your body's response to a serious illness, anxiety or severe pain. do you have any symptoms of lightheadedness or chest and stomach pains. Do you notice a change in your body odour, if so it may be a sign of certain medical conditions. Apparently a fruity smell, for example, may be a sign of diabetes, and an ammonia smell could indicate liver or kidney disease..

Cold sweats can correspond with high blood pressure too. Do you have any palpitations? Have you had some particularly severe stress lately.I would keep a record of when these happen, what time of day, how long they last, anything you can think of that could be associated like eating or unusual events. The first thing you might think of is that it could be menopause, but as you are post menopause this is ruled out.

Interesting that you are yet another person who has found that taking L-thyroxine at night helps you sleep.

have you any recent blood tests you could show us? Also, you might have oestrogen dominance as many women who are hypothyroid do, and it might help if you purchased some Progesterone Cream to help balance your sex hormones.

Luv - Sheila

About a week ago I decided to take my thyroxine at bedtime (around 11pm-ish) instead of 5am .... and I now sleep like a baby ! No lying awake, staring at the ceiling, no sweats .... just blissful *dry* refreshing sleep. Great, I thought - this is the answer .... but like most things in life, nothing is straight forward - now I get those blooming cold sweats during the day !! I feel totally fine one moment, and the next I start perspiring (and that is putting it mildly). I watch with growing frustration as my face, arms, legs - my whole body - gets covered in cold sweat and am mopping myself dry for the next 5 minutes. This happens several times during the day - perhaps every 2 hours or so..... Please, somebody, tell me WHY ?

a

..

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[Guest guest]

How long have you been taking your L-thyroxine at night Cassie. the usual reports when people change over from daytime dosing to night time is that they sleep so much better.

Luv - Sheila

, I have just started taking my Levo at night and I'm nowsuffering from insomnia instead of dizzy spells during the day.

..

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[Guest guest]

Chuck - you cannot tell a person they are "you are still underdosed". How do you know that? How do you that there is not an underlying cause for not being able to get the full benefit from her L-thyroxine that she should be? It seems that to you, everything is black and white, because you have "the science" behind you, so that if the thyroxine isn't working, she cannot be taking enough. This is not always the case, and on this particular forum, we try to help our members find out why . If only life was that simple.

Sheila

,You are still under dosed. Do you have test results?Chuck> I am Hashimoto's and on Levothyroxin (by now 100 mcg/day) since February > this year. Some of my many hypothyroid symptoms have improved - yet none > have vanished. I cope. - I am normal weight (60 kg), postmenopausal (or > so I am told) and have been suffering extremely badly from hot flushes > for the past 10 years. Those hot flushes have now reduced drastically > (although I still get them), but now cold sweats have taken their place.

..

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[Guest guest]

Hi

I can relate to this, I was having hot and cold sweats just as you

describe not related to the menopause on anything under 200mcg.

Chris

>

> Hi Sheila and all, I'm counting on someone to give me some

answers, as

I used to wake up

> several times during the night, having a hot flush - now I'm

> increasingly waking up nearly every hour, dripping wet, from cold

sweats

> - not sure which was preferable. I watch with growing

> frustration as my face, arms, legs - my whole body - gets covered

in

> cold sweat and am mopping myself dry for the next 5 minutes. This

> happens several times during the day - perhaps every 2 hours or

so.....

> Please, somebody, tell me WHY ? a very frustrated >

[Guest guest]

Hi all,

I know I will probably be saying something that

others may not agree with but I can only state my own case and symptoms……………..I

had exactly the same symptoms – it was awful………………I

have been on HRT for years now (over 20 years) and thought I would try to stop

taking it by taking every other day etc……….I had awful cold

sweats – went on for weeks and I got dreadful bone and hip pain too, in

fact it was because of the bone pain I decided to try HRT again and the cold

sweats stopped with the bone pain within hours. I had thought at first I

must be either under or over taking thyroid meds but it wasn’t. I then

did some research and discovered that whilst HRT is a ‘nasty’ for

some people for many reasons (personally think it has had a bad press when it

can have benefit in some cases but obviously this is dependent on a person’s

own medical and family history) and discovered that oestrogen is one of the

adrenal hormones – so it must help with my adrenal issues. However I am ‘lucky’

because I do not have to take progesterone as I had a hysterectomy and I only have

to take oestrogen – progesterone made me ill. I swear by HRT. Just my

opinion though………….………don’t

shout at me (in jest!)

Kind regards,

Mandy

[Guest guest]

Just shows Mandy, one size doesn't fit everybody, we ARE all different. Good that you have found the size that fits you at last. Keep up the good work. This is why it is good to get some blood work done, especially the sex hormones.

Luv - Sheila

I then did some research and discovered that whilst HRT is a ‘nasty’ for some people for many reasons (personally think it has had a bad press when it can have benefit in some cases but obviously this is dependent on a person’s own medical and family history) and discovered that oestrogen is one of the adrenal hormones – so it must help with my adrenal issues. However I am ‘lucky’ because I do not have to take progesterone as I had a hysterectomy and I only have to take oestrogen – progesterone made me ill. I swear by HRT. Just my opinion though………….………don’t shout at me (in jest!)

Kind regards,

Mandy

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[Guest guest]

Sheila,

You wrote:

>

> Chuck - you cannot tell a person they are " you are still underdosed " ....

It's called logic. Her dose is far below the usual full replacement for

a woman. Her symptoms are all characteristic of hypoT, i.e. too low a

dose. It is always possible that there is some complicating underlying

condition at work, but Occam's Razor dictates trying the simplest and

most direct solution first. That would be to increase the dose.

That logic is also consistent with the fact that the vast majority of

hypoT people titrate cleanly to full relief of symptoms, with none of

the hidden underlying conditions that you seem to think afflict everyone.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

Hi

Well, your results did show improvement from the February readings, but it is a little concerning that your Free T3 has dropped and it will be interesting to see where your FT3 is now when you get your new TFT's. Both your FT3 and FT4 when taking L-thyroxine alone should be in the upper third of the reference range, but see what your new results show and ask your GP for a trial of an increase if he doesn't suggest it. Your Ferritin reading is quite high (I am assuming that the reference range is somewhere in the region of 20 to 200 (for women) seems they don't have one. I know that Chuck said it is so wide because they take in other iron tests at the same time, but what do you work off without a ref. range.?

Don't forget you should NOT take your L-thyroxine on the day of your test as it might give an incorrect reading. Taking the 125 mcgs for only a couple of weeks would not really be enough time to decide whether this dose would make you feel better or not, you really needed to be on it for at least 6 weeks, and even more for your body to get the full effect. Your endocrinologists remarks regarding menopause are typical of a lot of those who don't understand thyroid disease, I bet you will find his specialty is diabetes.

Without another blood test since you have been on an increased dose, it is really hard to recommend anything right now .

Luv - Sheila

Any suggestions? ;o) - I could really do with some convincing arguments.... - maybe I should also mention that I have (and have had for years) a fast heartbeat - usually 80-100....

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[Guest guest]

Nu

My dog is on the same dose as me, in fact I've given her some of

mine when hers have run out. Would love to know if they are

equivalent.

Chris

>

>

>

Just look at our doggy friends - my dog, who weighs 34

> kg, gets 1.6 mg per day ... that is 1600 mcg of thyroxine per

day !!

> I weigh 60 kg, and I get 100 mcg = 0.1 mg per day.... I know,

they have

> a different metabolism, but still....

>

> Love,

>

> xx

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Nu

>

> My dog is on the same dose as me, in fact I've given her some of

> mine when hers have run out. Would love to know if they are

> equivalent.

Hi

As far as I know, yes, the ingredients are equivalent and if your dog

is on your dosage, chances are that she could be undermedicated. Can

you email me privately, please - it's OT on here, but I'd be very

interested to hear more about it.

Thanks,

[Guest guest]

Hi

>

> This one was a blood cortisol level test at 9 am... that's the

usual one

> doctors do. I found out today that the ref range for this

particular lab

> is 140 - 690.... mine was 353 - so, I agree, not brilliant. But

then,

> if I understand this correctly, blood cortisol levels change at the

> drop of a hat anyway if anything stressful happens.... so what use

is

> measuring blood cortisol?

M: No use whatsoever I don't think.

> I did have a salivary adrenal profile a year ago, which I messed

up....

> or perhaps not. Depends how one looks at it. In my brain fogged

state I

> literally sat on my butt all day reading a book and watching the

clock

> go by, so that I would not miss spitting in the right tube at the

> appointed hour... I completely forgot that the whole point of the

> exercise is to *stress* yourself on that day, so you get an idea how

> your system copes with stress .... [8-|]

M: Well that is news to mel, I did exactly the same. Mind you I was

not capable of getting off my butt at that point in time. What's new? "

> However, at least I have a nicely coloured graph now, showing that

my

> adrenals were pushing out a lot of cortisol first thing in the

morning

> and another decent lot in the afternoon... at midday though and at

> midnight I run on empty.

M: So what were the numbers and ranges ? Were you advised on

how to proceed at this point by anyone other than your NHS docs? You

mentioned that the NAE was not sufficent to help you.

So as long as all runs nice and smoothly in my

> life, I am on top of the world.... if someone says " booo " to me

though,

> I break into a sweat and get a panic attack.... []

It does sound to me like your are not on enough adrenal support

.

> Over the past 10 years I've had to cope with a lot of stress - I

believe

> that my adrenal glands have been over-stimulated during those

years, and

> now my levels are 'dropping through' at the slightest stressful

> situation.

M: that's where I find myself recently too. Keep having adrenal

crashes from stress, physical or emotional.

>

> My blood test result in February showed that my K:Na ratio was very

low

> (26) ... too low for comfort.

M: What does this mean? Not familiar.

My potassium was high, my sodium low...

> and this is a sure sign for adrenal trouble

M: Are you supplementing with Celtic seasalt or similar?

Mo

[Guest guest]

Hi and Sheila,

I use Serenity, but the cold sweats are no better and I've been using

it now for about 4 months, but I'll carry on using it just to see if

it takes longer to work.

Luv Dee

>

> - there are many members here who have added progesterone

cream to balance up their sex hormones and had quite dramatic effects.

I believe that Gill is one such person. The best cream to buy I

believe is Serenity, but the girls on here will tell you more about

this. It is definitely worth giving it a try, and it could have a

dramatic effect on your hot and cold sweats.

>

> Luv - sheila

>

[Guest guest]

She had difficulties at night that were alleviated by taking the

medication at night. But that created a problem with how she felt in

the day time. So I guessed that taking the medicine BOTH times MIGHT

help with both day and night symptoms.

As usual from me, an uneducated opinion. But one that has a certain

logic [but may not work]. It's just a suggestion of something that

MIGHT work; however, I can present no credible research to support it!

[ggg]

..

..

>

> Posted by: " sheilaturner " sheilaturner@...

> <mailto:sheilaturner@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cold%20sweats>

> campaigner77 <campaigner77>

>

>

> Mon Sep 1, 2008 2:08 am (PDT)

>

> Hi

>

> Why would you split the dose of L-thyroxine?

>

> Other causes, apart from the thyroxine dose being too low could be

> partial response to the single sysnthetic thyroxine replacement,

> adrenal fatigue or exhaustion, failure of the 5 dei-iodinase enzyme,

> food allergies, presence of systemic candidiasis, hormone inbalances,

> low ferritin, low Vitamin D, mercury toxicity from amalgam fillings etc.

>

> The business of finding the right medication and the dose that makes

> you well can be complicated for some of us.

>

> Sheila

[Guest guest]

MODERATED TO REMOVE MOST OR PREVIOUS MESSAGE. - LUV - SHEILA

_______________________________________

You are actually over the range at 4 pm and midnight in this ASI

?

When you weaned yourself off the NAE did you still have symptoms?

I am just wondering, as I said, if your adrenals might be under-

supported here.

Do you do the Dr Rind charting at all? This would help established

whether your issue is adrenal or thyroid or both?

My sodium was top of the range last two times I got it tested btw.

Don't know what that means

Where do you get your Adrenal Dynamite from as Sheila

recommended it to me. How did it help compared with the NAE? I am

taking both NAE and h/c as per Dr Peatfield's recent suggestion.

Mo

at midday though and at midnight I run on empty

1. Sample 18.8 (12-22) 2.

> Sample 5.0 (4-8) 3. Sample 8.0 (3-7)

4. Sample 1.4 (1-3)

> on NAE - which was fine at first, but then I needed more and more...

>